RWR Loc: La Mesa, CA

Since my opinion differs from yours, I am wrong. Okay, I can live with that!

Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC

"...For instance, if the group is arranged in straight lines, those in the center will appear noticeably larger than those at the edges. (Because they are noticeably closer to the camera.) So it is necessary to curve the lines in order to maintain more or less equal distances. Similarly, if the group is in multiple lines, those in the back will appear much smaller than those in the front...again because their relative distance from the camera is so much greater. And in fact, as you work to get more and more people in a shot using a wide angle lens, everyone gets smaller even without distortion."

Larry Page I work as a photo assist and have done many commercial gigs (I'm booked through the ASMP).
A major percentage of which are for large groups (corporations and associations i.e. my market is Washington DC) I've been professionally trained and have extensive expertise in managing and arranging groups in limited indoor venues...

My primary tool is setting up a strong and steady step ladder for the shooter to elevate above the group... Since you are an educator (physics & math) I'm certain you can appreciate where this is going... as you increase the delta to the horizon you effective compress the group together WITHOUT noticeable distortion...

Case in point for a group shot of well over a hundred persons for the Department of Labor we rented a massive 18 foot stepladder as the shooting platform... the photographer (my client) was using a Canon EF 17-40mm f/4L USM Lens. She nailed it and we both could then breath easier again... lol

Yes wide angle is a challenge that few hobbyist enjoy pursuing since composition with a telephoto is a no brainer... Going wide requires extensive skill and expertise... those who make their living with a camera typically master this... btw, Annie Leibovitz's favorite lens is the 35mm... Lord know she can rock group photos with considerable finesse...

SteveR Loc: Michigan

I can't speak to groups, by my Tokina 10-24mm on my D7000 has been great for landscapes. That range is perfect because I use the 24mm quite a bit. You'd lose that with a 10-20mm. I understand that Tokina has come out with a new 10-24mm a couple of years ago that is really excellent. Mine is quite good, too.

PHRubin Loc: Nashville TN USA

When I wanted a wide zoom, I read some articles on the subject. I wound up with the Tokina Pro 11-20 f/2.8. I couldn't be happier!

Since my main lens is a Sigma 18-300mm zoom, I don't often resort to the wider lens.

Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC

Tokina makes solid optics...

The issue I have with Nikon's AF-P DX NIKKOR 10-20mm f/4.5-5.6G VR Lens is build quality.
Plastic lens with a plastic mount... at 230 grams you're not likely to impress your clients with this optic
I'm sorry but to be perceived as a commercial shooter you best show up on site with professional looking kit...

The good news is it's feather light if you are backpacking it to the venue...

A vote here for Sigma 17-50mm f/2.8 EX DC OS HSM Lens.
Rock solid... professional build... gets you to 25mm and with highly effective OS...
One of my all time favorites... albeit just shy of the 24mm threshold for serious wide angle...

larryepage Loc: North Texas area

The Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8 DX zoom lives on one of my D500s. It's every bit as good as the 24-70mm f/2.8 FX lens, despite having been around for a long time. It's still availble new, and I occasionally see nice used ones, usually for quite favorable prices. Folks get the idea that these lenses have "no zoom range," despite the fact that their zoom ratio is actually a little bit wider than the 24-70. Built like a tank. No VR, but I've never missed it. Mine works as great today as the day I bought it 13 years ago.

GoofyNewfie Loc: Kansas City

Remember, that lens was made before Nikon had any full-frame cameras.
The build quality is right up there with the full-frame “Trinity”

Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC

Larry Page the Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8 DX is the only truly Professional Build optic in Nikon's DX offerings.

While I looked at it seriously it is still over priced and under delivers compared to the Sigma 17-50mm F2.8 EX DC OS HSM Nikon. Besides that it is extremely heavy.

But don't take my word here... DxOMark has analyzed both these stellar optics...

https://www.dxomark.com/Lenses/Nikon/AF-S-DX-Zoom-Nikkor-17-55mm-f-2.8G-IF-ED-mounted-on-Nikon-D500__1061

https://www.dxomark.com/Lenses/Sigma/17-50mm-f-2.8-EX-DC-OS-HSM-Nikon-mounted-on-Nikon-D500__1061


Here are the Sharpness Field Maps for both Click on Sharpness then Field Map
(At f/2.8 the Sigma walks away from the Nikkor)...

https://www.dxomark.com/Lenses/Nikkor/AF-S-DX-Zoom-Nikkor-17-55mm-f-2.8G-IF-ED-mounted-on-Nikon-D500---Measurements__1061

https://www.dxomark.com/Lenses/Sigma/17-50mm-f-2.8-EX-DC-OS-HSM-Nikon-mounted-on-Nikon-D500---Measurements__1061

At f/4 through f/8 the Sigma is excellent across the entire frame... While the Nikkor struggles to even reach reasonable across the frame, it actually never does... it's a weak performer optically...
Do yourself a favor Larry, upgrade to the Sigma and your see for yourself...

On the same note: The AF 35-70mm f/2.8D vintage Nikkor is vastly overrated, heavy and has to be stopped down to f/4 before you obtain usable imagery... I tested two version of this "Iconic Trinity” Nikkor and both were epic fails wide open... sent them back... enough said...

All the best on your journey Larry...

Retired CPO Loc: Travel full time in an RV

That is ridiculous.

CO

The Tamron 10-24mm f/3.5-4.5 Di II VC HLD lens is considered to be the best ultrawide zoom lens for cropped sensor cameras right now. I purchased one about six months ago. I use it on my Nikon D500. It's all around a great lens. Here are some great points:

It's fully weather sealed including a seal at the lens mount.
The HLD (High/Low torque-modulated Drive) focusing motor focuses very accurately.
It's very resistant to ghosting and flare.
It has vibration compensation.

Fully weather sealed

(Download)

StanRP Loc: Ontario Canada

If needed, 'distortion' can be corrected in post editing. There are many cases where with the available space it is not possible to get a whole group fitted in with a 50mm, or if there is room, going back will include other obstacles. With 'landscape' - the same problem, how much 'land' do you want to include? While older wide angle glass had significant distortion, Some of the newer lens along with the camera internal firmware, have their own 'distortion correction'.

snipershot

Thanks, this lens has been recommended several times.

snipershot

I don't want ultra-wide, but I am learning from you guys...thanks

GoofyNewfie Loc: Kansas City

If you use the “Quote Reply” option, we would know which post you are addressing.

RWR Loc: La Mesa, CA

“Out of proportion” may be a better term, the unnatural difference in size between near and far objects. The deeper the scene, the worse the effect. A 50mm lens will render a more natural appearance - for a wider view, I believe panoramic stitching with a normal lens is superior to a single shot with a wide angle lens.
My personal solution is to use a 58 or 60mm lens with either a 6 x 7 or 6 x 9cm film back, which results in an equivalent 35mm full frame field of view of about 28 and 24mm, respectively, without the wide angle distortion.