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The ACA is Closing Rural Hospitals.
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Nov 14, 2014 20:42:26   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
PNagy wrote:
This is a very weak article, Blurry. In two pages it has less than three lines that attempt to explain how Obamacare is the cause of rural hospitals closing. One reason given is the requirement to convert to electronic record keeping. The other is the claim that Obamacare penalizes them when they have to readmit a patient. One has to wonder about the quality of a medical facility that does not even have computerized record keeping systems. Would it be equally oppressive to require that they have phones? The other charge of being penalized for readmission of patients is not explained. Is the author claiming that Obamacare fines hospitals for readmitting patients? If that is the case, why does this practice bankrupt small rural hospitals, but not large urban ones? The alleged fines should be roughly the same percentage of total revenue in each case. For the record, Obamacare does not fine hospitals for having to readmit anyone. It does offer incentives for effective preventive care. When incentives are lost, that is hardly the equivalent of a fine or a penalty. In any case, your article only jumped on data showing rural hospitals closing and blamed it on Obamacare without offering any legitimate justification. You are once again reaching far to the right to grab at straws.
This is a very weak article, Blurry. In two pages ... (show quote)


The electronic record keeping systems are quite expensive, for a small rural hospital serving low income communities many of the patients relying on medicaid it is an expense that can not be met. As far as re-admissions? They can not control the behavior of their patients nor can they change poor personal habits that are often prevalent in these communities...

But I guess that you are saying that no local healthcare facilities or more importantly emergency services are better for these communities than the hospitals on which they and their families have been in the past able to rely on... I wonder how many lives may be lost in emergency situations when a family may have to travel 50 miles to obtain medical help? I have lived in such a community and I can tell you any hospital is better than none at all.

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Nov 14, 2014 21:31:09   #
phcaan Loc: Willow Springs, MO
 
PNagy wrote:
You mean like those i***ts who keep insisting that "intelligent design" be given a voice equal to real science?


No, like any i***t who supports the most inept administration in history.

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Nov 16, 2014 09:33:32   #
PNagy Loc: Missouri City, Texas
 
Blurry: The electronic record keeping systems are quite expensive, for a small rural hospital serving low income communities many of the patients relying on medicaid it is an expense that can not be met.

Nagy: Oh, you have priced them? There is not a choice?

Blurry: As far as re-admissions? They can not control the behavior of their patients nor can they change poor personal habits that are often prevalent in these communities...

Nagy: This is nonsense by which you are pretending to answer the question of how ACA is k*****g small rural hospitals because of readmissions. I stated that it would seem the percentage of readmissions in most hospitals would tend to be the same. I also said that ACA offers incentives for preventive measures, but the article you posted says it punishes for readmissions.

Blurry: But I guess that you are saying that no local healthcare facilities or more importantly emergency services are better for these communities than the hospitals on which they and their families have been in the past able to rely on... I wonder how many lives may be lost in emergency situations when a family may have to travel 50 miles to obtain medical help? I have lived in such a community and I can tell you any hospital is better than none at all.

Nagy: Some lives will indeed be lost, but the article you posted does not really explain that the closures are caused by Obamacare. I suspect low volume business is at the root of the closures, but without making a case for it, the article, and you blame Obamacare. The article had all of three lines about the alleged causes in a page piece, and what was presented was very weak, So is your defense of it.

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Nov 16, 2014 09:40:37   #
idaholover Loc: Nampa ID
 
dljen wrote:
You are so right about education, Soba. In AZ, not exactly the hotspot for intelligence, the school board has begun tearing pages out of the high school biology books. Thankfully, in this last e******n, the religious nuts were v**ed out but I guess it won't stop until the beginning of the year when the new ones take their places. :(

And we probably never thought this was possible in America.

"In AZ, not exactly the hotspot for intelligence"
Once again, Donna, intellectual center of the universe, along with Joseph Grubber, can malign an entire state because of her hatred for Christianity!
What a chump!

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Nov 16, 2014 11:28:07   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
PNagy wrote:
Blurry: The electronic record keeping systems are quite expensive, for a small rural hospital serving low income communities many of the patients relying on medicaid it is an expense that can not be met.

Nagy: Oh, you have priced them? There is not a choice?

Blurry: As far as re-admissions? They can not control the behavior of their patients nor can they change poor personal habits that are often prevalent in these communities...

Nagy: This is nonsense by which you are pretending to answer the question of how ACA is k*****g small rural hospitals because of readmissions. I stated that it would seem the percentage of readmissions in most hospitals would tend to be the same. I also said that ACA offers incentives for preventive measures, but the article you posted says it punishes for readmissions.

Blurry: But I guess that you are saying that no local healthcare facilities or more importantly emergency services are better for these communities than the hospitals on which they and their families have been in the past able to rely on... I wonder how many lives may be lost in emergency situations when a family may have to travel 50 miles to obtain medical help? I have lived in such a community and I can tell you any hospital is better than none at all.

Nagy: Some lives will indeed be lost, but the article you posted does not really explain that the closures are caused by Obamacare. I suspect low volume business is at the root of the closures, but without making a case for it, the article, and you blame Obamacare. The article had all of three lines about the alleged causes in a page piece, and what was presented was very weak, So is your defense of it.
Blurry: The electronic record keeping systems are ... (show quote)


Yup!, we do....

Quote:
The steep price of EHR and provider uncertainty regarding the value they will derive from adoption in the form of return on investment has a significant influence on EHR adoption. In a project initiated by the Office of the National Coordinator for Health Information (ONC), surveyors found that hospital administrators and physicians who had adopted EHR noted that any gains in efficiency were offset by reduced productivity as the technology was implemented, as well as the need to increase information technology staff to maintain the system.

The U.S. Congressional Budget Office concluded that the cost savings may occur only in large integrated institutions like Kaiser Permanente, and not in small physician offices. They challenged the Rand Corporation's estimates of savings. "Office-based physicians in particular may see no benefit if they purchase such a product—and may even suffer financial harm. Even though the use of health IT could generate cost savings for the health system at large that might offset the EHR's cost, many physicians might not be able to reduce their office expenses or increase their revenue sufficiently to pay for it. For example, the use of health IT could reduce the number of duplicated diagnostic tests. However, that improvement in efficiency would be unlikely to increase the income of many physicians." One CEO of an EHR company has argued if a physician performs tests in the office, it might reduce his or her income.

Doubts have been raised about cost saving from EHRs by researchers at Harvard University, the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, Stanford University, and others.
The steep price of EHR and provider uncertainty re... (show quote)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_health_record#Costs

There are a lot articles on this Peter from all kinds of sources, I am just suggesting that it is quite possible that the ACA is having some potentially significant negative effects in small rural communities... I have seen many reports of doctors just closing up shop rather than make the mandated changes required by the ACA.

I have seen other such reports, seems last year a significant hospital closed in Texas that was serving mostly minority patients because of their inability to secure reimbursement from the federal government because of changes that came into effect with Obamacare.

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Nov 16, 2014 12:26:56   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
Blurryeyed wrote:
Obamacare, aka "The Liar's Law" is forcing the closure of small rural hospitals all across America.

http://www.usatoday.com/longform/news/nation/2014/11/12/rural-hospital-closings-federal-reimbursement-medicaid-aca/18532471/


My understanding is that this is only happening in states that refused to allow Medicare to more people

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Nov 16, 2014 12:32:03   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
dljen wrote:
You are so right about education, Soba. In AZ, not exactly the hotspot for intelligence, the school board has begun tearing pages out of the high school biology books. Thankfully, in this last e******n, the religious nuts were v**ed out but I guess it won't stop until the beginning of the year when the new ones take their places. :(

And we probably never thought this was possible in America.


I'm sure that Az. has redeeming qualities but my understanding is they still refuse to accept the MLK jr holiday and when the Montreal protocol went into effect they notified the feds that "Arizona is not party to the Montreal Protocol". My understanding is that there is no refrigerant manufactured in Az. so there was no effect.

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Nov 16, 2014 13:51:44   #
phcaan Loc: Willow Springs, MO
 
thom w wrote:
I'm sure that Az. has redeeming qualities but my understanding is they still refuse to accept the MLK jr holiday and when the Montreal protocol went into effect they notified the feds that "Arizona is not party to the Montreal Protocol". My understanding is that there is no refrigerant manufactured in Az. so there was no effect.


If more states would stand up and put the federal government in its place, we would be better off today.

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Nov 16, 2014 14:19:22   #
PNagy Loc: Missouri City, Texas
 
phcaan wrote:
If more states would stand up and put the federal government in its place, we would be better off today.


You mean like the time some states tried to put the federal government in its place regarding s***ery?

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Nov 16, 2014 14:20:26   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
phcaan wrote:
If more states would stand up and put the federal government in its place, we would be better off today.


And more people would be without health insurance and more small rural hospitals would close. But, you sure would show them, I guess.

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Nov 16, 2014 14:23:03   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
PNagy wrote:
You mean like the time some states tried to put the federal government in its place regarding s***ery?


They didn't just try to keep s***ery they tried to destroy the United States. So far the Confederacy is the greatest threat this Country has faced. Except for Pearl Harbor no other enemy has brought the fight to our homeland.

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Nov 16, 2014 14:26:09   #
phcaan Loc: Willow Springs, MO
 
thom w wrote:
And more people would be without health insurance and more small rural hospitals would close. But, you sure would show them, I guess.


If the federal government would secure our borders many small hospitals would not have to close due to the flood of illegal folks overflowing their emergency rooms with no intention of paying for service. Many small medical institutions have gone out of business because of the drain on their finances.

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Nov 16, 2014 14:28:20   #
phcaan Loc: Willow Springs, MO
 
PNagy wrote:
You mean like the time some states tried to put the federal government in its place regarding s***ery?


I've had enough. My stomach can only tolerate so much liberal trash.

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Nov 16, 2014 14:30:28   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
phcaan wrote:
I've had enough. My stomach can only tolerate so much liberal trash.


Please don't tell me you support the confederacy. I'm thinking you don't.

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Nov 16, 2014 14:31:51   #
thom w Loc: San Jose, CA
 
phcaan wrote:
I've had enough. My stomach can only tolerate so much liberal trash.


I'm thinking that you said on here that you're not angry but you sound angry.

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