CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

Very shortly now, we'll have trouble remembering cameras ever were burdened by mirrors.

Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States

Comes in handy at times I suppose.

Not equivalent? Rear view, EVF view, mirroe up live view, why would they be different? The image is displayed on a digital screen in either case. A little biddy one or a lager one.

Ysarex Loc: St. Louis

Because my PDAF focus system still functions for one. For two I can see the image in the EVF outdoors.

Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States

What's a PDAF, not sure if my focusing still works in live view. I rarely use live view.

The sun obliterating the rear view is a separate problem from the operation of the two views. Eg. indoors there is no problem.

Ysarex Loc: St. Louis

Phase Detect Auto Focus which requires that the mirror in a DSLR be in the down position. PDAF is implemented differently in mirrorless systems but is performance competitive. In live view your DSLR can't use it's PDAF system and has to resort to a back-up CDAF system with hardly a fraction of the performance ability of the one you just disabled by raising the mirror. Try using it with moving fast action. Mirror - up live view on a DSLR is not an equivalent to a camera with an EVF.

Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States

Wow, didn't know that. So glad I just take pictures.
Life is simple, and so am I.

mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey

I completely agree except that I do not miss the optical viewfinder at all.

User ID

Not relevant at all. Read that post again, twice, slowly, and out loud. You will see.

rmorrison1116 Loc: Near Valley Forge, Pennsylvania

Seriously?

rmorrison1116 Loc: Near Valley Forge, Pennsylvania

Watch out for that net...

gwilliams6

I shot with top pro SLRs and DSLRs from Nikon and Canon (both brands) for over four decades, and made the move to mirrorless in January 2017 and have never looked back.

I miss nothing about those big, heavy, clunky mirror flapping, old tech beasts, NOTHING.

I embrace and enjoy all the competitive advantages my mirrorless gear gives me every time I use it for my professional and personal work worldwide.

Anyone who says it is no different hasn't fully exploited all that mirrorless gear can do that NO DLSR will ever be physically or technically able to do, ever.

Ask the World's Top News and Media Services that in the past 20 months have all dumped their pro DSLRs and moved to exclusively mirrorless gear for all their staff still photographers and staff videographers worldwide.

Associated Press; Gannett Media; UK Media; Canada Press have all gone Sony mirrorless. And Agence France Press has gone Nikon Z9 mirrorless.

https://alphauniverse.com/stories/why-the-associated-press-just-switched-to-sony/

https://petapixel.com/2021/11/17/sony-is-now-the-exclusive-camera-provider-for-gannett-and-usa-today/

https://www.dpreview.com/news/4545693607/the-uk-largest-news-agency-partners-with-sony

https://petapixel.com/2022/01/31/canadas-largest-news-organization-moves-exclusively-to-sony-cameras/#:~:text=Canada's%20Largest%20News%20Agency%20Moves%20Exclusively%20to%20Sony%20Cameras,-Jan%2031%2C%202022&text=The%20Canadian%20Press%2C%20the%20largest,provider%20for%20the%20media%20company

https://petapixel.com/2022/06/09/how-pro-photographers-helped-make-the-z9-from-prototype-to-flagship/

FYI, I have owned Sony mirrorless A6500, A7RII, A7RIII, A7III, A9 and currently own Sony A7RIV, A1, A7SIII. And I currently own 13 top mirrorless E-mount lenses from 10mm to 600mm plus 1.4X and 2X extenders from Sony, Sigma and Tamron.


Cheers

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amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

I don't know if I meet your criteria... I still shoot with several DSLRs, but I also have a mirrorless camera that I use for other purposes. So I haven't "converted"... But I have "adopted" mirrorless and use them for certain things.

I believe you shoot with Canon gear. I see you have previously discussed 7D Mark II and 5D Mark III, in particular. Both fine DSLRs.

Any of the most recent R-series mirrorless (R3, R5, R6 full frame or R7, R10 APS-C) would give you a MUCH more advanced AF system. That and the even faster frame rates are the two things you'll notice the most.

With an EF to RF adapter you would be able to use any and all Canon lenses you have now (EF-S lenses will fit, but cause the full frame cameras to switch to a cropped mode). Those lenses will work as well or better than they did on your DSLRs. Any third party lenses for EF mount you might have also will likely work... but there's no guarantee of this. Some 3rd party lenses have compatibility issues.

The mirrorless camera's electronic viewfinder (EVF) is both a blessing and a curse. It can give you "exposure simulation" that allows you to keep your eye to the viewfinder while adjusting your exposure settings. This also can allow you to "see in the dark". Mirrorless cameras are able to focus in much lower light conditions than DSLRs (because DSLRs "split" the light coming in, sending some to the viewfinder and some to the AF sensors via mirrors... mirrorless, on the other hand, have a direct path for the light to reach the AF sensors embedded in the image sensor).

The EVF also can provide other helpful info such as displaying a histogram or an electronic level. In some cameras you can even play back images to review them in the viewfinder (in case light is too bright to use the screen on the rear of the camera.)

A negative of the EVF, as compared to the optical viewfinder (OVF) of your DSLR(s), is that the EVF goes completely dark when the camera is off or in sleep mode. The EVF requires constant power to operate. It's essentially like having Live View active all the time, in order to use the EVF. Your DSLR's OVF doesn't need power and you can view through it even when the camera is powered down (although it may dim a bit, due to the active transmissive LCDs commonly used in modern OVFs).

Because of the constant power required by the EVF, mirrorless cameras draw down batteries quite a bit faster than DSLRs. In a very broad generalization, you should expect to need about twice as many batteries and need to swap them about twice as often, everything else being equal. Some mirrorless cameras also use smaller batteries to allow them to be especially small and light, which also can effect the shots per charge possible. Older mirrorless camera EVFs also exhibited some "blackout" between shots which could be troublesome when shooting bursts at a high frame rate. In newer models such as above, this is no longer a significant problem.

Most mirrorless cameras offer both mechanical and electronic shutters. They typically can fire both at faster rate than was possible with DSLRs. For example, the most entry-level R-series camera can take 15 frames per second with its mechanical shutter, or 23 frames/sec. with it's e-shutter. The e-shutter also can shoot silently. And most of them offer extra fast top speeds such as 1/16000, where the mechanical shutter is typically limited to 1/4000 or 1/8000. It's not entirely clear sailing, though. E-shutters are subject to an issue called "rolling shutter effect", where moving objects appear distorted. This is due to the way the shutter action occurs at the image sensor... reading out line by line. To reduce this some cameras use more advanced image sensors that have very fast readout, but this makes for a more expensive camera. (Another type of e-shutter is even better. Called "global", these offload the entire image data from the sensor at the same instant. However, these are quite expensive and not found in any MILC that I'm aware of. Some cinema cameras are using them, but cost tens of thousands of $.)

Due to the high frame rates and intensive data gathering, some mirrorless use new types of memory such as CF Express, which is more expensive than slower types such as SD.

If you are, in fact, shooting with Canon EF-mount gear, the Canon R-series is easily the best path for you to transition to mirrorless, if that's what you want to do. It is possible to adapt Canon EF-mount lenses for use on Sony cameras, but focus speed and performance tends to be compromised a bit. It's not when the same lenses are adapted instead for use on Canon R-series cameras.

In addition to the R-series cameras, Canon also offers an older mirrorless M-series. Those are APS-C format only and while it is also possible to adapt EF/EF-S lenses for use on them, Canon has never devoted much effort into developing lenses specifically for use on the EF-M mount cameras. In the 10 years since the first EOS M was introduced, Canon has produced a grand total of eight EF-M lenses for them. In comparison, the EOS R system already has 28 RF and RF-S lenses, and won't be celebrating it's fourth birthday until this coming Fall. The M-series is likely going to be phased out and discontinued. Canon reportedly has already stopped making the top-of-the-line model (M6 Mark II, still in stock some places though). The EF-M lenses are also a "dead end" because what few there are cannot be adapted for use on any other system. (There are a few 3rd party lenses made for EF-M that can be returned to the manufacturer to be permanently modified to work on other systems.) While I use an M-series camera and a few lenses myself... it's a very nice, super compact camera that's neat for street photography, travel, hiking, etc.... I am not recommending purchasing them now for "the long run". Yes, you can buy an M50 Mark II with an EF-M 15-45mm lens for $700... compared to the new R10 with RF-S 18-45mm lens for $1100. So there are some really good deals and they're still quite capable little cameras, but there simply won't be any future growth to the already small M system offered.

Speaking for myself, I will probably continue to use my DSLRs for a while longer. I was waiting to see what Canon would do with the rumored R7... hoping it might be an ideal replacement for the pair of 7D Mark II I've used for the past 6 years or so. But it's not. The R7 does offer some serious improvements at a very nice price, but it comes up a little short in some other ways that are important to me. As far as I'm concerned the R7 is, in effect, a "mirrorless 90D". It uses a unique, new control layout that concerns me because I switch back and forth between cameras a lot while shooting sports. The three DSLRs I mostly use for that have virtually identical control layouts. Of course, this wouldn't bother someone else using the new camera in isolation... they can quickly become accustomed to and probably even learn to like the new layout. So it's a concern to me and perhaps a few others like me, who use multiple cameras. I also want a camera that can accept a battery grip, which the R7 can't. And I have concerns about it's weather resistance and durability... which Canon states is comparable to the 90D. The 7DII is better sealed and has a higher durability rating.

But, hey, I reserve the right to change my mind! Some aspects of the new R7 are very attractive! I will see what people say who get one and have actually used them for a while. It looks to be a great camera for a lot of people and I expect Canon will sell a ton of them. People will buy and really enjoy the new R7 and hopefully tell us all about it!

rmorrison1116 Loc: Near Valley Forge, Pennsylvania

I never quite understood why people say they never looked back, because by mentioning that you used to use DSLR for 40 years, you looked back. By the way, MILC's and DSLR's do the exact same thing, they record digital images. The way they go about it may be different, but in the end the printer or computer screen or monitor used for viewing the images, doesn't really care whether the image was recorded by a DSLR or an MILC. The news companies that have upgraded there equipment have done so because of financial incentives, not because MILC's are better than DSLR's. We're not talking about fine art photography.
I currently own over 20 DSLR's that all work, the oldest of which is a Canon EOS 10D and the newest is a Nikon D850. My very first digital camera, a Sony Mavica that I bought in the spring of 2001, has no reflex mirror which makes it a mirrorless camera. I still have it and it still works. I own several digital cameras that do not have reflex mirrors, which makes them mirrorless cameras. I also own a couple MILC's and have just ordered the new Canon R7. It will take the place of my 90D for wildlife photography, but I will still use the 90D because it's a good camera and it works fine. I own a whole bunch of those light grey with a crimson band Canon EF lenses, and several black ones with the crimson band. Also several Canon EF and EF-S lenses with both gold and silver bands. Plus a couple Tamron SP and Sigma Sport and Contemporary lenses, for both Canon and Nikon. I also own 10 Nikkor lenses. I have some EF-M glass and several Canon, Nikon, Sigma, Tamron and Kenko teleconverters and EF to M and EF to RF adapters. I haven't purchased any RF glass yet, but eventually will.
Bottom line, cameras are tools and toys to me. I've been doing photography for over 50 years and will continue to do so for as long as I can. DSLR, MILC, Bridge, Super Zooms, it doesn't matter to me, as long as they work and I'm happy with the results. I did a job last month at a religious organization that was celebrating their 100th anniversary. There were a couple hundred people there and not one of them asked me if the cameras I was using had mirrors in them. By the way, both cameras did, a Canon 5D mk IV and a Nikon D850. Of the over 500 photos I shot, about 98% were in focus and properly exposed. Not bad for such obsolete technology.

billnikon Loc: Pennsylvania/Ohio/Florida/Maui/Oregon/Vermont

I shoot wildlife primarily, what I noticed was.
a. Higher frames per second, almost double from 10 to 20. This was, is, a game changer, especially during critical times when your subject is doing something interesting. A Osprey flipping a fish so it always faces forward. A male Great Blue Heron handing a nesting stick off to the female, a bird fight in mid air where two Bald Eagles as they lock talons.

b. You see exactly what the exposure is before you take the exposure. This is great when your photographing a white bird like a Great Egret, camera metering can be fooled easily on white and black birds, so being able to see the exposure before you shot is an advantage over DSLR's. Same holds true for snow and sand.

c. The technology seems to have stopped for DSLR's, few seem to be manufactured. The new technology seems to be going to mirrorless camera's.

d. HOWEVER, do not switch to mirrorless thinking they are lighter than DSLR's because they are sometimes smaller. Most are not, some are but most are not. And, smaller for some is a problem, I have big hands, so I also purchase the vertical grip for my mirrorless camera's.

e. The focusing systems for mirrorless are mostly more advanced, every time a new model comes out, a new and improved focusing system comes out, they have focusing for eyes for people, birds, and even animals (dogs, cats, bears, etc.) One manufacture has focusing priority for cars.
Eye focusing systems from manufactures of DSLR's seem to be on hold for now. So, game, match for mirrorless.

d. On my Sony mirrorless, I can push a button on the lens when I am in manual focus and through the lens everything that is in exact focus lights up with a color. Making critical focusing a non issue. DSLR's, as far as I know, do not have this.

e. HOWEVER, with all of this said, my current D850 and D500, with GROUP AUTO FOCUS, can get a bird's eye in focus without an issue 98% of the time, but like I said earlier, they both lack 20 frames per second. And the newer mirrorless are even faster, 30 fps seems to have become the standard. The Nikon Z9 can do well over a 100.

f. New lens designs for Mirrorless Camera's seem more advanced for mirrorless. My Sony 600 mm f4 is half the weight of my older Nikon DSLR 600 f4. And, my Sony is center balanced making hand holding easier. And, the Sony focusing rails on the interior of the lens currently beats the pants off anything Canon has. The 200-600 Sony only requires a quarter turn to go from 200-600, a real advantage in wildlife photography. Lens innovation seems to have stopped for DSLR's.

Good luck to you on your trip from DSLR to Mirrorless, I can be paved with bumps, but the road will smooth out for you as it has for countless others who have begun that journey.

BUT, if your getting the results you want out of your current equipment, there is NO reason to switch.

Tracy B. Loc: Indiana

I went from a Canon 5D Mark IV to a Canon R5. It took awhile to set up and get all my buttons working the way I wanted. I am thrilled with my camera. It has so many improvements over the 5D Mark IV. I had absolutely no regrets.