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Rixpix prediction of prosperity
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Dec 12, 2012 13:42:54   #
RixPix Loc: Miami, Florida
 
Lazy Old Coot wrote:
Just a few days ago Rixpix was telling us what a wonderful future we all have ahead of us now that Obama has been re-elected. I think one of the ways he phrased it was "We will all have more money in our pockets!" Well, today The Associated Press released an article on the first $25 Billion installment of that wonderful future. There's only one problem, the $25 billion is being sucked out of our pockets rather than flowing into them. Can anyone say "Unintended Consequences"? ......... Coot


Surprise: New insurance fee in health overhaul law

WASHINGTON (AP) — Your medical plan is facing an unexpected expense, so you probably are, too. It's a new, $63-per-head fee to cushion the cost of covering people with pre-existing conditions under President Barack Obama's health care overhaul.

The charge, buried in a recent regulation, works out to tens of millions of dollars for the largest companies, employers say. Most of that is likely to be passed on to workers.

Employee benefits lawyer Chantel Sheaks calls it a "sleeper issue" with significant financial consequences, particularly for large employers.

"Especially at a time when we are facing economic uncertainty, (companies will) be hit with a multi-million dollar assessment without getting anything back for it," said Sheaks, a principal at Buck Consultants, a Xerox subsidiary.

Based on figures provided in the regulation, employer and individual health plans covering an estimated 190 million Americans could owe the per-person fee.

The Obama administration says it is a temporary assessment levied for three years starting in 2014, designed to raise $25 billion. It starts at $63 and then declines.

Most of the money will go into a fund administered by the Health and Human Services Department. It will be used to cushion health insurance companies from the initial hard-to-predict costs of covering uninsured people with medical problems. Under the law, insurers will be forbidden from turning away the sick as of Jan. 1, 2014.

The program "is intended to help millions of Americans purchase affordable health insurance, reduce unreimbursed usage of hospital and other medical facilities by the uninsured and thereby lower medical expenses and premiums for all," the Obama administration says in the regulation. An accompanying media fact sheet issued Nov. 30 referred to "contributions" without detailing the total cost and scope of the program.

Of the total pot, $5 billion will go directly to the U.S. Treasury, apparently to offset the cost of shoring up employer-sponsored coverage for early retirees.

The $25 billion fee is part of a bigger package of taxes and fees to finance Obama's expansion of coverage to the uninsured. It all comes to about $700 billion over 10 years, and includes higher Medicare taxes effective this Jan. 1 on individuals making more than $200,000 per year or couples making more than $250,000. People above those threshold amounts also face an additional 3.8 percent tax on their investment income.

But the insurance fee had been overlooked as employers focused on other costs in the law, including fines for medium and large firms that don't provide coverage.

"This kind of came out of the blue and was a surprisingly large amount," said Gretchen Young, senior vice president for health policy at the ERISA Industry Committee, a group that represents large employers on benefits issues.

Word started getting out in the spring, said Young, but hard cost estimates surfaced only recently with the new regulation. It set the per capita rate at $5.25 per month, which works out to $63 a year.

America's Health Insurance Plans, the major industry trade group for health insurers, says the fund is an important program that will help stabilize the market and mitigate cost increases for consumers as the changes in Obama's law take effect.

But employers already offering coverage to their workers don't see why they have to pony up for the stabilization fund, which mainly helps the individual insurance market. The redistribution puts the biggest companies on the hook for tens of millions of dollars.

"It just adds on to everything else that is expected to increase health care costs," said economist Paul Fronstin of the nonprofit Employee Benefit Research Institute.

The fee will be assessed on all "major medical" insurance plans, including those provided by employers and those purchased individually by consumers. Large employers will owe the fee directly. That's because major companies usually pay upfront for most of the health care costs of their employees. It may not be apparent to workers, but the insurance company they deal with is basically an agent administering the plan for their employer.

The fee will total $12 billion in 2014, $8 billion in 2015 and $5 billion in 2016. That means the per-head assessment would be smaller each year, around $40 in 2015 instead of $63.

It will phase out completely in 2017 — unless Congress, with lawmakers searching everywhere for revenue to reduce federal deficits — decides to extend it.
Just a few days ago Rixpix was telling us what a w... (show quote)



My comments did not have to do with health care it had to do with quality of life...specifically housing values, increased employment and general attitudes of the majority of Americans.

But if you would take your head out of your rectum and read the ACA you will find the following:


Did you know that the insurance companies are now required to return any unused premiums for health insurance except for that which is permitted for administrative fees unlike car insurance that is money never to be returned. If you do not reach your deductible or if you do not use the full value of your premiums paid you will get a refund under the Affordable Health Care law...here is an example:


Under the program for anyone who is denied coverage:

Monthly Premium for someone aged Male 55 $311
Annual Deductible $2000.00

12*311=3732 Total Premium


If you do not meet your deductible or use all 3732 you will receive a check for up to 2985. Plus you cannot be denied care due to lack of insurance.

Your obsession with the ACA means you are either an employee in the big pharma, insurance or other health care related field. Making you a mercenary gaining your living by taking advantage of those whose have health issues.

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 13:52:58   #
gmcase Loc: Galt's Gulch
 
I often read negative things about numerous subjects that end with some reference to "unintended consequences". I don't believe for a minute the freedom and financial crushing consequences of government actions are "unintended" but are exactly what was intended to grow government and shrink individual liberty and choice.

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 14:20:35   #
letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.
 
17 cents a day here, then 20 cents a day there, so on and so on. Gosh everything at the 99 cents store is just 99 cents, try to walk out without spending twenty dollars. If we dissect all the taxes we pay and put a daily cost on them they will look incredibly small, now add them all back together and wow not so small anymore. Sort of like value pricing , mom often said she bought something for $4.00 but when I loked at the price tag it was $4.99.

Reply
 
 
Dec 12, 2012 14:48:03   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
ole sarg wrote:
It is for three years and starts in 2014. It is a declining payment. Some will be passed on some will not be passed on. So , instead of paying extra in local taxes to support the hospital which has to care for the uninsured I pay a few bucks upfront. I will take the up front cost versus a lifelong payment in local taxes for those who cannot get insurance.

What a stupid argument you all make.


Bottom line sarg is that the CBO set the price tag of Obamacare even after the medicare reallocation of funds will still cost $1 trillion over 10 years. The law places provisions for taxes to cover those expenses and they will mostly be borne by the middle class... Now we have Obama screaming for more taxes....

Like coot said, welcome to Obama World...

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 15:45:15   #
Bangee5 Loc: Louisiana
 
RixPix wrote:
Lazy Old Coot wrote:
Just a few days ago Rixpix was telling us what a wonderful future we all have ahead of us now that Obama has been re-elected. I think one of the ways he phrased it was "We will all have more money in our pockets!" Well, today The Associated Press released an article on the first $25 Billion installment of that wonderful future. There's only one problem, the $25 billion is being sucked out of our pockets rather than flowing into them. Can anyone say "Unintended Consequences"? ......... Coot


Surprise: New insurance fee in health overhaul law

WASHINGTON (AP) — Your medical plan is facing an unexpected expense, so you probably are, too. It's a new, $63-per-head fee to cushion the cost of covering people with pre-existing conditions under President Barack Obama's health care overhaul.

The charge, buried in a recent regulation, works out to tens of millions of dollars for the largest companies, employers say. Most of that is likely to be passed on to workers.

Employee benefits lawyer Chantel Sheaks calls it a "sleeper issue" with significant financial consequences, particularly for large employers.

"Especially at a time when we are facing economic uncertainty, (companies will) be hit with a multi-million dollar assessment without getting anything back for it," said Sheaks, a principal at Buck Consultants, a Xerox subsidiary.

Based on figures provided in the regulation, employer and individual health plans covering an estimated 190 million Americans could owe the per-person fee.

The Obama administration says it is a temporary assessment levied for three years starting in 2014, designed to raise $25 billion. It starts at $63 and then declines.

Most of the money will go into a fund administered by the Health and Human Services Department. It will be used to cushion health insurance companies from the initial hard-to-predict costs of covering uninsured people with medical problems. Under the law, insurers will be forbidden from turning away the sick as of Jan. 1, 2014.

The program "is intended to help millions of Americans purchase affordable health insurance, reduce unreimbursed usage of hospital and other medical facilities by the uninsured and thereby lower medical expenses and premiums for all," the Obama administration says in the regulation. An accompanying media fact sheet issued Nov. 30 referred to "contributions" without detailing the total cost and scope of the program.

Of the total pot, $5 billion will go directly to the U.S. Treasury, apparently to offset the cost of shoring up employer-sponsored coverage for early retirees.

The $25 billion fee is part of a bigger package of taxes and fees to finance Obama's expansion of coverage to the uninsured. It all comes to about $700 billion over 10 years, and includes higher Medicare taxes effective this Jan. 1 on individuals making more than $200,000 per year or couples making more than $250,000. People above those threshold amounts also face an additional 3.8 percent tax on their investment income.

But the insurance fee had been overlooked as employers focused on other costs in the law, including fines for medium and large firms that don't provide coverage.

"This kind of came out of the blue and was a surprisingly large amount," said Gretchen Young, senior vice president for health policy at the ERISA Industry Committee, a group that represents large employers on benefits issues.

Word started getting out in the spring, said Young, but hard cost estimates surfaced only recently with the new regulation. It set the per capita rate at $5.25 per month, which works out to $63 a year.

America's Health Insurance Plans, the major industry trade group for health insurers, says the fund is an important program that will help stabilize the market and mitigate cost increases for consumers as the changes in Obama's law take effect.

But employers already offering coverage to their workers don't see why they have to pony up for the stabilization fund, which mainly helps the individual insurance market. The redistribution puts the biggest companies on the hook for tens of millions of dollars.

"It just adds on to everything else that is expected to increase health care costs," said economist Paul Fronstin of the nonprofit Employee Benefit Research Institute.

The fee will be assessed on all "major medical" insurance plans, including those provided by employers and those purchased individually by consumers. Large employers will owe the fee directly. That's because major companies usually pay upfront for most of the health care costs of their employees. It may not be apparent to workers, but the insurance company they deal with is basically an agent administering the plan for their employer.

The fee will total $12 billion in 2014, $8 billion in 2015 and $5 billion in 2016. That means the per-head assessment would be smaller each year, around $40 in 2015 instead of $63.

It will phase out completely in 2017 — unless Congress, with lawmakers searching everywhere for revenue to reduce federal deficits — decides to extend it.
Just a few days ago Rixpix was telling us what a w... (show quote)



My comments did not have to do with health care it had to do with quality of life...specifically housing values, increased employment and general attitudes of the majority of Americans.

But if you would take your head out of your rectum and read the ACA you will find the following:


Did you know that the insurance companies are now required to return any unused premiums for health insurance except for that which is permitted for administrative fees unlike car insurance that is money never to be returned. If you do not reach your deductible or if you do not use the full value of your premiums paid you will get a refund under the Affordable Health Care law...here is an example:


Under the program for anyone who is denied coverage:

Monthly Premium for someone aged Male 55 $311
Annual Deductible $2000.00

12*311=3732 Total Premium


If you do not meet your deductible or use all 3732 you will receive a check for up to 2985. Plus you cannot be denied care due to lack of insurance.

Your obsession with the ACA means you are either an employee in the big pharma, insurance or other health care related field. Making you a mercenary gaining your living by taking advantage of those whose have health issues.
quote=Lazy Old Coot Just a few days ago Rixpix wa... (show quote)


RixPix, 'IF' what you say is true (LOL) then what Insurance Company could stay in business if they have to refund money? Unless this is a way for Obama to run the Insurance Companies out of business. By the way, I have long suspected that you are a undercover mercenary for the American Socialist Party.

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 15:58:06   #
RixPix Loc: Miami, Florida
 
Bangee5 wrote:
RixPix wrote:
Lazy Old Coot wrote:
Just a few days ago Rixpix was telling us what a wonderful future we all have ahead of us now that Obama has been re-elected. I think one of the ways he phrased it was "We will all have more money in our pockets!" Well, today The Associated Press released an article on the first $25 Billion installment of that wonderful future. There's only one problem, the $25 billion is being sucked out of our pockets rather than flowing into them. Can anyone say "Unintended Consequences"? ......... Coot



Surprise: New insurance fee in health overhaul law

WASHINGTON (AP) — Your medical plan is facing an unexpected expense, so you probably are, too. It's a new, $63-per-head fee to cushion the cost of covering people with pre-existing conditions under President Barack Obama's health care overhaul.

The charge, buried in a recent regulation, works out to tens of millions of dollars for the largest companies, employers say. Most of that is likely to be passed on to workers.

Employee benefits lawyer Chantel Sheaks calls it a "sleeper issue" with significant financial consequences, particularly for large employers.

"Especially at a time when we are facing economic uncertainty, (companies will) be hit with a multi-million dollar assessment without getting anything back for it," said Sheaks, a principal at Buck Consultants, a Xerox subsidiary.

Based on figures provided in the regulation, employer and individual health plans covering an estimated 190 million Americans could owe the per-person fee.

The Obama administration says it is a temporary assessment levied for three years starting in 2014, designed to raise $25 billion. It starts at $63 and then declines.

Most of the money will go into a fund administered by the Health and Human Services Department. It will be used to cushion health insurance companies from the initial hard-to-predict costs of covering uninsured people with medical problems. Under the law, insurers will be forbidden from turning away the sick as of Jan. 1, 2014.

The program "is intended to help millions of Americans purchase affordable health insurance, reduce unreimbursed usage of hospital and other medical facilities by the uninsured and thereby lower medical expenses and premiums for all," the Obama administration says in the regulation. An accompanying media fact sheet issued Nov. 30 referred to "contributions" without detailing the total cost and scope of the program.

Of the total pot, $5 billion will go directly to the U.S. Treasury, apparently to offset the cost of shoring up employer-sponsored coverage for early retirees.

The $25 billion fee is part of a bigger package of taxes and fees to finance Obama's expansion of coverage to the uninsured. It all comes to about $700 billion over 10 years, and includes higher Medicare taxes effective this Jan. 1 on individuals making more than $200,000 per year or couples making more than $250,000. People above those threshold amounts also face an additional 3.8 percent tax on their investment income.

But the insurance fee had been overlooked as employers focused on other costs in the law, including fines for medium and large firms that don't provide coverage.

"This kind of came out of the blue and was a surprisingly large amount," said Gretchen Young, senior vice president for health policy at the ERISA Industry Committee, a group that represents large employers on benefits issues.

Word started getting out in the spring, said Young, but hard cost estimates surfaced only recently with the new regulation. It set the per capita rate at $5.25 per month, which works out to $63 a year.

America's Health Insurance Plans, the major industry trade group for health insurers, says the fund is an important program that will help stabilize the market and mitigate cost increases for consumers as the changes in Obama's law take effect.

But employers already offering coverage to their workers don't see why they have to pony up for the stabilization fund, which mainly helps the individual insurance market. The redistribution puts the biggest companies on the hook for tens of millions of dollars.

"It just adds on to everything else that is expected to increase health care costs," said economist Paul Fronstin of the nonprofit Employee Benefit Research Institute.

The fee will be assessed on all "major medical" insurance plans, including those provided by employers and those purchased individually by consumers. Large employers will owe the fee directly. That's because major companies usually pay upfront for most of the health care costs of their employees. It may not be apparent to workers, but the insurance company they deal with is basically an agent administering the plan for their employer.

The fee will total $12 billion in 2014, $8 billion in 2015 and $5 billion in 2016. That means the per-head assessment would be smaller each year, around $40 in 2015 instead of $63.

It will phase out completely in 2017 — unless Congress, with lawmakers searching everywhere for revenue to reduce federal deficits — decides to extend it.
Just a few days ago Rixpix was telling us what a w... (show quote)



My comments did not have to do with health care it had to do with quality of life...specifically housing values, increased employment and general attitudes of the majority of Americans.

But if you would take your head out of your rectum and read the ACA you will find the following:


Did you know that the insurance companies are now required to return any unused premiums for health insurance except for that which is permitted for administrative fees unlike car insurance that is money never to be returned. If you do not reach your deductible or if you do not use the full value of your premiums paid you will get a refund under the Affordable Health Care law...here is an example:


Under the program for anyone who is denied coverage:

Monthly Premium for someone aged Male 55 $311
Annual Deductible $2000.00

12*311=3732 Total Premium


If you do not meet your deductible or use all 3732 you will receive a check for up to 2985. Plus you cannot be denied care due to lack of insurance.

Your obsession with the ACA means you are either an employee in the big pharma, insurance or other health care related field. Making you a mercenary gaining your living by taking advantage of those whose have health issues.
quote=Lazy Old Coot Just a few days ago Rixpix wa... (show quote)


RixPix, 'IF' what you say is true (LOL) then what Insurance Company could stay in business if they have to refund money? Unless this is a way for Obama to run the Insurance Companies out of business. By the way, I have long suspected that you are a undercover mercenary for the American Socialist Party.
quote=RixPix quote=Lazy Old Coot Just a few days... (show quote)


You must be retired and on government welfare...right? Or should I say medicare or do you qualify for medicaid because of your section 8?

We have already received our check from our health insurance rebate it came in October if I remember. Additionally the provision is for businesses also.


If an employer purchases insurance for its employees and the total amount of claims against the policy is less than the premium they get the rebate also. My wife is employed full-time and gets health care coverage from her employer but she pays a portion of the premium (about $50 per month) she has a $1500 deductible. She never met her deductible so she got a check for over $400 dollars. You obviously don't pay for coverage or you are on some government program or else your would know this as the notices went out some months back.

These provisions are for the people...people come first in my book not corporate profits...if you can't get your head out of your rectum then I suggest you see a specialist maybe they can transplant some humanity into your tired old body.

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 16:20:08   #
Bmac Loc: Long Island, NY
 
RixPix wrote:
...if you can't get your head out of your rectum then I suggest you see a specialist maybe they can transplant some humanity into your tired old body.


This type of venomous garbage is really uncalled for and destroys any credibility you may have regarding this or any discussion. :thumbdown:

Reply
 
 
Dec 12, 2012 16:36:43   #
PrairieSeasons Loc: Red River of the North
 
RixPix wrote:


You must be retired and on government welfare...right? Or should I say medicare or do you qualify for medicaid because of your section 8?

We have already received our check from our health insurance rebate it came in October if I remember. Additionally the provision is for businesses also.


If an employer purchases insurance for its employees and the total amount of claims against the policy is less than the premium they get the rebate also. My wife is employed full-time and gets health care coverage from her employer but she pays a portion of the premium (about $50 per month) she has a $1500 deductible. She never met her deductible so she got a check for over $400 dollars. You obviously don't pay for coverage or you are on some government program or else your would know this as the notices went out some months back.

These provisions are for the people...people come first in my book not corporate profits...if you can't get your head out of your rectum then I suggest you see a specialist maybe they can transplant some humanity into your tired old body.
br br You must be retired and on government welf... (show quote)


You're mixing apples and oranges here. Some employers buy health insurance and pay premiums based on previous years' actual expenses. These are usually smaller employers (like 50 or fewer insurance participants) or government employers (police and fire departments, municipalities, schools).

Most larger employers, however, are self-insured. They use Blue Cross Blue Shield or Humana or Aetna to administer the plans for them, including negotiating rates with preferred providers, but pay actual costs rather than a premium.

For the first set (premium payers), insurance companies have an obligation to refund unused premiums in the manner you describe, and employers have multiple options on how to return them to the employee. One may cut a check, while another may use the money to fund a wellness program like weight loss or smoking cessation.

For the second set (self-insured), there is no premium to be refunded or distributed to employees.

Many people will not get a refund for either of these reasons, even though they may not have had high medical expenses themselves. That doesn't mean they are on welfare or need to pull their heads out of their rectums (and somehow, typing both those words as plurals seems incredibly wrong).

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 16:43:27   #
Danilo Loc: Las Vegas
 
This discussion is in need of some humor, so here it is, from Coot's AP quote (last sentence):
"It will phase out completely in 2017 — unless Congress, with lawmakers searching everywhere for revenue to reduce federal deficits — decides to extend it."
Question: When was the last time we had anything other than pointless TALK regarding deficit reduction? When was that last time a tax or fee increase ended?

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 17:16:42   #
thewags Loc: Phoenix
 
Danilo wrote:
This discussion is in need of some humor, so here it is, from Coot's AP quote (last sentence):
"It will phase out completely in 2017 — unless Congress, with lawmakers searching everywhere for revenue to reduce federal deficits — decides to extend it."
Question: When was the last time we had anything other than pointless TALK regarding deficit reduction? When was that last time a tax or fee increase ended?


Sometimes they do get phased out, but only when replaced by new, higher fees.

Reply
Dec 12, 2012 20:18:38   #
Bangee5 Loc: Louisiana
 
RixPix wrote:
if you can't get your head out of your rectum.


What is this fixation you are having about rectums?

Reply
 
 
Dec 13, 2012 00:03:26   #
jjwright71 Loc: Lubbock,Tx
 
Bangee5 wrote:
RixPix wrote:
if you can't get your head out of your rectum.


What is this fixation you are having about rectums?
anal retentive ,HAR!

Reply
Dec 13, 2012 01:18:33   #
Lazy Old Coot Loc: Gainesville, Florida
 
Prairie, Got a great chuckle out of that. Thanks. ..... Coot

[quote=PrairieSeasons]
RixPix wrote:


That doesn't mean they are on welfare or need to pull their heads out of their rectums (and somehow, typing both those words as plurals seems incredibly wrong).

Reply
Dec 13, 2012 01:57:03   #
Lazy Old Coot Loc: Gainesville, Florida
 
The whole point I was trying to make when I started this thread was that the Obama-care program is so complex and written by so many authors, each of whom were trying to protect their own vested interests, that no one really seems to know how the whole thing is going to work. I think by the time it has been fully implemented the unintended consequences will be mind boggling.

I probably should explain that I've been a moderate Republican for 59 years. Unlike most of today's Republicans I don't think affordable health care is a privilege. I think, in a country like the United States, it's something everyone deserves. The very idea that someone sick or injured can't have access to adequate healthcare is simply immoral. Although I have my doubts, I hope Obama-care works without bankrupting the country. It's at least a start and hopefully we can correct the problems as they occur. It will be very interesting to see what the program has morphed into over the next four years. ...... Coot

Reply
Dec 13, 2012 10:07:29   #
Bmac Loc: Long Island, NY
 
Bangee5 wrote:
RixPix wrote:
if you can't get your head out of your rectum.


What is this fixation you are having about rectums?


Ha, thanks for giving me a great opening, but I will pass on it. :thumbup:

Reply
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