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Is this image too dark
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Jan 17, 2023 17:40:52   #
bajadreamer Loc: Baja California Sur
 
linda lagace wrote:
I agree with the prior responder. You really need to look at download to appreciate. That said . This is a beautiful picture. I do not think it is too dark but I do think I would have cropped a little more so the focus is really on the bird and his eye and bill. I am not a professional so take it for what its worth. I would have cropped pretty evenly around all four sides. (but not exactly I would adjust so focus is on eye and bill)


Thank you for your thoughts and opinion. Not sure that "not being a professional" is a factor. Your opinion is what counts.

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Jan 17, 2023 17:44:13   #
bajadreamer Loc: Baja California Sur
 
R.G. wrote:
One of the main issues is your intent. Was it a dark scene and do you want to be faithful to reality? If not, it could do with some overall brightening. The underside of the bird is indistinct because it's not well differentiated from the background - do you want the bird to stand out from the background or do you want to represent its elusive nature by having it indistinct from the background? The usual way to process this would be to have the bird prominent and distinct, but that may not be your intention.

Whatever your intention is, processing this shot will get you thinking about the viewers' attention and how it can be directed. The main things that draw our attention are brightness, contrast, sharpness, colour strength, action (even if it's frozen as in a picture) and the principal components of any storytelling that the shot conveys. The first four are primarily to do with the PP adjustments that we may consider using.

The subject of your shot doesn't lend itself to being brightened but it seems to be a good candidate for added contrast, sharpening and saturation. It would also make sense to do the reverse to the background, or at least to avoid adding much in the way of contrast, sharpness and colour strength. Normally you wouldn't want to avoid those adjustments altogether because it would leave the background bland, but this case is an exception - assuming that you do want the bird to stand out.

I think brightening the bird as much as possible without it looking off is the right approach, and the background should be brightened as much as is determined by your preference. Removing bright spots from the background was also a good move. The other adjustments will differentiate the bird from its background.
One of the main issues is your intent. Was it a d... (show quote)


Thank for your thoughtful reply. Usually, and also specifically in this image, my goal is to draw attention to the bird. Certainly in some images the background, perch, flower, etc, may steal the show, but that is the exception for me. I do sometimes use desaturation of the BG to help and also blur the BG occasionally. I have not used contrast as much, but I will experiment with that. Again, thanks for your help.

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Jan 17, 2023 17:47:35   #
bajadreamer Loc: Baja California Sur
 
SalvageDiver wrote:
I don't feel the image is too dark, but there is a lack of separation between the bird and it's background. There are a number of ways to create separation, i.e. brightness, contrast, color, hue, blur, etc. In this image, I didn't feel increasing bird brightness relative to the background was the best approach. However, increasing bird contrast did seem to work better, IMO. I also saw that there was a strong blue color cast in the bird which isn't characteristic of this species. Feather colors are different shades of gray, no blue. Additionally, the normal color of the legs are a bright orange, similar to the color of the beak and ring around eyes.

Personally, I liked the original crop more than the last crop. For this image, I prefer the environmental composition more than a portrait. The darks in the dark spot can be easily lightened to better match the rest of the background. I also feel that a light vignette helps further guide the viewer's focus to the bird. I also agree with your wife, that bright spot between the bird's legs had to go.
I don't feel the image is too dark, but there is a... (show quote)


Thank you. And you are right-the more I look at it, the more I prefer the original crop. I am not sure, but I think this is a juvenile bird, which may account for the lack of orange in the legs and beak.
You certainly are correct about the contrast adjustment bringing up the separation between BG and bird. Appreciate the effort to show that.

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Jan 17, 2023 20:19:50   #
bcheary Loc: Jacksonville, FL
 
bajadreamer wrote:
My usual "technique" is to brighten the bird and darken the BG. I use a number of methods to obtain that result. However, watching Steve Perry's video yesterday made me wonder about the opposite approach-darken the bird and brighten the BG. Unfortunately most of my images do not lend themselves to that approach as I often am fighting low light levels to start with. In this image of a Slaty-backed Nightingale-Thrush, in ACR, I brought down the BG and brought up the bird. I had to balance keeping the bird "black" with increasing the brightness. Shot with ISO of 2000 on Canon R5.

My question is: is the overall image too dark? Any other suggestions?
My usual "technique" is to brighten the ... (show quote)


Nice shot. Keep it as it is!

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Jan 18, 2023 07:05:06   #
Manglesphoto Loc: 70 miles south of St.Louis
 
bajadreamer wrote:
My usual "technique" is to brighten the bird and darken the BG. I use a number of methods to obtain that result. However, watching Steve Perry's video yesterday made me wonder about the opposite approach-darken the bird and brighten the BG. Unfortunately most of my images do not lend themselves to that approach as I often am fighting low light levels to start with. In this image of a Slaty-backed Nightingale-Thrush, in ACR, I brought down the BG and brought up the bird. I had to balance keeping the bird "black" with increasing the brightness. Shot with ISO of 2000 on Canon R5.

My question is: is the overall image too dark? Any other suggestions?
My usual "technique" is to brighten the ... (show quote)


Looks fine to me!!!

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Jan 18, 2023 08:09:48   #
Bayou
 
SalvageDiver wrote:
...I also feel that a light vignette helps further guide the viewer's focus to the bird...


I often use vignette in this fashion. A subtle bit of vignette, little enough so that it's virtually unnoticeable, can really make a (centered) subject pop without editing the subject at all.

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Jan 18, 2023 08:20:10   #
J-SPEIGHT Loc: Akron, Ohio
 
bajadreamer wrote:
My usual "technique" is to brighten the bird and darken the BG. I use a number of methods to obtain that result. However, watching Steve Perry's video yesterday made me wonder about the opposite approach-darken the bird and brighten the BG. Unfortunately most of my images do not lend themselves to that approach as I often am fighting low light levels to start with. In this image of a Slaty-backed Nightingale-Thrush, in ACR, I brought down the BG and brought up the bird. I had to balance keeping the bird "black" with increasing the brightness. Shot with ISO of 2000 on Canon R5.

My question is: is the overall image too dark? Any other suggestions?
My usual "technique" is to brighten the ... (show quote)



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Jan 18, 2023 08:28:04   #
jaymatt Loc: Alexandria, Indiana
 
A bit, yes.

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Jan 18, 2023 09:50:59   #
Wes Loc: Dallas
 
My question is: is the overall image too dark? Any other suggestions?[/quote]

I see what you mean.



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Jan 18, 2023 10:58:17   #
UTMike Loc: South Jordan, UT
 
You have a very good result! I think that Steve Perry would be proud of your efforts. As he cautioned in the video, not every shot is suitable for his recommendations and you always have to struggle to avoid overdoing.

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Jan 18, 2023 14:16:19   #
R.G. Loc: Scotland
 
bajadreamer wrote:
....I have not used contrast as much, but I will experiment with that....


As a general rule when subduing a BG it's a good idea to lead with subduing the highlights since they are the most eye-catching parts. Once that is done you'll probably want less of the other subduing adjustments. For my edit below I concentrated on reducing the contrast of the BG, but that needs to be done with caution since if you overdo it you could end up with a bland photo. As a general rule I prefer to err on the side of moderation and subtlety. You'll have your own preferences.

As well as reducing the highlights fully I also lifted the shadows a little since those two adjustments between them have the effect of reducing the overall contrast (as well as increasing the amount of visible detail - but not in an eye-catching way). I also used the Contrast slider for a further drop but it didn't need much. Other subduing adjustments included a little negative Clarity and negative Sharpening (going left with the sliders) plus generous amounts of denoise. All three of these adjustments have a softening effect. In this case only a very small amount of negative Saturation was needed (reducing the Contrast has a desaturating effect).

Other tweaks worth trying include using the Temp slider to give the BG a very slight blue tint (warm colours advance, cool colours retreat) plus using the HSL tool to subdue or enhance any problematic colours that aren't responding favourably to the global adjustments. Conversely, if you select the main subject/s you can give them a slight WB shift towards yellow (emphasis on the "slight"). Obviously whatever you do to subdue the BG you can do the opposite to emphasise the main subject/s.
.


(Download)

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Jan 18, 2023 14:57:57   #
Bubalola Loc: Big Apple, NY
 
bajadreamer wrote:
My usual "technique" is to brighten the bird and darken the BG. I use a number of methods to obtain that result. However, watching Steve Perry's video yesterday made me wonder about the opposite approach-darken the bird and brighten the BG. Unfortunately most of my images do not lend themselves to that approach as I often am fighting low light levels to start with. In this image of a Slaty-backed Nightingale-Thrush, in ACR, I brought down the BG and brought up the bird. I had to balance keeping the bird "black" with increasing the brightness. Shot with ISO of 2000 on Canon R5.

My question is: is the overall image too dark? Any other suggestions?
My usual "technique" is to brighten the ... (show quote)


IMHO, the lighting balance of the bird and its immediate background is very good. However, a large bright space on left side of the image diverts attention of a viewer from intended subject, the bird. But that’s just me, Baja!

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Jan 18, 2023 16:11:46   #
JeffDavidson Loc: Originally Detroit Now Los Angeles
 
Looks pretty good to me!

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Jan 18, 2023 16:12:47   #
joecichjr Loc: Chicago S. Suburbs, Illinois, USA
 
bajadreamer wrote:
My usual "technique" is to brighten the bird and darken the BG. I use a number of methods to obtain that result. However, watching Steve Perry's video yesterday made me wonder about the opposite approach-darken the bird and brighten the BG. Unfortunately most of my images do not lend themselves to that approach as I often am fighting low light levels to start with. In this image of a Slaty-backed Nightingale-Thrush, in ACR, I brought down the BG and brought up the bird. I had to balance keeping the bird "black" with increasing the brightness. Shot with ISO of 2000 on Canon R5.

My question is: is the overall image too dark? Any other suggestions?
My usual "technique" is to brighten the ... (show quote)


I think it's superb the way it is πŸ’ŽπŸ’ŽπŸ’ŽπŸ’ŽπŸ’Ž

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Jan 18, 2023 19:06:22   #
Retired CPO Loc: Travel full time in an RV
 
I'm a big believer in leaving well enough alone!!! All this finagling of photos leaves me cold! The original photo (if that's what it is) is great. I wouldn't change a thing. This is from someone who uses only Picasa for post processing. And as little of that as I can get away with. To answer the question directly, No it's not too dark, it's perfect!

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