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Exposure, tired of the endless argumentation.
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Sep 2, 2016 22:36:01   #
Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.
 
Rongnongno wrote:
I like the negative reaction of a few of you.

One just made made my ignore list once and for all.

To display any irritation over repeated arguments is now a new thing to avoid on UHH. Sorry but being 'UHH 'Correct is not part of my make-up. I say what I want to say when I want to say it and do not need anyone approval or rejection.

As to 'attention seeker' I just notice that those who claim that or become insulting are trying get the said attention. One did more than the others.

Enjoy your silliness. I most certainly do.
I like the negative reaction of a few of you. br ... (show quote)


Did I actually achieve something today?

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Sep 2, 2016 23:39:59   #
Quixdraw Loc: x
 
Wrongo -- just gas on the fire again -- if you truly believe every shot requires PP you are not what you claim to be. Go about your "merry" way and let the rest of us alone to develop and enjoy developing our skills. You would make the ignore list ex. the old adage -- "keep your friends close, but your (opinionated) enemies closer." You might allow yourself (and the rest of us) to have a good day occasionally. Where are all your brilliant PP images?

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Sep 2, 2016 23:53:16   #
Rongnongno Loc: FL
 
quixdraw wrote:
Wrongo -- just gas on the fire again -- if you truly believe every shot requires PP you are not what you claim to be. Go about your "merry" way and let the rest of us alone to develop and enjoy developing our skills. You would make the ignore list ex. the old adage -- "keep your friends close, but your (opinionated) enemies closer." You might allow yourself (and the rest of us) to have a good day occasionally. Where are all your brilliant PP images?

Uh? Where do you get off thinking I never PP my images? I ALWAYS DO.

As to using wrongo, I never called you any name or distorted your pseudo in anyway so... Either you STFU or you apologize.

As to my images? Please do not make laugh.

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Sep 3, 2016 02:01:41   #
Rongnongno Loc: FL
 
Peterff wrote:
Did I actually achieve something today?

Yes, I am finding out who the real idiots are. One did surprise me quite a bit (see above post).

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Sep 3, 2016 05:45:47   #
WessoJPEG Loc: Cincinnati, Ohio
 
SharpShooter wrote:
So now that we know what you do, how does that in any way affect what the rest of us do.
You seem to be fixated on a few irrelevant pieces of the exposure puzzle, such as sensor performance and what format you shoot.
The triangle by any other name is still the TRIANGLE!!
All that matters is if our pics come out the way we want them to. Everything else is irrelevant except to the most jaded nerd that will insist those things are somehow important. They are only important to them!
For God's sake, just..........

LEARN TO CHIMP.

SS
So now that we know what you do, how does that in ... (show quote)



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Sep 3, 2016 06:01:18   #
Desert Gecko Loc: desert southwest, USA
 
Kmgw9v wrote:
If you are tired, don't initiate posts, and further refrain from engaging in any discussion.
Unless you enjoy the controversy--- and the attention.



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Sep 3, 2016 06:11:47   #
Desert Gecko Loc: desert southwest, USA
 
martinfisherphoto wrote:
I Don't want to ruffle any feathers, but if you learning your camera a good place to start is JPEG.. I mean if you can't correct in PP from a raw file, then your stuck with what you have. It can actually be liberating not having to pull a rabbit out of you hat ever time you take a shot. I'm getting lazy in my old age and only want to PP as little as possible, but that's just me...


Martin, it could be argued convincingly that a novice has greater need to shoot RAW than does a pro because a RAW file will allow more opportunity to rectify the mistakes a novice is more prone to make.

Nevertheless, I advocate shooting in both RAW and jpeg. I still do. My Sony cameras have excellent range and process a pretty decent jpeg in most cases, so I usually use the camera's jpeg for social media or other simple sharing. But I like to have the RAW to manipulate as I see fit, too. In fact, I lament that after I bought my first DSLR some years ago, I started out shooting in jpeg only until a good friend convinced me to shoot both. I have some really nice shots from those first few months, but not as nice as they could be with a little tweak. I've worked a couple of them in Lightroom and they came out very nice, but not as nice as a RAW file could have. So I recommend shooting in both formats, and filing away the RAW for potential use later. Besides, you never know when you might get that once-in-a-lifetime shot.

Nice shots, btw.

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Sep 3, 2016 06:56:14   #
lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA
 
I don't think Rongnongno is out of line on this. There may be an "exposure triangle" but who proved it is an equilateral triangle?

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Sep 3, 2016 07:25:37   #
mborn Loc: Massachusetts
 
Rongnongno wrote:
I do not know about you but I am really getting tired of endless arguments on 'how to expose' anything.

First off exposure of anything depends on your vision, intent and eventual client demand. This determine what is important (or not) when you first create a composition and then expose the damned thing in order to create a capture you can start working with.

Second, it depends on your camera capabilities as far as the sensor goes. Large pixels have a tendency to create a more accurate color but will lack in details. This influences the exposure, like it or not.

Third you have the file format. You do not expose the same way depending on you output choice. A JPG has severe limitations that may force the use of bracketing in order to capture high contrast scene. If you use raw, you really need to be 'exposed' to extremes to need to bracket to capture a scene full luminosity.

Fourth you have PP. Regardless of the above I am not aware of any capture that is so good that it does not need any post processing.

-----
Personally when I shoot something:
- I expose for what I need, I expose that correctly first and foremost. I basically do not give a hoot about the surroundings, sorry.
- I shoot raw, JPG is good or better for you? Fine, I will not ague. JPG is not good for me, that's it. raw exposure is a training all by itself.
- I plan for PP meaning that I do not shoot 'straight'. My white balance is 'UniWB' and I am apparently over exposed if one just corrects the WB and creates a JPG that is simply unacceptable.

Something you must remember: You are the one responsible for your choices, not the camera, not the manufacturer engineer when you use auto anything. YOU make the choices to be on auto so... No excuse (This goes for focusing too, incidentally).

Being responsible means you must learn your camera enough to pull the most out of it. If you do not and stick to lesser default? Your problem, no one else.

You want to argue about 'good exposure' or bad one? If you do not have the full information on intent your chances of being wrong is near 99%.
I do not know about you but I am really getting ti... (show quote)


I find nothing wrong in the statement. Just remember to each his own

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Sep 3, 2016 07:44:32   #
Linckinn Loc: Okatie, SC and Edgartown, MA
 
I found Rongnongno's comments quite interesting.

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Sep 3, 2016 07:45:24   #
pithydoug Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY
 
Rongnongno wrote:
I do not know about you but I am really getting tired of endless arguments on 'how to expose' anything.

First off exposure of anything depends on your vision, intent and eventual client demand. This determine what is important (or not) when you first create a composition and then expose the damned thing in order to create a capture you can start working with.

Second, it depends on your camera capabilities as far as the sensor goes. Large pixels have a tendency to create a more accurate color but will lack in details. This influences the exposure, like it or not.

Third you have the file format. You do not expose the same way depending on you output choice. A JPG has severe limitations that may force the use of bracketing in order to capture high contrast scene. If you use raw, you really need to be 'exposed' to extremes to need to bracket to capture a scene full luminosity.

Fourth you have PP. Regardless of the above I am not aware of any capture that is so good that it does not need any post processing.

-----
Personally when I shoot something:
- I expose for what I need, I expose that correctly first and foremost. I basically do not give a hoot about the surroundings, sorry.
- I shoot raw, JPG is good or better for you? Fine, I will not ague. JPG is not good for me, that's it. raw exposure is a training all by itself.
- I plan for PP meaning that I do not shoot 'straight'. My white balance is 'UniWB' and I am apparently over exposed if one just corrects the WB and creates a JPG that is simply unacceptable.

Something you must remember: You are the one responsible for your choices, not the camera, not the manufacturer engineer when you use auto anything. YOU make the choices to be on auto so... No excuse (This goes for focusing too, incidentally).

Being responsible means you must learn your camera enough to pull the most out of it. If you do not and stick to lesser default? Your problem, no one else.

You want to argue about 'good exposure' or bad one? If you do not have the full information on intent your chances of being wrong is near 99%.
I do not know about you but I am really getting ti... (show quote)



Terse but spot on!




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Sep 3, 2016 07:54:47   #
bobmcculloch Loc: NYC, NY
 
Good points!

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Sep 3, 2016 08:05:24   #
martinfisherphoto Loc: Lake Placid Florida
 
I'm not going to argue about Raw, it does carry more info. My point is that digital photography has made the photographer lazy. I remember back when I got my first camera. No need to learn about exposure, just point and shoot, the camera will take care of the rest for the most part. But after 3 yrs of snapping away, I got tired of not nailing the shot. I then happened to find the book, Understanding Exposure by Brian Peterson, and it changed my world. With that knowledge and sticking to one specific type of metering I got off my lazy butt and learned something. In a sense I think Raw when used improperly, just point and shoot and I can recover what I can, has not helped the Novice learn much. In JPEG, your forced to expose properly or loose the shot.. It's made Me a better photographer. That said, I do now use two memory cards in my camera, one JPEG the other Raw, in case I do get that once in a lifetime shot. Having Learnd how to use a camera properly, I now want to get better at processing.....
Desert Gecko wrote:
Martin, it could be argued convincingly that a novice has greater need to shoot RAW than does a pro because a RAW file will allow more opportunity to rectify the mistakes a novice is more prone to make.

Nevertheless, I advocate shooting in both RAW and jpeg. I still do. My Sony cameras have excellent range and process a pretty decent jpeg in most cases, so I usually use the camera's jpeg for social media or other simple sharing. But I like to have the RAW to manipulate as I see fit, too. In fact, I lament that after I bought my first DSLR some years ago, I started out shooting in jpeg only until a good friend convinced me to shoot both. I have some really nice shots from those first few months, but not as nice as they could be with a little tweak. I've worked a couple of them in Lightroom and they came out very nice, but not as nice as a RAW file could have. So I recommend shooting in both formats, and filing away the RAW for potential use later. Besides, you never know when you might get that once-in-a-lifetime shot.

Nice shots, btw.
Martin, it could be argued convincingly that a nov... (show quote)

Reply
Sep 3, 2016 08:06:08   #
BebuLamar
 
I am tired of a lot of topics posted here but what do I do? Simply don't read them. I wouldn't complain as I know there are many who likes those topics.

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Sep 3, 2016 08:08:58   #
sb Loc: Florida's East Coast
 
I rely on an expert on exposure.... Anthony Weiner.

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