Learning portraiture and looking for wisdom on who to nail focusing on the eyes when the subject is moving (Page 2): Thanks . . one of my grand daughters.

Weddingguy Loc: British Columbia - Canada

Dr Rae wrote:

Great picture WeddingGuy!

Thanks . . one of my grand daughters.

Weddingguy Loc: British Columbia - Canada

sirlensalot wrote:

Wondering if using Al servo would help tracking focus under some conditions?

No . . . not for portraits. AI Servo requires a moving subject and sometimes will get confused if there is no movement towards or away from the camera, and will refuse to focus. Also it requires that the shutter release be held half way down to operate.

sirlensalot Loc: Arizona

Weddingguy wrote:

sirlensalot wrote:

Wondering if using Al servo would help tracking focus under some conditions?

No . . . not for portraits. AI Servo requires a moving subject and sometimes will get confused if there is no movement towards or away from the camera, and will refuse to focus. Also it requires that the shutter release be held half way down to operate.

Understood. Was thinking more about kids candids. Should have clarified. Thanks for sharing.

kerfree Loc: Sebago and Sanibel

Weddingguy wrote:

quote=kerfree I am trying to teach myself portrai... (show quote)

Your advice is worth far more than 3 cent - proof is in the adorable picture of your grandchild. I'll follow it to a T - now just to find willing subjects....
:) :)

kerfree Loc: Sebago and Sanibel

ronz wrote:

Not knowing what camera you are using which may ma... (show quote)

Thanks for the wisdom of your high speed experience, Ronz! I had to do a little research since my camera doesn't call anything AI Servo... I think it is the same as AFC (continuous auto focus) on my Panasonic. If it works for cycles and horses it should work great for kids in motion. I'll have a chance to try out your tips later this week - can't wait!

kerfree Loc: Sebago and Sanibel

DennisK wrote:

You could try using AF-C.

Dennis, thank you! I will experiment with both AFC and also using area focus, with high speed and deeper depth of field this week - with all this great advice, I have no excuse now not to master nailing the focus!

Weddingguy Loc: British Columbia - Canada

kerfree wrote:

DennisK wrote:

You could try using AF-C.

Dennis, thank you! I will experiment with both AFC and also using area focus, with high speed and deeper depth of field this week - with all this great advice, I have no excuse now not to master nailing the focus!

There is more to focus than that unfortunately. Focusing an auto focus camera is an art in itself and takes some understanding and practice.
An auto-focus camera focuses on contrast and detail, and if there is more contrast or light in your background, the camera tends to go there for a focusing point.
Focusing on eyes is fine for close up stuff, but if you are a wee bit back from the subject the camera sees much more than just the eyes, so picks whatever has the most contrast in the focal area. For example the image
below . . . the camera would see approximately the amount in the circle to choose a focal point. As you can see, the area with the most contrast isn't the eyes, even although that is what is in the centre of the circle and
is what YOU want to focus on. It would probably go for the very high contrast of the stocking hung behind the subject. That would result in the eyes being out of focus.
Shooting is a three step process with auto-focus. Push the shutter release half way down and the camera focuses (and sets exposure if you are in an automatic exposure mode). The 2nd step is to recompose. The 3rd step is to push the shutter release the rest of the way to fire the shutter.
For every picture I take, I decide on a point on which to focus, in an area that doesn't have a background which could compete for attention. (For example I might focus on a white shirt and tie that are about the same distance from the camera as the eyes that I want in perfect focus) Then I
recompose the picture in my viewfinder while still holding the shutter release half way down . . then shoot.
Every shot . . . always . . . is focus . . . recompose . . . shoot. Sometimes I hold that shutter release half way down for up to a minute waiting for the right expression before shooting.

Dr Rae Loc: Sarasota Florida

Weddingguy wrote:

kerfree wrote:

DennisK wrote:

You could try using AF-C.

Dennis, thank you! I will experiment with both AFC and also using area focus, with high speed and deeper depth of field this week - with all this great advice, I have no excuse now not to master nailing the focus!

There is more to focus than that unfortunately. Focusing an auto focus camera is an art in itself and takes some understanding and practice.
An auto-focus camera focuses on contrast and detail, and if there is more contrast or light in your background, the camera tends to go there for a focusing point.
Focusing on eyes is fine for close up stuff, but if you are a wee bit back from the subject the camera sees much more than just the eyes, so picks whatever has the most contrast in the focal area. For example the image
below . . . the camera would see approximately the amount in the circle to choose a focal point. As you can see, the area with the most contrast isn't the eyes, even although that is what is in the centre of the circle and
is what YOU want to focus on. It would probably go for the very high contrast of the stocking hung behind the subject. That would result in the eyes being out of focus.
Shooting is a three step process with auto-focus. Push the shutter release half way down and the camera focuses (and sets exposure if you are in an automatic exposure mode). The 2nd step is to recompose. The 3rd step is to push the shutter release the rest of the way to fire the shutter.
For every picture I take, I decide on a point on which to focus, in an area that doesn't have a background which could compete for attention. (For example I might focus on a white shirt and tie that are about the same distance from the camera as the eyes that I want in perfect focus) Then I
recompose the picture in my viewfinder while still holding the shutter release half way down . . then shoot.
Every shot . . . always . . . is focus . . . recompose . . . shoot. Sometimes I hold that shutter release half way down for up to a minute waiting for the right expression before shooting.

quote=kerfree quote=DennisK br br You could tr... (show quote)

Well thanks for taking the time to write this!!! A lightbulb moment for me!

kerfree Loc: Sebago and Sanibel

Weddingguy wrote:

kerfree wrote:

DennisK wrote:

You could try using AF-C.

Dennis, thank you! I will experiment with both AFC and also using area focus, with high speed and deeper depth of field this week - with all this great advice, I have no excuse now not to master nailing the focus!

There is more to focus than that unfortunately. Focusing an auto focus camera is an art in itself and takes some understanding and practice.
An auto-focus camera focuses on contrast and detail, and if there is more contrast or light in your background, the camera tends to go there for a focusing point.
Focusing on eyes is fine for close up stuff, but if you are a wee bit back from the subject the camera sees much more than just the eyes, so picks whatever has the most contrast in the focal area. For example the image
below . . . the camera would see approximately the amount in the circle to choose a focal point. As you can see, the area with the most contrast isn't the eyes, even although that is what is in the centre of the circle and
is what YOU want to focus on. It would probably go for the very high contrast of the stocking hung behind the subject. That would result in the eyes being out of focus.
Shooting is a three step process with auto-focus. Push the shutter release half way down and the camera focuses (and sets exposure if you are in an automatic exposure mode). The 2nd step is to recompose. The 3rd step is to push the shutter release the rest of the way to fire the shutter.
For every picture I take, I decide on a point on which to focus, in an area that doesn't have a background which could compete for attention. (For example I might focus on a white shirt and tie that are about the same distance from the camera as the eyes that I want in perfect focus) Then I
recompose the picture in my viewfinder while still holding the shutter release half way down . . then shoot.
Every shot . . . always . . . is focus . . . recompose . . . shoot. Sometimes I hold that shutter release half way down for up to a minute waiting for the right expression before shooting.

quote=kerfree quote=DennisK br br You could tr... (show quote)

Wedding Guy, you have been so kind to share your expertise. I especially appreciate your explanation of the camera seeking out the greatest contrast on which to focus - that explains a lot!

I hope you won't mind if I ask you a follow-up question. When I use spot focus for stationary objects, I follow your pattern of focusing, recomposing and shooting. But what I am understanding is that in this darling picture of your granddaughter you used area focus. So to assure the camera was focusing on her eyes instead of the stocking, did you move the camera around until you could see the clearest focus was on her eyes and not the stocking before locking the focus and recomposing?

sirlensalot Loc: Arizona

The weddingguysaves the day again. Again using his lovely subject, would using manual focus point on the eyes also be a reasonable option? Would very much like to know why this would or would not work?
Thanks again weddingguy for your help.

Weddingguy Loc: British Columbia - Canada

kerfree wrote:

Weddingguy wrote:

kerfree wrote:

DennisK wrote:

You could try using AF-C.

Dennis, thank you! I will experiment with both AFC and also using area focus, with high speed and deeper depth of field this week - with all this great advice, I have no excuse now not to master nailing the focus!

There is more to focus than that unfortunately. Focusing an auto focus camera is an art in itself and takes some understanding and practice.
An auto-focus camera focuses on contrast and detail, and if there is more contrast or light in your background, the camera tends to go there for a focusing point.
Focusing on eyes is fine for close up stuff, but if you are a wee bit back from the subject the camera sees much more than just the eyes, so picks whatever has the most contrast in the focal area. For example the image
below . . . the camera would see approximately the amount in the circle to choose a focal point. As you can see, the area with the most contrast isn't the eyes, even although that is what is in the centre of the circle and
is what YOU want to focus on. It would probably go for the very high contrast of the stocking hung behind the subject. That would result in the eyes being out of focus.
Shooting is a three step process with auto-focus. Push the shutter release half way down and the camera focuses (and sets exposure if you are in an automatic exposure mode). The 2nd step is to recompose. The 3rd step is to push the shutter release the rest of the way to fire the shutter.
For every picture I take, I decide on a point on which to focus, in an area that doesn't have a background which could compete for attention. (For example I might focus on a white shirt and tie that are about the same distance from the camera as the eyes that I want in perfect focus) Then I
recompose the picture in my viewfinder while still holding the shutter release half way down . . then shoot.
Every shot . . . always . . . is focus . . . recompose . . . shoot. Sometimes I hold that shutter release half way down for up to a minute waiting for the right expression before shooting.

quote=kerfree quote=DennisK br br You could tr... (show quote)

Wedding Guy, you have been so kind to share your expertise. I especially appreciate your explanation of the camera seeking out the greatest contrast on which to focus - that explains a lot!

I hope you won't mind if I ask you a follow-up question. When I use spot focus for stationary objects, I follow your pattern of focusing, recomposing and shooting. But what I am understanding is that in this darling picture of your granddaughter you used area focus. So to assure the camera was focusing on her eyes instead of the stocking, did you move the camera around until you could see the clearest focus was on her eyes and not the stocking before locking the focus and recomposing?

quote=Weddingguy quote=kerfree quote=DennisK b... (show quote)

On this shot I would typically focus on where her right hand meets her sleeve. It is the same distance from the camera as her eyes. If I was using a plain background without detail and contrast, I would probably just focus on the eyes.
In this case the face was not lit before shooting the picture and the background was much more brightly lit than the face until the flash went off.

Weddingguy Loc: British Columbia - Canada

sirlensalot wrote:

The weddingguysaves the day again. Again using his lovely subject, would using manual focus point on the eyes also be a reasonable option? Would very much like to know why this would or would not work?
Thanks again weddingguy for your help.

Manual focus will work very well. The only problem is that if you don't have a fair amount of light for focussing it is quite difficult with the poor screens that are standard on most DSLRs today. Some models can have the screens replaced for better quality ones. With some now you can use "live view" and zoom in for very accurate focus. With that system manual focus is more accurate than auto focus.

ronz Loc: Florida

Yes it does on moving targets. Depress half way when you focus and it will stay in focus

sirlensalot Loc: Arizona

Weddingguy wrote:

quote=sirlensalot The weddingguysaves the day aga... (show quote)

Weddingguy- I guess when you add in the differences of sensor and view screen capabilities, it is really boiling down to experience. I personally have never used live view for portraits, but now see I must experiment further.I do believe it has been posted that live view/manual focus would benefit most from using a tripod which seems only logical for portraits.
Many more thanks for your advice.

BHC Loc: Strawberry Valley, JF, USA

kerfree wrote:

jerryc41 wrote:

MT Shooter wrote:

Are you confusing "potraiture" (static) with "action" or "candid" (moving) photography?

About a month ago, there was a discussion about how to photograph live insects and keep them from moving. The common practice was to put them into a freezer for a while. :D

Wonderful idea, Jerry! Don't tempt me - you know a determined photographer will do anything for the shot!

A fine spray of liquid nitrogen will slow them down, but they tend to get a bit brittle.