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Jul 6, 2018 10:48:01   #
jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ
 
Downright awesome pictures. Keep using BBF & you'll get used to it.


inclinerr wrote:
I have a Nikon D3400 camera with the two kit lens 18-55 and 70-300. My enjoyment with this camera in my retirement is just wonderful.
However I read about changing the button on the back to do the focus and use only the shutter release to take the picture.
Now I am juggling using two buttons 1) to focus and 2) snap the picture. This sometimes has caused me to miss an action shot.
Has anyone else tried out this arrangement of buttons on their camera and what are your opinions, advantages, and or short comings?

Here is a 3 photos showing what I have shot with the camera using the 55-300 lens.
I have a Nikon D3400 camera with the two kit lens ... (show quote)

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Jul 6, 2018 10:52:06   #
joe p Loc: Philadelphia, PA
 
I started using BBF (actually front button focus since I am left eye dominant) about 3 months. I usually practice focusing when I get to a shoot just to remind myself of the focusing arrangement. Still get occasionally flummoxed when I press the shutter and the camera is out of focus. Just keep at it. Do use Continuous auto focus mode to get the best benefit

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Jul 6, 2018 10:56:46   #
bpulv Loc: Buena Park, CA
 
inclinerr wrote:
I have a Nikon D3400 camera with the two kit lens 18-55 and 70-300. My enjoyment with this camera in my retirement is just wonderful.
However I read about changing the button on the back to do the focus and use only the shutter release to take the picture.
Now I am juggling using two buttons 1) to focus and 2) snap the picture. This sometimes has caused me to miss an action shot.
Has anyone else tried out this arrangement of buttons on their camera and what are your opinions, advantages, and or short comings?

Here is a 3 photos showing what I have shot with the camera using the 55-300 lens.
I have a Nikon D3400 camera with the two kit lens ... (show quote)


I use BBF on all my cameras and I would not go back. It does take practice to become proficient at using the method, but you will find that it is worth the effort. It offers much better, more precise and faster control of the focusing function of your camera.

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Jul 6, 2018 11:02:15   #
kerry12 Loc: Harrisburg, Pa.
 
I was under the understanding that if you held the back button down, it would continually focus. Is that not the case? I do not use it but have been thinking about it.
AndyH wrote:
It drives me crazy, absolutely stark raving bonkers.

Here's why: BBF is obviously better for more artistic compositions of architecture, landscapes, still life, etc. This is my favorite type of photography and using it separately from exposure locking gives me a lot more creative control.

But if I'm shooting sports, wildlife, family photos, or some work-related documentary shots, I need continuous autofocus mode, and I never remember to switch the damn thing back. I suppose I will eventually get in the habit of checking image format (I delete dozens of unused RAW files I've taken for work that don't even demand a large JPEG) and focus method every single time I pick up my camera. Eventually may be a long time, though!


Andy
It drives me crazy, absolutely stark raving bonker... (show quote)

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Jul 6, 2018 11:11:49   #
dbgrizzzz
 
You can set the focus to AF-A and it will work as an AF-S if the subject is stationary, and switch to AF-C if it detects movement. By doing this, you preserve the in focus beep and the AF illuminator light (which is disabled using AF-C}. Also, you can reassign the shutter button to Auto expose lock when pressed halfway. This is how I set up my back button focus, and it gives me the best of both methods.

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Jul 6, 2018 11:19:46   #
Nalu Loc: Southern Arizona
 
Yes, and other applications as well. I was shooting Grebes the other day in dense foliage on the water. As the bird moved in and out of the foliage, had I been using shutter button focus, the likelihood of the camera refocusing on the veg. would have increased. Using BBF, I could grab a focus and as long as the bird stayed parallel with me, even with the vegetation coming in an out of the view, I could keep focus. Just an example. In some cases, shutter button focus can be really tough and back button can allow maintain focus. As you get to know your camera better, switching between shutter button and back button becomes a snap. Good luck!

Bill_de wrote:
Do you now use the 'back button' to lock focus and exposure when you want to recompose with a static subject? Once I started doing that I realized I could always leave my cameras in continuous focus mode. For me it's the best of both worlds. When I do recompose my exposure is still base on the light hitting the subject.

--

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Jul 6, 2018 11:21:07   #
amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA
 
kenievans wrote:
I use BBF almost all the time for static shots or when not trying to stop motion. I can lock in the focus then use a different area to meter the exposure with the shutter button. Great for shots with a variance in light sources or high dynamics like night shots. It doesn't work well with action shots. You need your focus to change as the subject moves. That is when I use AI Focus. I am by no means an expert and I hope I explained it correctly but this works for me.


Sorry, but you've got it completely backwards, are using the wrong focusing mode and you're conflating focusing and metering functions.

I've been using BBF with Canon for over fifteen years, many hundreds of thousands of images, and probably a dozen or more different camera models. I average 98% or better of my shots accurately and acceptably in focus.

BBF is PRIMARILY a sports/action/moving subject technique. In fact, it was first popularized by Canon sports photographers. Canon or Nikon or whatever, BBF can be applied to and used with any type of subject, but the main reason to use it is to be prepared for moving subjects... sports, wildlife... any sort of action.

First, you need to understand the focusing modes of the cameras. Canon and Nikon are similar (others probably are, too):

Nikon AF-S and Canon One Shot modes are for stationary subjects. When activated in this mode, the camera and lens achieve focus, then stop, lock and give you "focus confirmation" (which can be an LED illuminating or an audible "beep" or both). This mode cannot be used with moving subjects. If the distance between subject and photography change after the focus has been achieved and locked, focus will no longer be correct.

Another thing that can cause missed focus, even with stationary subjects, is that many modern zoom lenses are varifocal. This means they don't maintain accurate focus when zoomed. If you focus and then change a varifocal zoom's focal length, in this mode you have to remember to re-do focus. You must lift off the shutter release or back button and then reapply it, when using One Shot or AF-S.

Canon AI Servo and Nikon AF-C are a continuous focusing mode for use with moving subjects. In this mode the camera and lens will keep changing and updating focus continuously as long as you maintain half-press on the shutter release or pressure on the back button. Focus never stops and locks, so focus confirmation isn't possible.

Without BBF, it's not possible to use a focus and recompose method with AI Servo/AF-C. Focus and recompose really is only used with stationary subjects and the reason you can't use it without BBF is that as soon as you recompose your image, the camera & lens will want to change focus away from the subject. But if you have BBF set up, once focus is achieved you can stop it (i.e., "lock it"), simply by lifting thumb pressure off the button. You can then recompose without concern.

Canon AI Focus and Nikon AF-A aren't really focus modes at all. They're "point n shoot" style automation. The camera is supposed to determine whether the subject is moving or not, then switch to using the correct focusing mode. In my experience, there's some slight delay doing this and the camera sometimes chooses incorrectly or fails to switch if a subject starts or stops moving after AF has been started. When I experimented with AI Focus, I saw a big increase in missed focus shots. Now, to be fair, I haven't used it in many years... newer cameras might do it better. HOWEVER, notice that the manufacturers' most advanced, pro-oriented cameras don't even have this mode... they only have AF-S/One Shot and AF-C/AI Servo. This might be a hint!

If using BBF and AI Servo/AF-C, there really is no need for AF-A/AI Focus. You can use BBF/AI Servo/AF-C with any type of subject. And you can start and stop the focus yourself any time you like, simply using thumb pressure.

Back Button Focusing is already set up on many current and recent cameras. The Canon I'm most familiar with have an "AF-On" button (and I think many Nikon are similar). In this case, when you set up BBF what you're actually doing is disabling focus at the shutter release button, so that it ONLY functions with that back button. But it depends upon camera model. Canon's more entry level models don't have an "AF-On" button on the back, so you have to assign BBF to the * (AE-Lock) button instead. This was the case with many older Canon models, too. (Possible problem with those models was that you'd no longer have direct means of setting AE-Lock... but an easy work around is to just use M exposure mode when you need AE Lock. That serves the same purpose.)

It takes a little practice to get accustomed to using BBF. But it eventually becomes second nature. I use it most of the time with AI Servo and a single AF point selected. This puts me in full control of when and where the camera & lens focus. It's more work for me, but makes for far fewer focus errors.

BBF isn't for everyone. Someone who never or only very rarely shoots moving subjects may not need it at all. Other folks may want to continue to switch between focusing modes themselves... or set the camera to let it choose modes for you.

On the other hand, a lot of people I've taught the technique come to love using BBF and enjoy a big increase in focus accuracy once they understand and have gotten accustomed to it.

BBF allows me to leave my cameras in AI Servo (continuous focus) mode all the time. I can use that as my default mode, instantly ready to shoot subjects whether they are moving or not, and ready if they start or stop moving. Another big benefit is that a continuous focus mode instantly corrects any loss of focus that may occur if using a varifocal zoom. The only down side is no focus confirmation... I had to learn to trust the camera, lens and myself.

Metering is another thing entirely.... a rather complex topic for a separate discussion.

kerry12 wrote:
I was under the understanding that if you held the back button down, it would continually focus. Is that not the case?


The focusing mode you have selected decides how AF will work, regardless whether or not you have BBF set up and are using it.

If you have the camera set to AF-C (Nikon) or AI Servo (Canon)... Yes, focus will be continuous as long as you maintain pressure on the button. And it will stop focusing as soon as you lift your thumb off the button.

But if you have the camera set to AF-S (Nikon) or One Shot (Canon).... No, pressing the button starts focus and as soon as it's achieved, the camera will stop focus and lock... even if you continue pressing the button. If subject or you or both move and distance changes (or is you zoom a varifocal lens), you have to consciously lift your thumb and then reapply pressure, in order to make the camera & lens re-focus. (The same is necessary with the shutter button, if not using BBF).

P.S. I have my cameras set to "beep" focus confirmation. Since that only works in One Shot (Canon... AF-S Nikon) mode, it alerts me immediately if I'm in the wrong focusing mode for moving subjects. (It's amazing to me how often I hear peoples' cameras "beeping" at sporting events, shooting active, moving subjects.... which pretty much guarantees that MOST of those images will miss focus. I bet they blame the gear, too! )

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Jul 6, 2018 11:25:37   #
Silverman Loc: Michigan
 
inclinerr wrote:
I have a Nikon D3400 camera with the two kit lens 18-55 and 70-300. My enjoyment with this camera in my retirement is just wonderful.
However I read about changing the button on the back to do the focus and use only the shutter release to take the picture.
Now I am juggling using two buttons 1) to focus and 2) snap the picture. This sometimes has caused me to miss an action shot.
Has anyone else tried out this arrangement of buttons on their camera and what are your opinions, advantages, and or short comings?

Here is a 3 photos showing what I have shot with the camera using the 55-300 lens.
I have a Nikon D3400 camera with the two kit lens ... (show quote)


Nice images you have taken!



As concerning the B.B.F. issue, I personally have recently begun using B.B.F. on my Nikon D3300, and yes at first is seemed a little awkward, but as I continue to work with it, seems to become more natural. I like it. Yes, I had my doubts about B.B.F. and now I feel positive about it, so I will recommend that you give it "TIME" and hopefully you too will become a Fan of B.B.F.

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Jul 6, 2018 11:41:03   #
DVZ Loc: Littleton CO
 
Here is a clear article by Steve Perry on the benefits of back button focus.

https://backcountrygallery.com/free-back-button-af-guide-for-nikon/

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Jul 6, 2018 11:50:58   #
dbgrizzzz
 
Once you use the back button focus on a stationary object, the focus will remain at that setting, even if you turn the camera off and back on again. No need to focus with every shot. And if you hold the bbf button down on a moving subject, it will keep that subject in focus as it moves. Very convenient.

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Jul 6, 2018 11:53:05   #
JeffDavidson Loc: Originally Detroit Now Los Angeles
 
Nice Photos!

BBF is best for action shots and burst shooting. If you were to take pictures of a horse race, birds in flight, etc. where the distance kept changing, normally you would have to release pressure on the shutter, press it half-way to focus and then press all of the way to expose your picture. Obviously that would take way too much time and you would miss your sot. With BBF and the button held down, you basically have continuous focusing on your subject.

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Jul 6, 2018 12:06:36   #
DanCulleton
 
For me BBF is reserved for a slower style of shooting couples with a tripod.

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Jul 6, 2018 12:23:24   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
JeffDavidson wrote:
Nice Photos!

BBF is best for action shots and burst shooting. If you were to take pictures of a horse race, birds in flight, etc. where the distance kept changing, normally you would have to release pressure on the shutter, press it half-way to focus and then press all of the way to expose your picture. Obviously that would take way too much time and you would miss your sot. With BBF and the button held down, you basically have continuous focusing on your subject.


Continuous focus is not limited to bbf. It works just as well with shutter button half press. Once again it is lack of knowledge that makes BBF populalar.

--

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Jul 6, 2018 12:39:01   #
DVZ Loc: Littleton CO
 
It's also great for stationary. I shoot some products that I need to bracket because of dynamic range issues. I use BB to acquire focus where I want it, recompose if necessary then shoot the bracket without needing to reacquire focus between each shot and worrying if the focus is changing. I used to change between single shot and continuous, but since I decoupled the focus and shutter release I mostly keep my camera on continuous. For stationary subjects I hit the focus once and am free to shoot whenever without needing to worry about re-focus even if I recompose. No need to hold down the shutter release half-way. For moving subjects you just hold down the BB and the camera follows you don't have to think about holding you shutter release half-way between shots. It's not just for moving subjects, BB reduces the need from going back and forth between SS and continuous, it's both. I assign my focus to one of the front buttons as that works better for me than the rear BB.

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Jul 6, 2018 13:04:07   #
tomcat
 
AndyH wrote:
It drives me crazy, absolutely stark raving bonkers.

Here's why: BBF is obviously better for more artistic compositions of architecture, landscapes, still life, etc. This is my favorite type of photography and using it separately from exposure locking gives me a lot more creative control.

But if I'm shooting sports, wildlife, family photos, or some work-related documentary shots, I need continuous autofocus mode, and I never remember to switch the damn thing back. I suppose I will eventually get in the habit of checking image format (I delete dozens of unused RAW files I've taken for work that don't even demand a large JPEG) and focus method every single time I pick up my camera. Eventually may be a long time, though!


Andy
It drives me crazy, absolutely stark raving bonker... (show quote)



I don't understand your comment Andy. I shoot HS sports and use BFF all the time with my D500. It is set to AF-C, 21-points, shutter release priority, 3 sec delay for the focus tracking lock. I just hold down the BFF button and let 'er rip. I never miss an action shot so long as I hold down the button. I don't ever change it, even when shooting static subjects.

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