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Is photo manipulation a deception?
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Mar 10, 2013 18:14:01   #
rebride
 
"The sun never looks through the photographic instrument that it does not print a lie. The piece of glass it prints it on is well named a "negative"--a contradiction--a misrepresentation--a falsehood. I speak feeling of this matter, because by turns the instrument has represented me to be a lunatic, a Soloman, a missionary, a burglar and an abject idiot, and I am neither."
Mark twain
- Letter to the Sacramento Daily Union, written July 1, 1866

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Mar 10, 2013 18:44:08   #
amyinsparta Loc: White county, TN
 
MtnMan wrote:
amyinsparta wrote:


I think that in the future, there should be two fields of photography- pure, right out of the camera, and pp'd. Then there will be no arguments



Unfortunately there is no such thing as the first category. All pictures are processed at least twice: first in camera and second in whatever you use to make a print or display on a computer.

That was true with film as well. Your selection of film provided the first processing of the light and the developing process the second.

This is all about degree of processing.
quote=amyinsparta br br I think that in the fut... (show quote)


Well, then, forget the silliness and may the most beautiful photo win, no matter how much it was processed!!

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Mar 10, 2013 18:49:02   #
dfarmer Loc: St. George, Utah
 
Perhaps this is a new member and is not aware of a search tab. Give Atchy a break. I think sometime some are pretty rude on here. I'm just saying....

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Mar 10, 2013 18:50:31   #
amyinsparta Loc: White county, TN
 
Brucej67 wrote:
One closing thought if you believe that you should not PP and only get it right in the camera, then they should take RAW (or for Nikon NEAF) out of the camera and only have JPEG and JPEG FINE in the camera (with RAW you are forced to PP). In the same token they should eliminate the movie option from the camera, for those that want to make movies let them buy a movie camera. Also shouldn't we eliminate all those seen modes from the camera or special effects, isn't that a form of PP. And to make everyone an expert we should eliminate auto focusing and every other setting but manual.
One closing thought if you believe that you should... (show quote)


:thumbup: Of course you're right. The camera can do a heck of a lot of processing to enable one to take a great picture. I think the requirements for these contests need to be reviewed. What was 'pure' yesterday was really not pure at all-a la Ansel Adams-so why nitpik over how it's done these days? If it's deemed a awesome picture, then give it the prize and don't ask what the photographer did in photoshop. What this guy did was just better than what all the others did in photoshop and they got miffed. end of story!

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Mar 10, 2013 18:56:24   #
ioptfm Loc: Isle of Palms, SC
 
Amazes me how some can take the time to complain and gripe about a simple thread when the simple solution is if you don't want to participate in a thread then don't open. It ain't rocket science!

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Mar 10, 2013 19:04:46   #
rebride
 
JR1 wrote:
There appears to be many people who DO think like me, when I see the same old questions asked time and again I say just that, use the search function, then others have a go at me saying you should be nicer, you can not win.

Perhaps someone could (in admin) draw up a list of done to death topics

Or perhaps a general guide such as

"Before posting a question, please use the search facility to see if it has already been asked before"

OR

The "search" made easier to see with perhaps a title

"has the question you are about to ask been asked before, search here before posting"

http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/search.jsp?q=is+altering+an+image+right&u=&s=0
There appears to be many people who DO think like ... (show quote)


"I don't want that much organization in my life.
I don't want other people thinking for me.
I want my junior mints. where did the junior mints go in the
Movies. I don't want a 12 lb. nestles crunch for 25 dollars. i
Want junior mints.

We need more fruitcakes in this world and less bakers!"

Jimmy Buffet

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Mar 10, 2013 19:06:24   #
F16 Club
 
Jer wrote:
What is Art? The debate will go on forever.
Good discussion.


Jer What is Art?
Art is the distortion of reality, and only insane persons can understand art.

:mrgreen: :thumbup:

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Mar 10, 2013 19:11:24   #
F16 Club
 
Really foxs I fell soo happy and satisfy with the nature of sun rise and sunset, that photoshop does not motivate me to destroy the God creation.
If you feel happy emulating God is Okey for me also, don think I will vote for you in a contest of photography.

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Mar 10, 2013 19:15:36   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
What subject hasn't been over done on here??? Lets stop the bickering and start helping by re-directing people to previously discussed subjects without the stupid attitude towards each other. GROW UP!! :) Thank you

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Mar 10, 2013 19:18:07   #
Mike from Point
 
I see way too many over-saturated landscapes for my taste. The Capture Wisconsin website while having many terrific landscapes also has too many that are almost offensive.

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Mar 10, 2013 19:19:34   #
wilsondl2 Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska
 
I have looked high and low in search and could not find anything about a photographer winning a prize and then having it taken away because PP "errors" made as pointed out by other contestants. The question was asked and a link was given. NOW I AM GOING TO SHOUT. WOULD ONE OF YOU BITCHERS POINT OUT WHERE THIS CAN BE FOUND IN SEARCH. DO IT! I DARE YOU. - Dave

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Mar 10, 2013 20:04:57   #
jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula
 
if we all used the search tab...there would be very few new posts.

sometimes it's a great way for a new member to start conversations with fellow members.

and you attackers can just pass over the post if it pisses you off to see it.

i mean, come on....what strap to buy, what lens to use, what settings for this, what settings for that, what post processing program to use, is lightroom better than aperture, is canon better than nikon, is mac better than pc, is sigma or tamron as good as nikon or canon, is 6d better than d600, how to use triggers, 3rd party flashes or main brand.......on and on....

i bet 99% of the posts have been asked over and over and over and over........and beat to death for sure..

but for the experts or seniority members to answer a post with do a search, read the manual, learn your camera...is pretty ridiculous and condescending to new members.

i think a lot of the long time experienced pro and know it alls forget that they were new at one time.

i have been around this forum for awhile and i damned sure will never ask a question again on this forum...I got nailed pretty good with smart assed answers the last time i posted a question. why do I hang around?...it's because I still try to learn every day and I answer some posts if it's questions related to certain equipment i have used or using.

but there's about 10-12 members that constantyl belittle or jump on a post and rip apart..........i could make a lot of money if i coulod buy this 10-12 person group for what they are worth and sell them for what they think they are worth.

funny thing...the real pros that hang out on this forum and help others are not in that group of 10-12 know-it-alls.

this forum has definitely helped me to be a better photographer than i was before i came to this forum. I know my limitations and i work on them every day...if i have a question, I PM one of these pros and I always get my answer. I deepy appreciate the help i have received.

I guess moral of the story is....treat people like you would like to be treated. it's pretty easy to be a jackass hiding behind a forum avatar.

be nice..it doesn't hurt. really it doesn't.

here's a new concept..just pass over the threads that make you angry when you see them.

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Mar 10, 2013 20:28:56   #
dar_clicks Loc: Utah
 
Atchy wrote:
What are my fellow Ugly Hedgehog members' opinions on this Photoshop or general manipulation of the image, debate.
Do you agree that Photoshop is ruining landscape photography.

http://digital-photography-school.com/opinion-why-photoshop-is-ruining-landscape-photography


That question steers issues into non-useful directions. Every photograph is manipulated from the get-go considering camera settings, lens used, viewpoint, exposure, et. al., and for print-making (pretty much equal to preparing a digital display) many aspects of manipulation have long been deemed acceptable during analog development and printing (albeit more difficult to define allowable digital manipulation boundaries). For a contest, however, one had better read the fine print in the rules and abide by them, presuming the rules were clearly stated in the first place.

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Mar 10, 2013 20:40:58   #
dar_clicks Loc: Utah
 
newryqs wrote:
Recently, I have been photographing rocks and minerals in various wavelengths of ultraviolet light. The minerals emit various wavelengths of "white light". My Canon 60D does not record these colors as they are seen. In a three day shoot, my son and I took 127 different image sets. Because the room was illuminated by only ultraviolet, we had to use small flashlights to occasionally move around without tripping over power cords, etc. We have spent two days using Photoshop to restore just five images as the "true" colors were not represented in the images. The sensors were not wysiwyg. From a three day shoot, we will have to spend another two-three weeks to get all of the images color corrected. (Some of the rocks had as many as five different colors to adjust. Additionally, many of the adjacent fluorescent colors had different intensities and a set of different exposures was necessary to have enough dynamic range to work with.) These images will probably have about as much Photoshopping as any commonly seen images. The result will be a semblance of reality, rather than deception. Your concern should not be the process, but the end result.
Recently, I have been photographing rocks and mine... (show quote)

Wow! Thank you for that interesting post of a very different photo project than most of us know about. It reminded me of what I imagine getting good astronomical deep-space photos must be like.

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Mar 10, 2013 20:52:18   #
Bruce with a Canon Loc: Islip
 
Atchy wrote:
What are my fellow Ugly Hedgehog members' opinions on this Photoshop or general manipulation of the image, debate.
Do you agree that Photoshop is ruining landscape photography.


http://digital-photography-school.com/opinion-why-photoshop-is-ruining-landscape-photography




nope

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