47greyfox Loc: on the edge of the Colorado front range

We're not talking about any V-twin motorcycle. Examples of H-D patent lawsuits are not difficult to find.

https://www.iposgoode.ca/2021/07/harley-davidson-wins-yet-another-trademark-infringement-suit/

https://cisloandthomas.com/harley-davidson-wins-19-2-million-in-statutory-damages/

PHRubin Loc: Nashville TN USA

Interesting...

cjc2 Loc: Hellertown PA

It all has to do with patents my friend. Best of luck.

amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

Don't believe everything you see on the Internet.

"Ordinary Filmmaker" has a bad habit of making stuff up, of presenting his own theories as facts. In this case he's simply repeating what he read at Petapixel. https://petapixel.com/2022/08/29/viltrox-says-canon-has-demanded-they-stop-selling-rf-mount-lenses/

And, frankly, I'm skeptical about that article, too. Canon cannot "demand" any other company not make products simply because they are compatible with Canon cameras. They can sue for patent or trademark infringement, if someone were copying their designs too closely or were making fake Canon products. But if the other company simply avoids copying Canon designs, makes products of their own design and markets them under their own name, Canon would have no legal basis to keep them from offering those products to the public.

In fact...

- Supposedly there was a lawsuit for patent or trademark infringement Canon brought against Samyang/Rokinon.

- The Canon v. Samyang lawsuit supposedly was settled out of court. We don't know the details of the lawsuit or the settlement. It may have been a patent infringement, Samyang using technology that Canon developed and patented. Or it may be something simple like a branding and trademark issue, such as Samyang using a red stripe on their lenses the way Canon does on their L-series. (This is just an example.) Samyang appears to have discontinued making Samyang branded RF mount AF lenses, although some retailers still offer them via special order: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/products/ci/17912/N/4196380428?filters=fct_a_focus-type_5738%3Aautofocus%2Cfct_brand_name%3Arokinon%7Cviltrox%7Cyongnuo%2Cfct_lens-mount_3442%3Acanon-rf.

- However, Samyang continues to offer Rokinon branded RF mount AF lenses. https://rokinon.com/collections/auto-focus?gf_307473=Canon%20RF

- Patent infringement lawsuits aren't all that unusual. In 2018 Samyang/Rokinon was sued over the designs of two lenses that too closely copied Zeiss'. I believe Samyang withdrew those lenses briefly, but they have since returned to the market and can be found selling in both Samyang and Rokinon brands. I don't know if the lenses were redesigned, but externally they don't appear any different than the original versions. The lenses in quiestion were the Samyang XP and Rokinon SP 85mm f/1.2 and 50mm f/1.2 (all manual focus), which Zeiss claimed copied their Batis designs. The oddest thing was that the Zeiss lenses didn't have the same focal lengths or max apertures!

- Viltrox has so far only introduced one AF lens for Canon RF mount, an 85mm f/1.8. In May they announced six additional AF lenses were coming for RF mount "before the end of 2022". I believe these will be full frame: 24mm f/1.8, 35mm f/1.8 and 50mm f/1.8, as well as APS-C: 23mm f/1.4, 33mm f/1.4 and 56mm f/1.4. A 13mm f/1.4 for APS-C is another possibility, or may come later. All these are existing lenses being offered in other mounts (Sony E-mount, Nikon Z-mount, Fujifilm X-mount, etc.

- Five Sigma EF mount lenses are being offered bundled with an EF to RF adapter for use on the Canon R-series. I suspect this is a B&H Photo "store" bundle, not from Sigma, because it uses a Canon EF to RF adapter and I haven't seen it offered at any other retailers. Is Canon threatening B&H Photo, one of their top authorized dealers?

I think it's just a matter of time before the third party lens makers introduce RF mount lenses. The may be having some trouble reverse engineering the RF mount and R-series electronic technology, without stepping on patents. Also keep in mind that there has been a global chip shortage causing all kinds of delays in cameras and lenses. No manufacturer wants to announce a new product, then not be able to actually provide it. That's not good for customer confidence! (Just ask Nikon, who announced their Z9 in Oct. 2021 for a December availability date, but was still fulfilling pre-orders well into 2022 and purportedly is still taking at least two months to fill new orders!)

redlegfrog

I hope they don't. My favorite walk around lens is a Nikon 28-200 3.5 - 5.6. I've got so shaky I need a VR lens but I now realize Nikon will never make one because of the shift to mirrorless.
My only hope is one of the aftermarket lens companies will make one. And soon.

Bbarn Loc: Ohio

I suspect Viltrox's apparent method of reverse engineering a solution that reports their lens as a Canon EF lens led to Canon's actions. Such deception and use of the Canon name is not a suitable approach to reverse engineering.

cjc2 Loc: Hellertown PA

Nikon now makes a 24-200 F4 - F6.3 for the Z format. I own one and it's not bad. It's also very light. Most Z bodies have built-in lens stabilization, so you're good there too! Best of luck.

gwilliams6

The third party lens maker will have second thoughts doing it as long as Canon wont be offering any coding or firmware update help into the future.

You make a long treatise on this, but my contacts at Sigma and Tamron say their RF plans are on hold because of Canon's objections. That is a fact and not something I got from "Ordinary Filmmaker".

I administrate and moderate several worldwide photography Facebook Groups and this has been discussed and verified from our industry contacts. It is not fake news.

Cheers and best to you.

redlegfrog

Thanks,

User ID

Thank you.

User ID

(Download)

Bill_de Loc: US

There have been 3rd party lenses as long as I can remember. But, it seems that since mirrorless has hit the market the number of aftermarket brands is expanding. It could be that these brands are advertising more.

Is there something about lenses for mirrorless cameras that makes them easier to copy?

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steveo52 Loc: Rhode Island and Ocala Florida

delder Loc: Maryland

Sometimes we use TCO
[Total Cost of Ownership]
to compute the actual value of a system. This could weigh down the value proposition of the Cannon system in question.

User ID

Yes if only in the sense that noncoupled lenses are much easier to use with an EVF than with an SLR so that part of the market has obligingly expanded.

When it comes to coupled lenses, things havent changed much over the decades, concerning variety and proliferation.