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I really need RAW help - please
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Oct 8, 2019 12:57:21   #
Blenheim Orange Loc: Michigan
 
I would suggest using the Canon software that came with the camera to read and interpret Canon raw files. You will be up and flying in no time, and then you can worry (or not) about all of the other stuff people are saying here later at your convenience.

Mike

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Oct 8, 2019 12:58:08   #
Sark17 Loc: Atlanta, GA
 
This is a wonderful help, thank you! I shoot on Manual but my camera allows me to either control the + or - for brightness OR my ISO, usually I like to quickly control my brightness so I leave ISO on auto, but I do need to adjust the settings as you mentioned, which will keep my ISO lower - THANK YOU!!!


Jim-Pops wrote:
This is a tough one to respond to but I will give it a try. My comments will be my work flow.
1) Insert your sd card
2) You can set Lightroom to auto open when sd card is inserted, I do not, my preference.
3) Open Lightroom and click your Library heading, upper right
4) Lower left hit Import.
5) Select a Source will come up and pick your SD Card
6) pick and choose the pictures you want to save on your drive


If you want to make major edits you can choose a picture then hit Develop
Now click Photo>edit in>Photoshop
It will take your photo and open in Photoshop to make your fine adjustments and layers if needed.

Your grain in raw vs jpg.
Not sure why we see this much noise other than your iso is 1600.🤔
But you can see in your examples the dogs hair has a lot more detail in the raw example. Raw gives you so much more detailed information that lets you draw out additional detail in shadows and highlights as your friend might have mentioned.

Your example is indicating you shot at 1600 iso. I try and keep it 1,000 or less. If outside I choose 600 or less. The lower the number the less grain/noise. You shot at 500 of a sec., your picture should be fine at around 250. Your aperture is 2.8. I think you could get just about the same bokeh with f/4. All this is in an effort to get your iso down for less noise in the picture. I think you friend will help you understand this a bit better than I can in this short post.
This is a tough one to respond to but I will give ... (show quote)

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Oct 8, 2019 12:58:43   #
cyclespeed Loc: Calgary, Alberta Canada
 
Luminar AI does 95% of my post processing of RAW. Try it and I'm sure you will be impressed while appreciating how much time it saves so you can get out there more often for more time.

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Oct 8, 2019 12:59:20   #
NCMtnMan Loc: N. Fork New River, Ashe Co., NC
 
The advantage to shooting RAW + jpg is that if you have a shot that needs some "help" you can help it more in RAW than jpg. Take plenty of memory cards with you regardless of which way you decide to shoot. Trip costs way too much to worry about the cost of a few more cards.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:00:34   #
Jim-Pops Loc: Granbury, Texas
 
Sark17 wrote:
This is a wonderful help, thank you! I shoot on Manual but my camera allows me to either control the + or - for brightness OR my ISO, usually I like to quickly control my brightness so I leave ISO on auto, but I do need to adjust the settings as you mentioned, which will keep my ISO lower - THANK YOU!!!


You can put a limit on your auto ISO setting.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:18:00   #
robertjerl Loc: Corona, California
 
You say you are using a DNG converter - do you mean a separate app? Or the built in LR capacity to convert on import? If the first than you are doing an un-needed step. Unless your version of LR is too old to have the EOS R RAW ability.

I don't know if you ever saw negatives, or Polaroid images. RAW is the equivalent of a negative without the reversed colors - it must be processed to produce the final image for viewing. The jpeg image is more like a Polaroid, all done in camera and what you see is what you get. Except a real Polaroid was a final image, unless an artist airbrushed it or similar. A digital jpeg you can edit, just not as much as a RAW.
In the days of film the darkroom work was often as or more important than the picture taking. Ansel Adams was a great photographer and an even greater darkroom wizard. He shot his images knowing what he needed in a negative to do what he wanted in the dark room to produce a final print (or prints - there are many of his images printed with different darkroom steps so you get two or more versions of the same image).

And I am sure you know that with LR you can always go back to the imported image and reprocess for a different look. I usually create a "virtual copy" so my different edits are separate and easy to find instead of one long complicated develop history menu.
You say you have 8 SD cards and worry about having RAW + Jpeg taking up a lot of room. Either take a laptop* and download or before you leave buy a bunch more SD cards - they are fairly cheap, and get one of those little protective cases for them to go through scanners or better yet request hand inspection at the airports and carry them in your carry on baggage. Hint mark and number or letter the cards to keep them straight and keep a little notebook log of cards, time, place etc. Those little notebook logs are a basic of field photography. I kept a small shirt pocket note book and then transferred my notes to a small binder type notebook each evening.
Once on a field school in southern Mexico one of the professors handed me a small book on the use of photography in field research and told me to work up a days lessons (classroom and field) on using photography - then I presented it to the whole group. In the first page of that book it said something like "film is the cheapest thing you have in the field, use a lot of it" "You may never come back to this place and you certainly won't come back to this time." In place of film think "memory cards".

*I have seen ads for external drives with built in card slots for field use, a lot smaller and lighter than a laptop - just doesn't have a screen to view images.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:26:13   #
sderiis
 
Why not set your camera up to record RAW plus JPEG. Then you won't be under pressure to figure this out before you go on your trip. JPEG images are processed in-camera and have some degree of noise reduction applied to the processed image whereas RAW files have no noise reduction applied. There are any number of programs that will reduce noise in post-processing including Lightroom and Photoshop.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:28:15   #
ecurb1105
 
Sark17 wrote:
Hello! I am new to shooting RAW and am getting more confused by the day. I have a professional photographer friend who tells me I HAVE to shoot in raw on an upcoming trip to Africa (I leave Friday!) So I started shooting raw to practice using my dogs. I figured it would be fairly straight forward - I was very wrong. I use a Canon EOS R with various lenses.

In the first screen shot you can see the JPG (right) compared to the RAW photo (left). The Raw photo is super grainy. The JPG is fine. I didn't edit any of these or even try for any good composition, just wanted to practice working with RAW and getting them off of my card - which has also proven to be complicated.

So, my questions - 1) why are my RAW photos much more grainy than JPG? I realize ISO is a bit high in this specific photo, but even when it's not at all, I get the same result. 2) what is the most straightforward way to get to get a raw file off of an SD card and actually be able to do anything with it on a Mac? Lastly, I am probably just going to shoot Large JPG to save myself the panic of ruining something trying to use RAW if I can't figure this out...

I am currently using a DNG converter to get them to Lightroom, then I am not totally sure what to do with them after that, I couldn't even figure out how to save it to post it here as an example as I did with the JPEG.

Thank you so much in advance for any tips/tricks you are willing to lend - I am pretty confused!
Hello! I am new to shooting RAW and am getting mor... (show quote)


If you have to use DNG to move your RAW files it sounds like you don't have Canon software on your computer so you don't have the proper RAW codec. Check on that. You can drop and drag files from your SD card to your computer and open in PS from there. But as you have a time bind, forget RAW and just shoot jpeg large fine. Keep your eyes open and watch your six.😎

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Oct 8, 2019 13:30:39   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA
 
Sark17 wrote:
Thank you! That makes sense. I just "de noised" the RAW in LR and it looks better already. Here's a dumb question - if you change a RAW files name, like to a DNG, does that limit what you can then do with it? If I want to process in photoshop, where I am not good at all but still more comfortable than I am in LR, could I just use LR to get them on to my computer, and somehow get them from there to either a file on my desktop or to PS? Thank you guys for helping me! I know these are elementary questions, but I just want to learn :)
Thank you! That makes sense. I just "de noise... (show quote)

DON'T just change the file extension!
RAW is one file format (ie. .CR2), DNG is totally another format. An editor will open the renamed .DNG file expecting to see the data in a DNG format, but since just the file name was changed, it will not be in the DNG format, and the editor will probably barf.

To save AS a DNG, one has to open the RAW file in an editor, then select "save as DNG" option.
The editor will put the image information in the correct format.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:33:50   #
Sark17 Loc: Atlanta, GA
 
I maybe misspoke, I didn't mean to just change the format, I have been putting them through a DNG converter just to get them to LR. Not sure that's necessary or not but LR shows a lot of them as unreadable otherwise.

Longshadow wrote:
DON'T just change the file extension!
RAW is one file format (ie. .CR2), DNG is totally another format. An editor will open the renamed .DNG file expecting to see the data in a DNG format, but since just the file name was changed, it will not be in the DNG format, and the editor will probably barf.

To save AS a DNG, one has to open the RAW file in an editor, then select "save as DNG" option.
The editor will put the image information in the correct format.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:35:27   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA
 
I also vote for saving RAW+JPEG.
You'll have your JPEG, and there will be a RAW file for your friend to work with if he likes.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:39:34   #
Sark17 Loc: Atlanta, GA
 
You are exactly right about the memory cards! though I have purchased enough of them that they add up to a nice lens but without them I won't have anything! I have about 8 256GB so I will be okay, I just know I will take a TON of photos! I can take 600 photos of my dog on a walk so I can't imagine Africa, for me, a once in a lifetime trip!

About the DNG - I did a youtube search of how to get the RAW photos off of my card and onto my computer and they recommended this converter. I tried to pull them right into LR, but I have LRCC, and about half of the photos were "unreadable". Not sure why.

With JPEG - I am pretty comfortable editing and saving different versions. With RAW - I am (obviously) clueless. I want to get the best photos possible, but I just feel like they will be stuck on an SD card for eternity.

I even edited this one of my dog in LR and it got better noise wise, but still very grainy. Not sure what steps to take after that to make it less grainy, and that is my number one issue. The actual exposure, lighting, etc, I know how to mess with in PS, but the grain/quality, that's what is making me question what I am doing wrong - or not doing right I guess. Thank you for your tips!

robertjerl wrote:
You say you are using a DNG converter - do you mean a separate app? Or the built in LR capacity to convert on import? If the first than you are doing an un-needed step. Unless your version of LR is too old to have the EOS R RAW ability.

I don't know if you ever saw negatives, or Polaroid images. RAW is the equivalent of a negative without the reversed colors - it must be processed to produce the final image for viewing. The jpeg image is more like a Polaroid, all done in camera and what you see is what you get. Except a real Polaroid was a final image, unless an artist airbrushed it or similar. A digital jpeg you can edit, just not as much as a RAW.
In the days of film the darkroom work was often as or more important than the picture taking. Ansel Adams was a great photographer and an even greater darkroom wizard. He shot his images knowing what he needed in a negative to do what he wanted in the dark room to produce a final print (or prints - there are many of his images printed with different darkroom steps so you get two or more versions of the same image).

And I am sure you know that with LR you can always go back to the imported image and reprocess for a different look. I usually create a "virtual copy" so my different edits are separate and easy to find instead of one long complicated develop history menu.
You say you have 8 SD cards and worry about having RAW + Jpeg taking up a lot of room. Either take a laptop* and download or before you leave buy a bunch more SD cards - they are fairly cheap, and get one of those little protective cases for them to go through scanners or better yet request hand inspection at the airports and carry them in your carry on baggage. Hint mark and number or letter the cards to keep them straight and keep a little notebook log of cards, time, place etc. Those little notebook logs are a basic of field photography. I kept a small shirt pocket note book and then transferred my notes to a small binder type notebook each evening.
Once on a field school in southern Mexico one of the professors handed me a small book on the use of photography in field research and told me to work up a days lessons (classroom and field) on using photography - then I presented it to the whole group. In the first page of that book it said something like "film is the cheapest thing you have in the field, use a lot of it" "You may never come back to this place and you certainly won't come back to this time." In place of film think "memory cards".

*I have seen ads for external drives with built in card slots for field use, a lot smaller and lighter than a laptop - just doesn't have a screen to view images.
You say you are using a DNG converter - do you mea... (show quote)

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Oct 8, 2019 13:49:11   #
Sark17 Loc: Atlanta, GA
 
Maybe the question then becomes how to get the grain out of RAW photos? I have PhotoshopCC, LRCC, Luminar 3 and iPhoto (which I don't think would be much help). I reduced noise and used a noise filter, and they're better but still majorly grainy.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:50:01   #
robertjerl Loc: Corona, California
 
Last October they released an update to LRCC that handles EOS R raw format. How long since you updated CC?
And LRCC has an option to do the DNG conversion on import if you wish to work with DNG instead of the Canon raw format.
After all DNG is an Adobe in house created format so they do know how to do the conversion.

And while 8 256gb SD cards sounds like a lot I have known guys who did several thousand images a day in the field, esp action, wildlife etc done on burst. And even if SD cards are available where you will be the brands/quality may be doubtful and since tourists are a more or less captive customer base the prices may be high.

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Oct 8, 2019 13:52:30   #
R.G. Loc: Scotland
 
Sark17 wrote:
......about half of the photos were "unreadable". Not sure why.......

.......the grain/quality, that's what is making me question what I am doing wrong.....


Check to see if you haven't already imported files with a similar name. Lightroom will stop you from importing what it thinks are duplicates.

You need to do sharpening and denoise together because denoise softens a photo. If you use the Masking slider in the Sharpen section it'll keep the sharpening away from the noise (which you don't want sharpened). If you hold down the Alt key (not sure what the Mac equivalent is) while you work the Masking slider you'll see what's going to be sharpened and what will be excluded. You want the sharpening to be applied mainly to the edges. If there's something like fur that you want accentuated you can apply basic sharpening via the Adjustments brush.

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