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Question about back focusing.
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Feb 4, 2016 11:37:52   #
jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ
 
Linda, most cameras won't take advantage of custom settings like BBF when the camera is in one of the "Auto" modes. They will usually work if you have the mode dial (setting) to A, S, or M but not in anything that is more auto than those settings.

Linda Ewing wrote:
Yes that is exactly what I did, I went to A4 activation, then went into the AF-On, then when I press OK and go back to the A4Activation it says OFF, no matter what I do it goes to the OFF position after I press OK.

I thought the A4 Activation would say ON, perhaps that is what happens, I just don't know, perhaps even the AF-ON is on even though the A4 Activation says off.

Is this something you can help me with or explain.

I am doing a shoot this evening and feel confused to say the least.

Thank you
Yes that is exactly what I did, I went to A4 activ... (show quote)

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Feb 4, 2016 12:00:19   #
Brooklyn-Camera Loc: Brooklyn, New York City
 
I shoot a 7D mark II to shoot sports and have used BBF for a while now and it sure helps. It took a little getting use to but after a while it will become second nature for you. Stick with it once you get your camera set up for BBF, even if sitting your living room take pics of anything using BBF. Practice, practice and do a little more practice! Good luck and let us know how you make out please.

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Feb 4, 2016 12:12:39   #
wingclui44 Loc: CT USA
 
jeep_daddy wrote:
Linda, most cameras won't take advantage of custom settings like BBF when the camera is in one of the "Auto" modes. They will usually work if you have the mode dial (setting) to A, S, or M but not in anything that is more auto than those settings.


BBf is nothing do with Mode, It works on A,S,M and P even Auto, these are exposure controls not focus.

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Feb 4, 2016 12:32:33   #
PVR8 Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
I also have a Nikon 70-300AF-S lens that I was going to use next time out. Since you say that it isn't so good at fast focusing, I might trade it in for a 80-400 and that will give me a little more reach also. Thanks for the info.
CO wrote:
I use 3D tracking and AF-C mode with my Nikons. 3D tracking works great to track birds in flight as long as the lens autofocus can keep up. My Nikon 70-300mm AF-S lens has trouble with that. My Nikon 80-400mm AF-S has better autofocus. I've been impressed how well it can stay locked onto moving objects.

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Feb 4, 2016 12:37:44   #
SharpShooter Loc: NorCal
 
PVR8 wrote:
Good idea, thanks. I just finished watching the youtube video that juicesqueezer was good enough to post a link to. It was an excellent video that explained back button focusing very clearly. I'm going to give it a try


PVR, different cameras allow for different BBF configurations to be set up.
Most of the time, as far as I know, back button and front button is exactly the same with no advantages whatsoever other than personal preferences and affinity. So your friend, other than possibly being able to manipulate the focus-on control better, was not getting any better focus than you were, assuming you have the same cameras.
You'll gain more by knowing exactly how to set up your cameras focus points and which mode works best for that particular situation.
I'm not saying don't use BBF or to not adopt it, just that, that in itself should not be the answer to focus woes! Just saying. ;-)
SS

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Feb 4, 2016 12:45:07   #
PVR8 Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Ditto! I'm so glad that I originally asked the question on this forum. IMHO this is the best photography blog on the net (even though I've only checked out a few other blogs). The folks on here are ultra helpful and supportive. It's a great place to give and get advice, answers, and tips.
CLF wrote:
I would like to thank you all for this discussion. Been wondering how to use and set it and the links made it simple. Thanks for the education. Greg

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Feb 4, 2016 13:22:49   #
PVR8 Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Sharpshooter, from what I've seen on videos regarding bbf, there does seem to be some definite advantages to bbf in most situations. I'll have to give it a try to see if I find any advantages in using it while I'm shooting.
SharpShooter wrote:
PVR, different cameras allow for different BBF configurations to be set up.
Most of the time, as far as I know, back button and front button is exactly the same with no advantages whatsoever other than personal preferences and affinity. So your friend, other than possibly being able to manipulate the focus-on control better, was not getting any better focus than you were, assuming you have the same cameras.
You'll gain more by knowing exactly how to set up your cameras focus points and which mode works best for that particular situation.
I'm not saying don't use BBF or to not adopt it, just that, that in itself should not be the answer to focus woes! Just saying. ;-)
SS
PVR, different cameras allow for different BBF con... (show quote)

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Feb 4, 2016 13:27:32   #
amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA
 
OddJobber wrote:
Back focus bad.
Back button focus good.


OddJobber is probably right... I bet the fellow photographer said "back button focus", not "back focus"... they are very different things.

Back Button Focus (BBF) is a popular sports/action shooting method. It puts the user more in control of when and where the camera focuses. It's mostly used in conjunction with a continuous focusing mode. In fact, BBF allows one to make that their default focus mode and use it for almost anything, which you wouldn't want to do without BBF for several reasons (For example, without BBF a continuous focus mode will cause focus errors if using a "focus, lock and recompose" technique).

All that aside, for fast moving subjects such as you describe, in addition to good techniques and some skill using them, you also need fast focusing and tracking camera and lens. I am not personally familiar with either your camera or lens... However, I have used other Tamron lenses and unless yours is a "USD" model, it probably can't focus and track movement fast enough to keep up with rapidly darting birds in flight. That's a quite challenging subject that even the very best of lenses and cameras will struggle to maintain in focus!

There are other things you can do. I'd suggest setting a rather small aperture to increase depth of field, which makes focus accuracy less critical (but will not blur down busy backgrounds as strongly). Watch that you have a fast enough shutter speed to freeze movement (probably about 1/500 minimum... 1/1000 would be better... unless you actually want motion blur effect, then slower shutter speeds might be used). Pre-focus at a specific distance and then watch for subjects to come within that range and trip the shutter when they do.

Also set your camera on continuous drive, taking bursts of shots to improve your odds that at least one image in each burst will be both in focus and well-composed. Then work at it and take a lot of shots... since you'll have lots of misses and will likely get better with practice.

BBF works just fine with non-continuous focusing modes too... where once focus is achieved it stops and locks.... which is generally only usable with stationary subjects. But the key advantage for sports/action/wildlife photography is that it allows one to use continuous focus mode most of the time... so that one is ready to deal immediately with subjects that are moving or stationary, regardless if they stop or start moving or just continuously do so. Another thing BBF allows you to do is "dodge" obstructions that come between you and a moving subject momentarily.

I've been shooting with various Canon cameras and lenses for over 15 years, film first, and digital since around 2004. I learned BBF with my EOS-3 cameras not long after starting to use them and have employed it nearly all the time on every model I've used since. Actually now about the only time I ever turn it off (to let the camera focus "normally", with half-press of the shutter release button) is when I am loaning the camera to someone who isn't familiar with BBF, unwilling to give it a try and learn to use it. Overall, BBF puts me more in charge of the camera... sort of feels like manual focus control, but with the speed and accuracy of autofocus (which is better in today's cameras than I ever was manually, even tho I was darned good, if I may say so myself).

Give BBF a try with your camera and lens(es)... Don't expect it to solve every problem, though. It takes some practice... plus there are other considerations that effect focus accuracy and additional techniques that might be needed, depending upon the particular situation.

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Feb 4, 2016 13:29:06   #
Mr PC Loc: Austin, TX
 
It's the only way I shoot since a Tony Northrup video that Jerry already listed among other links. The only downside I've found is when you hand your camera to someone to take a picture of you and your friends and you have to explain it to them. It's almost easier to set your camera and lens to manual focus and have them turn the focus ring. This techniques has really paid off in action and wildlife photography for me. Never going back to the half press of the shutter button.

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Feb 4, 2016 13:33:00   #
PVR8 Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Great tutorials Jerry. Thanks!

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Feb 4, 2016 13:40:36   #
PVR8 Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Excellent advice. Thanks!
amfoto1 wrote:
OddJobber is probably right... I bet the fellow photographer said "back button focus", not "back focus"... they are very different things.

Back Button Focus (BBF) is a popular sports/action shooting method. It puts the user more in control of when and where the camera focuses. It's mostly used in conjunction with a continuous focusing mode. In fact, BBF allows one to make that their default focus mode and use it for almost anything, which you wouldn't want to do without BBF for several reasons (For example, without BBF a continuous focus mode will cause focus errors if using a "focus, lock and recompose" technique).

All that aside, for fast moving subjects such as you describe, in addition to good techniques and some skill using them, you also need fast focusing and tracking camera and lens. I am not personally familiar with either your camera or lens... However, I have used other Tamron lenses and unless yours is a "USD" model, it probably can't focus and track movement fast enough to keep up with rapidly darting birds in flight. That's a quite challenging subject that even the very best of lenses and cameras will struggle to maintain in focus!

There are other things you can do. I'd suggest setting a rather small aperture to increase depth of field, which makes focus accuracy less critical (but will not blur down busy backgrounds as strongly). Watch that you have a fast enough shutter speed to freeze movement (probably about 1/500 minimum... 1/1000 would be better... unless you actually want motion blur effect, then slower shutter speeds might be used). Pre-focus at a specific distance and then watch for subjects to come within that range and trip the shutter when they do.

Also set your camera on continuous drive, taking bursts of shots this improves the odds that at least one of them will be both in focus and well-composed. Then work at it and take a lot of shots... since you'll have lots of misses and will probably get better with practice.
OddJobber is probably right... I bet the fellow ph... (show quote)

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Feb 4, 2016 13:57:15   #
sailor2545 Loc: Victoria, BC
 
i have d7000 also.. go to you tube.. will easily show u how 2 do it
PVR8 wrote:
A couple of days ago I was out shooting at a local lake park with some folks in my photography club. We came upon a large flock of birds sitting on the lake shore and some kids starting throwing bread out to feed them. The birds started flying all over the place to grab the bread out of the air. I was shooting with my D200 and a Tamron 18-200 lens. One of the other shooters said that he was using back focus to grab good sharp shots. he told me that by back focusing he was able to speed up his lens. He was shooting with a D610 and I don't remember what lens he was using. My question is, what could I have done to capture some sharp pictures of the birds in flight I don't know much about back focusing and I have never used it. I was shooting in program mode and I would like to know how I should have been shooting to get the best shots. I also have a D7000. Would using that body make any difference. I like the D200 for daylight landscape shooting, but this is the first time I've tried to capture birds in flight. Any tips or advice will be greatly appreciated.
A couple of days ago I was out shooting at a local... (show quote)

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Feb 4, 2016 14:38:53   #
PVR8 Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Will do Sailor. Thanks....
sailor2545 wrote:
i have d7000 also.. go to you tube.. will easily show u how 2 do it

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Feb 4, 2016 14:55:54   #
windshoppe Loc: Arizona
 
Revet wrote:
I have been using BBF for 2 years on AF-C autofocus mode. It took a week or so to fully get the hang of it but once you get used to it, you will never go back.

The ONLY problem with BBF is when you hand your camera to someone else. They just will not get it. You can quickly teach someone to use manual mode when you want to jump into a shot, but teaching someone BBF on the fly just doesn't work. I have U2 set on my D7100 for shutter release focus just for that purpose.


Very true. I just slide the dial over to the little green box when asking someone to shoot. Works well most of the time.

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Feb 4, 2016 15:01:31   #
windshoppe Loc: Arizona
 
wingclui44 wrote:
BBf is nothing do with Mode, It works on A,S,M and P even Auto, these are exposure controls not focus.


I beg to differ. My Canon 5DII goes back to normal shutter button focus on both Auto and CA modes. BBF is deactivated--very handy when asking someone else to take a photo.

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