Indiana Loc: Huntington, Indiana

I have noted with interest that an in-state high end camera store offers several single and multiple session classes on Cell Phone Camera features and usage. Since the camera store doesn't sell cell phones, I suspect they are either hoping to upgrade the photographic interest of the attendee to the dedicated camera market, or, to captivate the education value of the offering for their own edification. Either way, there is an acknowledgement of the cell phone photographic market as a viable alternative to the dedicated camera market.

Ramsay2303

Yes, I think that buying a real camera is always worthy.
I know the differences between them, specifically the price, but like my Mom used to say
Paris always work a mass!

LFingar Loc: Claverack, NY

I didn't omit MFT's just because I didn't specifically mention them. They are part of the growing mirrorless market. I was referring to DSLR's which to almost everyone on the planet are cameras with mirrors and either an APS-C or full frame sensor. Some might argue the point, but walk into any camera store and ask to see their DSLR's and you will almost certainly be shown cameras with those two sensors. My point was that for photographers wanting either of those sensor sizes their choices of new cameras are going to switch from DSLR's to mirrorless.

PierreD

I get it and don't want to be picky, but you initial posting refers to DSLRs being replaced (quote) "by full frame and APS-C mirrorless". My point was that MFT are neither FF nor APS-C mirrorless cameras, yet currently constitute a significant (many would say growing, but I won't go there!) share of the market. I don't spend time in camera stores and so can't discuss your comment that those who do so will for the most part be shown FF or APS-C cameras. This may be true but as we have three sensor sizes, and if, theoretically, the three are equally represented in camera stores, customers are, of course, more likely to be shown a FF or APS-C model than a MFT model.

pocketchange

"DITTO"

joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois

Most people couldn't care less about the so called advantages of stand alone cameras. They don't want to learn photography. They just want an easy way to capture memories and share them...the smart phone does it best.

There may always be enthusiasts that appreciated the "camera" but as the market shifts the economy of scale will be lost driving the prices so high that even the low end will become a luxury item.

How many today would buy a Leica if there were no alternative cameras.

LFingar Loc: Claverack, NY

Why are you so worried about market share? I don't care how many MFT's are sold. My statement had nothing to do with market share. My statement is that DSLR's, universally considered to have a mirror and either an APS-C or FF sensor, will cease to be manufactured by companies like Canon and Nikon. They will be replaced by APS-C and FF mirrorless versions, such as Canon's EOS R. It has nothing to do with MFT sales. Do you understand what I am saying now? It's not about sales, it's about camera design.

markjay

Really -? What do you think the camera companies are innovating that the cell phones cant do ?
In fact - it is just the opposi\te. The cell phones are coming up with all kinds of innovative features that the camera companies cant do. managing depth of field post photo for example.

The camera companies are doomed. It is not a matter of them protecting their core business. How well did that go for Kodak when they were trying to protect their core business.

The phones will eventually take over.

10MPlayer Loc: California

I'm not so sure about no revival. It hasn't hit bottom yet like vinyl records, vacuum tube amplifiers or film photography. But all three of those genres of media are seeing a revival. It will never be like it was but there will always be a market for high end products. It will probably be more of a niche market for the true afficianados who appreciate quality but it won't go away completely.

bananadan

A cautionary tale from the land of profressional audio.

For years the holy grail of pro audio was to come up with digital recordings that captured the full gamut that analog recording tape had achieved. (Think film and digital photos.) First we had eight bit, then 12-bit, then 16-bit . . . until we ended up with 24 bit/192kHz format (and maybe somewhere out there, 48-bit recording.)

The problems with this were two-fold. First, you quickly reach a point of diminishing returns, where the next increment of improvement yields next to nothing in terms of what people can actually hear and distinguish. And secondly, just when you're about to perfect audio recording, the public suddenly accepts (and enjoys) lo-fi recordings that might sicken a studio professional, but sound perfectly great on a car sound system or in headphones.

In that regard, the high-resolution tiny sensor cameras in cell phones seem to meet the needs and expectations of the general public. And on the professional side, you might want to ask yourself just where the visible benefit of ever-denser or larger full-frame sensors might start to become irrelevant for all those other than photographers seeking images to cover the sides of skyscrapers. That's where pro audio has gone; for all intents and purposes, 24-bit A/D conversion at sampling rates of 192kHz get the job done. Once you're up to 46 megapixels or so, there might be precious little benefit for anybody other than a handful of professionals and (dare I say it) fanatics. In that regard, I think we might find 24mp and 48mp sensors coming down in price, while still clearly distinguishing themselves from the limited functionality of cell phone devices. But to think in terms of ever-increasing resolutions might be an illusion; at some point the digital process is quite good enough for the purpose at hand.

markjay

It will not take long before phones have 50mp sensors.
And the software capabilities in phones, and the companies producing these products will come up with ALL the features in a DSLR camera.

15 years ago I had a stereo system that cost $20,000. Today I stream my music from Spotify into a moderately priced amp and speakers. Is it as good? No. Is it more than acceptable? Yes. And I have literally an infinite choice of music.

The high end camera will be used by journalists (sports) , designers, and not much more in another 5-10 years.

photogeneralist Loc: Lopez Island Washington State

"Serious photographers will continue buy DSLR"S" But when photos become so societally pervasive as to become perceptually mired in mediocracy (Witness the ratio of selfies taken compared to serious photographs), who will remain as serious photographers? Flooding daily life with Millions and millions of mediocre photos could dull the senses and thus kill the medium as a means of artistic expression. There goes the market for point and shoot, mirrorless w/ removeable lens , bridge cameras, in fact every photographic tool other than cell phone cameras of ever increasing capability for massive standardized technologically induced blandness. The human element of creativity will be swamped. We are already seeing AI. (Artificial Intelligence) that purports to be able to tell a good photo from a bad one and to be able to improve it by post processing enhancements independently of any human input (except perhaps the original code writer). Camera manufacturer's CEO's should see the writing on the wall and expand into other product lines.

bananadan

It does come down to glass, no? One way that phones can’t defy physics is in the size of their lenses and how much light they can admit. And another is in the size of their sensors no matter how many megapixels they squeeze in to 1/2 or so inches. These will always limit their capabilities no matter how smart their brains and processing become. Will this be good enough for most people? It might even be overkill. Will this satisfy the serious photographer? I seriously doubt it.

bananadan

Camera manufacturers are already selling to an elite. The flood of “good enough”, mediocre photos is already upon us. Billions of selfies and Instagram postings daily. This is not new. But the art of the great photograph persists nonetheless. You know it when you see it.

tommystrat Loc: Bigfork, Montana