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Cost of Charging an EV
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Feb 12, 2024 23:04:53   #
chrissybabe Loc: New Zealand
 
Merlin1300 wrote:
They will last longer than I have time remaining (so I'm probably older and wiser than you). Li batteries have higher energy density than LiFePO4 and are le$$. Yeah - LiFePO4 batteries are more stable and more heat tolerant - but I'm not sure that makes them a better value for off-grid power storage. Were it not for bulk and maintenance issues, lead-acid batteries would probably win.

Lead-acid batteries would never win. Apart from the points you mention lead-acid batteries do not last very long especially under heavier loads. I suppose you could class this as a maintenance issue however.
Because their output voltage is less for LiFePo you need more of them and I suspect they might be slightly heavier but they self drain less and can be charged more often. Also not so inclined to self immolate. Boils down to money I guess. Whether you are wiser may also be hard to tell. I believe that wiser can be related to the ability to deal with BS and recognizing it. You sound like a thinking man - check out mguy in Australia if you want more on EV BS.

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Feb 13, 2024 10:09:41   #
CaptKK Loc: Edmond OK
 
I bought a Tesla last year and here are my experiences.... Mine has a stated range of 310 miles per charge. Tesla recommends for the majority of driving only 80% charge and not go below 10%, so actual range is less than 200 miles. You can charge with a regular 110 outlet or use a 30 or 50 amp plug, depending on what you have at home, but 110 only gives you about 7 miles per hour of charge. A 50 amp plug will give you 44 miles per hour so a 2 - 3 hr overnight charge will get you to 80%. We have a electric coop, if you tell them you have an EV, they give you a discounted rate at night for charging. We paid about $700 for a 50 amp Tesla charger installed, and we pay around $2 per night for charging. We pay an additional $110 per year to cover the gas tax. The superchargers will give you a full charge in about 10 - 15 minutes. For our Tesla, they were free for the first 6 months, then they cost about $20 for a full charge in Oklahoma. Electricians will tell you no way those superchargers are good for the batteries, but Tesla says they are fine. I have used supercharges maybe a dozen times, and I have seen one car towed to a charger because it ran out on the road. There is no maintenance required for the engines, but I see a shorter tire life because they will GO if you punch it. If you have a way to charge them to 80% every night, they are GREAT for in-town driving. Your car is full and ready to go each morning. Never need to stop for gas. And they are FUN to drive. If you can't charge them overnight or if you take a lot of long trips, they are not very practical. I avoid discussions about cost or carbon savings. Too many variables and most people are set in their ways. When you tell 'em you own a Tesla, you usually figure out their political party.

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Feb 13, 2024 12:17:53   #
Cragzop Loc: NYC
 
What I don’t understand is the limited range of these vehicles. As a kid, my friends and I would drive a car from NYC to Florida, usually straight through, within 24 hours. Some areas had 85mph as posted speed limit.
If the average range of an EV is 250 miles, that means approximately 5 stops for charging would be required for the trip. I’ve read that a full charge can take many hours. So if we conservatively say 2 hours per charge, that’s an additional 10 hours.
My gf and I will be driving from NY to LA, in the next few months. If I had an EV, it would add approximately another 30 hours to the trip for charging stops.
I don’t understand the appeal, other than a small cost savings, and MAYBE some environmental savings. Let’s not forget that electricity needs to be generated by fossil fuels, and other pollutants.
Though I suspect a lack of emissions is a plus as well.
I dunno.

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Feb 13, 2024 12:54:52   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
Merlin1300 wrote:
... Climate change has been happening since the earth was created...

True.
Merlin1300 wrote:
... Man has Nothing to do with it...

False.

You might just as well say that man is not polluting the oceans. For years, the solution to pollution was dilution. Doesn't work any more.

Merlin1300 wrote:
... While I'm waiting for someone to develop the hydrogen cell, or a back-yard modular thermonuclear power plant...


I'll go with Hydrogen. Thermonuclear will take a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time to reach your backyard. Every 15 years someone says that thermonuclear power is now only 15 years away. And look at the infrastructure needed to generate it. Is your backyard even large enough to contain it?

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Feb 13, 2024 13:01:53   #
BebuLamar
 
DirtFarmer wrote:
I'll go with Hydrogen. Thermonuclear will take a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time to reach your backyard. Every 15 years someone says that thermonuclear power is now only 15 years away. And look at the infrastructure needed to generate it. Is your backyard even large enough to contain it?


Well you pretty much need the nuclear to generate electricity to make hydrogen from water.

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Feb 13, 2024 13:05:40   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
BebuLamar wrote:
Well you pretty much need the nuclear to generate electricity to make hydrogen from water.


But it's not going to be in your backyard.

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Feb 13, 2024 13:46:25   #
Ruthlessrider
 
Cragzop wrote:
What I don’t understand is the limited range of these vehicles. As a kid, my friends and I would drive a car from NYC to Florida, usually straight through, within 24 hours. Some areas had 85mph as posted speed limit.
If the average range of an EV is 250 miles, that means approximately 5 stops for charging would be required for the trip. I’ve read that a full charge can take many hours. So if we conservatively say 2 hours per charge, that’s an additional 10 hours.
My gf and I will be driving from NY to LA, in the next few months. If I had an EV, it would add approximately another 30 hours to the trip for charging stops.
I don’t understand the appeal, other than a small cost savings, and MAYBE some environmental savings. Let’s not forget that electricity needs to be generated by fossil fuels, and other pollutants.
Though I suspect a lack of emissions is a plus as well.
I dunno.
What I don’t understand is the limited range of th... (show quote)


I live less than 10 miles from a 3500 acre solar field and another is projected nearby to be started next year. Electricity does not only come from fossil fuels, and as more and more solar, wind and geothermal electrical generating stations come on line, less and less will require fossil fuel.

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Feb 13, 2024 14:01:29   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Just some background data and historical trends for the source of EV power:







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Feb 14, 2024 01:14:13   #
Merlin1300 Loc: New England, But Now & Forever SoTX
 
Merlin1300 wrote:
Man has Nothing to do with it
DirtFarmer wrote:
False.
You might just as well say that man is not polluting the oceans. For years, the solution to pollution was dilution. Doesn't work any more.

It'd take 100 years of mankinds emissions to equal those of mother nature in just a year.
DirtFarmer wrote:
I'll go with Hydrogen. Thermonuclear will take a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time to reach your backyard.
Is your backyard even large enough to contain it?
Yep Well - maybe me and a neighbor
https://www.energy.gov/ne/advanced-small-modular-reactors-smrs

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Feb 14, 2024 03:11:07   #
chrissybabe Loc: New Zealand
 
We've got a big fire on the hills above Christchurch at the moment (or there was earlier this afternoon). We had another biggy a few years back in roughly the same location and this was mentioned in news reports. They said that enough energy was released in that fire to equal 4 atomic bombs (I don't think the current fire will equal the previous one). It might be quite amazing how much energy/emissions etc that mother nature can release.
This fire is still going, looking a lot bigger than originally thought. Fanned by hot winds and high temperatures.

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Feb 14, 2024 06:12:10   #
ELNikkor
 
90% of our driving is under 30 miles round trip. If a plug-in hybrid could go 50 miles on only electric, we'd seldom need the gas, yet still have the gas engine for the other 10% of our driving. If we had an electric-only EV, we'd also keep around an efficient gas car for those longer trips.

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Feb 14, 2024 07:21:01   #
elliott937 Loc: St. Louis
 
I feel fortunate, for in Missouri, the cost is $0.14 per kilowatt.

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Feb 14, 2024 08:06:39   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
DirtFarmer wrote:
I'll go with Hydrogen. Thermonuclear will take a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time to reach your backyard. Every 15 years someone says that thermonuclear power is now only 15 years away. And look at the infrastructure needed to generate it. Is your backyard even large enough to contain it?


Merlin1300 wrote:


Thought we were considering thermonuclear reactors, not just nuclear reactors


To me, this looks larger than the average backyard.

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Feb 14, 2024 15:34:34   #
Merlin1300 Loc: New England, But Now & Forever SoTX
 
DirtFarmer wrote:
Thought we were considering thermonuclear reactors, not just nuclear reactors
To me, this looks larger than the average backyard.
WOW!! I'd LIKE to have one of THOSE
I was thinking more along the line of a couple of BES-5's - enough to provide 20KW or so.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BES-5

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Feb 14, 2024 18:38:04   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
It’s certainly a nice dream to have your own reactor generating power for you. Unfortunately home power generators lose out when scaling costs are taken into consideration. It’s a lot more efficient generating power in megawatts than kilowatts.


Other cost considerations:
Capital
Licensing
Maintenance
Waste disposal
What is an active nuclear reactor going to do to your home insurance rates? Check with your insurance company.
NIMBY

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