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Marisnick-Lucroy
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Jul 13, 2019 09:59:33   #
SteveR Loc: Michigan
 
Busbum wrote:
I'm sorry, he was moving forward to the ball, he was 3 feet in front of home plate, when trying to catch the ball on the infield side of the foul line and Marishnick went out of his way to hit him, because he knew he was going to be out if Lucroy caught the ball... Marishnick did have a clear path if he decided not to go after Lucroy, simple as that... The players should always avoid this type of contact, its baseball, not football!!!


Watch the slo-mo.

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Jul 13, 2019 10:14:03   #
Collhar Loc: New York City.
 
SteveR wrote:
To BobHartung and Collhar my response would be...if the headline doesn't pique your interest or you don't know what it is....why open it?

Jeep Daddy.....I went back to the tape. If you'll look closely, Lucroy's back foot is blocking the plate at the very beginning of the play, as the ball is in the air. As Marisnick takes the inside path, Lucroy moves forward. Based on the fact that Lucroy's back foot was blocking home plate, interference should be the call. Look closely and let me know what you think. Here's the slo-mo video showing Lucroy's foot blocking the plate:

https://www.12up.com/posts/video-astros-jake-marisnick-destroys-angels-catcher-jonathan-lucroy-in-nasty-home-plate-collision-01df79cmk7p2
To BobHartung and Collhar my response would be...i... (show quote)


Curiosity killed the cat but satisfaction brought it back. Lighten up. I did not know what or who they were.

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Jul 13, 2019 10:32:44   #
SteveR Loc: Michigan
 
Collhar wrote:
Curiosity killed the cat but satisfaction brought it back. Lighten up. I did not know what or who they were.


So why even comment on a topic of which you have no knowledge? If you felt a need to make a remark about something you don't know anything about....don't be surprised to get some blowback. Sheesh. Lighten up.

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Jul 13, 2019 11:51:13   #
Collhar Loc: New York City.
 
SteveR wrote:
So why even comment on a topic of which you have no knowledge? If you felt a need to make a remark about something you don't know anything about....don't be surprised to get some blowback. Sheesh. Lighten up.


It's about two guys who don't give a rats behind if you wake up in the morning. For me it is one of the most boring games on the planet. My husband has season tickets for the Yankees. He kept after me to go to a game. I went thinking it might be more interesting than watching it on TV. I was wrong. The interesting part were the people around you. The game not so much. For me as boring as watching it on TV. Still standing around scratching, spitting kicking dirt/grass. So in conclusion my knowledge and my take on the game is that it is boring. Attendance is down, again. I guess I am not alone.

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Jul 13, 2019 12:32:04   #
av8nbuff Loc: Rock and Roll Capital, Cleveland, Ohio
 
Glad you enjoyed your time behind the dish Steve. I did also, until my knees blew out from catching 3 times a week and double headers. I always felt that the most involved player on the field is the catcher...setting the defense, relaying signals, studying the opposition with the coaches and pitching staff to determine pitch sequences, loc and positions. I humbly suggest you research the origin and definition of the term "tools of ignorance". I refer to MLB.com:
Definition
"Tools of ignorance" is a nickname for the catcher's equipment.

Origin
Coined by catcher Herold "Muddy" Ruel, who played from 1915 through 1934 and Bill Dickey, the term is meant to point out the irony that a player with the intelligence needed to be effective behind the plate would be foolish enough to play a position that required so much safety equipment.

I played for a mid major program and was a student athlete with a scholarship. While I disagree with your assessment of my talents and intelligence, I am sure we can both agree that the incident was indeed unfortunate and could have been avoided. Enjoy the day!

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Jul 13, 2019 13:28:39   #
SteveR Loc: Michigan
 
av8nbuff wrote:
Glad you enjoyed your time behind the dish Steve. I did also, until my knees blew out from catching 3 times a week and double headers. I always felt that the most involved player on the field is the catcher...setting the defense, relaying signals, studying the opposition with the coaches and pitching staff to determine pitch sequences, loc and positions. I humbly suggest you research the origin and definition of the term "tools of ignorance". I refer to MLB.com:
Definition
"Tools of ignorance" is a nickname for the catcher's equipment.

Origin
Coined by catcher Herold "Muddy" Ruel, who played from 1915 through 1934 and Bill Dickey, the term is meant to point out the irony that a player with the intelligence needed to be effective behind the plate would be foolish enough to play a position that required so much safety equipment.

I juI played for a mid major program and was a student athlete with a scholarship. While I disagree with your assessment of my talents and intelligence, I am sure we can both agree that the incident was indeed unfortunate and could have been avoided. Enjoy the day!
Glad you enjoyed your time behind the dish Steve. ... (show quote)



I never looked upon them as "tools of ignorance." That indicates, to me, some lackey being put in the gear out of ignorance. I always donned the gear eagerly and with anticipation and looked forward to outwitting the best hitters.

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Jul 13, 2019 14:03:06   #
av8nbuff Loc: Rock and Roll Capital, Cleveland, Ohio
 
Well, good for you! I'm glad we share the same enthusiasm, although from differing vantage points. I share your opinion of the prestige the position holds and would hardly consider the likes of Carlton Fisk, Pudge Rodriguez, Sandy Alomar and Thurman Munson as "lackeys". Enjoy the day

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Jul 13, 2019 14:04:37   #
AirWalter Loc: Tipp City, Ohio
 
Collhar wrote:
So true. I have no idea who these people are.


Well, guess what. There are a lot of people who do know who they are and are interested in sports. Everything that goes on in this world doesn't revolve around you!

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Jul 13, 2019 14:55:35   #
SteveR Loc: Michigan
 
av8nbuff wrote:
Well, good for you! I'm glad we share the same enthusiasm, although from differing vantage points. I share your opinion of the prestige the position holds and would hardly consider the likes of Carlton Fisk, Pudge Rodriguez, Sandy Alomar and Thurman Munson as "lackeys". Enjoy the day


Speaking of Pudge. I was at a game where Pudge had a guy thrown out at second by so much that the guy turned around to go back to first. Pudge had a cannon.

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Jul 13, 2019 16:48:28   #
Collhar Loc: New York City.
 
AirWalter wrote:
Well, guess what. There are a lot of people who do know who they are and are interested in sports. Everything that goes on in this world doesn't revolve around you!


True. If you think the world revolves around only baseball. Broaden your horizons.

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Jul 13, 2019 17:06:58   #
jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ
 
jeep_daddy wrote:
You need to look a little closer at the video. Lucroy had his left foot on the first base side of the plate, (sort of behind) but not blocking the approaching Marisnick from the 3rd base side. Also, Lucroy's left foot is on the infield side of the 3rd base line. In other words, half of the plate is clearly accessible to Marisnick. Marisnick could have easily slid into home on the outside of the line and reached in with his left hand and completely avoided running into Lucroy. This is very clear. One other thing, Marisnick clearly deviated to the left about 8 feet before home and he purposely plowed into Lucroy head first.
You need to look a little closer at the video. Lu... (show quote)



fourlocks wrote:
I have to agree with jeep-daddy. In one of the videos, you can clearly see that Lucroy was not on the baseline and leaned about 2 feet to his right, away from the baseline, as he tried to catch the ball. From that same angle, you can see Marsnick take his last couple of steps to his left, off the baseline, in order to squarely hit Lucroy. Yes, catchers often block the plate but this was simply a blatant cheap shot on Marsnick's part.


Thank you Fourlocks. That's the way I see it too. There was another view that is not shown in the link but was shown when they showed all the replays during the game. I taped the game and saw all the replays on a big screen tv. Lucroy was not in the way of Marisnick and Marisnick clearly turned into Lucroy. End of Story!

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Jul 13, 2019 18:36:09   #
crushr13 Loc: Sacramento, CA
 
I saw this play on TV, too. The bottom line in this play is that, with all of the reviews, Lucroy was clearly playing catcher within the scope of the rules, and did allow Marisnick a path to the plate, also in accordance with the rules. Marisnick, in this case, unnecessarily changed his path from the foul side of the third base line, clearly the runners base running path, which was established from the time he left third base and going to the plate, and then he clearly changed that path from a clear running path into the catcher, who was catching the throw from another fielder. This is in full accord with the rules, as written and approved by the Major Leagues Players Union, and especially since it did not, in any way, shape, or form, take him into the path of the runner attempting to score.

If you say that Lucroy was wrong, then delete the catcher from the game of baseball, because you are saying that he can NEVER make a play at the plate, even in accordance with the rules of baseball.

(Stupid Astros fans.)

The ONLY reason Marisnick was suspended was that only Marisnick changed his path from an allowed one to ATTACK the catcher to prevent him from making a legal play. Lucroy was only making the legal play, and was never in the path of the runner when the runner was in the area of the play, but WAS, look at the replay again, clearly out of the baseline, as he was all in fair territory at the time Marisnick hit Lucroy. At the time, it looked like it was inadvertent, and Marisnick didn't mean it. But upon looking closer with slo-mo replay, he clearly deviated his path to knock the catcher out of the way, when he was not even in the way. And because of all of that, he not only was suspended, but was also fined. And righteously. And anyone who ever was a catcher, or bowled over in a play at the plate who does not see that must never have played the position in reality.

Period.

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Jul 13, 2019 18:40:23   #
BigDen Loc: Alberta, Canada
 
SteveR wrote:
If you call them the "tools of ignorance" then you just got shoved behind the plate to fill a need without a love for the position. Sad. Some of us loved being in on every pitch and knew the ins and outs of the position, which is why I know that Lucroy screwed up.


You are wrong. Look at the coverage from behind the plate. Lucroy was at all times in fair territory. He was moving the catch the ball. Marisnick clearly versed off the baseline into Lucroy and lowered his head and shoulder into Lucroy. He could have and should have avoided the collision.

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Jul 13, 2019 19:21:08   #
AirWalter Loc: Tipp City, Ohio
 
Collhar wrote:
True. If you think the world revolves around only baseball. Broaden your horizons.


That is a stupid remark on your part. I didn't say a damn thing about anything revolving around baseball. My remark was about the response you guys gave about the OPs post. I haven't watched baseball in years. You both just gave smart ass remarks for no damn reason at all. Too many times in today's world any time someone says something about anything there is always someone acting like an ass trying to turn it into a pissing contest. Jerk!!!

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Jul 13, 2019 20:52:19   #
SteveR Loc: Michigan
 
BigDen wrote:
You are wrong. Look at the coverage from behind the plate. Lucroy was at all times in fair territory. He was moving the catch the ball. Marisnick clearly versed off the baseline into Lucroy and lowered his head and shoulder into Lucroy. He could have and should have avoided the collision.


My big point is that at the beginning of the play Lucroy's bag foot is blocking home plate. He should have been completely in front of home plate since he did not have the ball. Only then does he move forward to catch the ball, which is when Marisnick hit him. Check the slo-mo video and you'll see what I'm talking about. Lucroy left Marisnick no path from the beginning of the play to the end.

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