OOPS! (Page 4): Yep! I wonder if he ever ordered a book on do-it-yourself surgery/dentistry also?

robertjerl Loc: Corona, California

scooter1 wrote:

A self taught professional gunsmith. Dangerous.

Yep! I wonder if he ever ordered a book on do-it-yourself surgery/dentistry also?

rick_n_wv Loc: Charleston WV

pendennis wrote:

I carry a 1911, full mag, one up the pipe, thumb safety on; the way the pistol was designed to be carried. My carry holster covers the trigger guard

Training wise, I follow this maxim: DON'T PUT YOUR BOOGER HOOK ON THE BANG SWITCH UNTIL YOU'VE IDENTIFIED YOUR INTENDED TARGET AND ARE READY TO SHOOT!

A properly working 1911 will not discharge "accidentally".

As to the OP, the pistol didn't accidentally discharge; it was a negligent discharge.

Yep, a pistol does not go off unless the trigger is pulled. That is especially true of 1911's. Series 70 had not only the manual safety but a grip safety and both had to be engaged. The newer series 80 added a firing pin safety. Been using them since 68 and never seen or know anyone with first hand knowledge of a 1911 or any pistol going off accidentally without pulling the trigger. It was a negligent discharge.

lowkick Loc: Connecticut

Some years ago (early 2000's) we were attending a performance at the Bushnell Auditorium in Hartford. Just as the lights flashed signaling the end of intermission, a shot was heard and the audience was directed to leave. We waited in the cold of winter in a parking lot across the street until the all clear was given and we were able to see the end of the play. We found out later that it was an off duty police officer's gun that somehow caught on the seat as he was sitting down to watch the performance. The bullet went straight down, hit the concrete floor, shattering and sending a shard of the bullet into a woman's lower leg a few seats away. It was listed as an accident and no charges were filed. No information was given on the style of the gun. Since he was off duty, I assume he was carrying a personal weapon concealed. Typically, a police issued holster will protect the trigger and the hammer from snagging on something. But an inside the pants waist holster might have exposed the hammer.

foodie65

nimbushopper wrote:

Guns just don't go off, the trigger has to be pulled! Also, leaving the chamber empty means that likely both hands will be needed to chamber a round and it takes more time. Micro seconds count when someone is trying to kill you.

And how many times has someone tried to kill you?

Shadetree Loc: Chattanooga, TN

TriX wrote:

No idea if it was a wheel gun or an automatic, and everyone has their own opinion about “cocked and locked”, but I carry my pistol with the chamber empty. I’ve spent lots of time practicing drawing a 1911 and jacking the slide in one motion once it’s WELL clear of leather - that’s my personal preference.

What happens if your off hand is disabled and not able to rack the slide? Sounds like that would be a good argument for a DAO...

robertjerl Loc: Corona, California

foodie65 wrote:

And how many times has someone tried to kill you?

Hmmm, lets see? Oh yeah, Dec 1966 to Jan 1969 at Camp Granite, Qui Nhon, Binh Dinh Province, Republic of Vietnam.
And at one time or another I carried a 1911, M-2 Carbine or my M-14 locked and loaded (safety on) almost all of the time. Some places we cleared the weapon upon entry but reloaded upon leaving. And in that time not one single accidental or negligent discharge in a company of 125 personnel.

It is called training and discipline. + a few brain cells that know each other

Brian J.

Many thanks for all the interesting replies which just confirmed the theme of the old Japanese movie "Rashomon" that there are many ways to tell the same story.

Abo

jerryc41 wrote:

Accidents happen every day, and you just have to take them in stride. It's good he had that permit. We can't just let any idiots carry guns around. Maybe his wife will get a gun now.

Talking about idiots with guns; a weapons instructor
at the Victoria (Australia) Police Academy shot himself in the leg
as he attempted to holster his gun (a 40 cal S&W M and P),
in front of a class of recruits. LOL

A very good example of a bad example. They probably gave him a medal...
"Injured in the course of duty?" LOL

Don't get me wrong; the admiration and respect I have for honest
cops borders on hero worship... and I'm proud to say that I have friends
in both the AFP and Queensland Police.

nimbushopper Loc: Tampa, FL

Schwabo wrote:

Very true. But like TriX wrote, if practiced 2 handed drawing and chamber can be one motion.

If someone is assaulting you then you may need one hand to fend them off while drawing your weapon with your strong hand. To commit both hands to load the gun is dangerous and every firearm instructor(including myself) thinks it's a bad practice. Modern handguns have several safety features making them safe to carry with the chamber loaded.

nimbushopper Loc: Tampa, FL

foodie65 wrote:

And how many times has someone tried to kill you?

More than average since I'm a retired Peace Officer, but the point is that one cannot use deadly physical force against someone unless they are attempting to use it against you! One is also never compelled to use deadly physical force even if the situation legally allows it. That's why every police shooting is thoroughly investigated.

nimbushopper Loc: Tampa, FL

lowkick wrote:

Some years ago (early 2000's) we were attending a ... (show quote)

It's very important to use a holster that completely covers the trigger guard because on all modern handguns the trigger must be pulled all the way back for the gun to discharge.

nimbushopper Loc: Tampa, FL

rick_n_wv wrote:

Yep, a pistol does not go off unless the trigger is pulled. That is especially true of 1911's. Series 70 had not only the manual safety but a grip safety and both had to be engaged. The newer series 80 added a firing pin safety. Been using them since 68 and never seen or know anyone with first hand knowledge of a 1911 or any pistol going off accidentally without pulling the trigger. It was a negligent discharge.

nimbushopper Loc: Tampa, FL

ad9mac wrote:

Sadly, the ever popular Glock has neither. If one is in the chamber it's hot to go.
There are a number of makes that duplicate the Glock style function now.
Carry it in a pocket/purse sans holster and something snags the trigger( keys, eyebrow pencil, finger) and BOOM.

You are incorrect about the Glock. It actually has 3 safeties, but they are all released by pulling the trigger. You are correct that carrying it without a holster that covers the trigger and trigger guard is not good!

nimbushopper Loc: Tampa, FL

scooter1 wrote:

With a colt 1911 the hammer should always be in the half cocked for safety. With the hammer all the way down a drop that caused the hammer to be struck could cause it to fire. I've got a vintage colt 1911 and a springfield 1911 and both operate the same.

All 1911's manufactured in the past 40 years have a drop safety preventing them from firing unless the trigger is fully depressed. Your series 70 doesn't have this, but it must be dropped on its muzzle for it to fire(doesn't always happed) so the round would go into the ground. It doesn't matter if the hammer is cocked or not. The inertia of the firing pin from dropping the gun on its muzzle can set the chambered round off.

nimbushopper Loc: Tampa, FL

pendennis wrote:

The Glock has been advertised as a "safe action pistol", no safety is built in, or necessary. Every negligent discharge I've read of, has involved someone putting their finger on the trigger. I've carried a Glock 19, but disliked the finger grooves on the grip. I do carry a S&W M&P Shield, but I prefer a 1911 pistol.

The generation 5 Glocks don't have finger grooves!