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Vietnam: Hanoi Part 7 - Hoa Lo Prison (The Hanoi Hilton)
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Sep 4, 2022 08:30:21   #
VietVet Loc: Brooklyn, NY
 
srfmhg wrote:
Thanks for commenting Tom.
I posted these with some trepidation because of the large number of Vietnam Vets on the forum. It's much like the photos displayed in Holocaust museums throughout the world, some of which I visited. I just learned that several family members who I never knew were killed in the camps yet I continue to watch documentaries, read books and view photos of the darkest days in modern history. We also plan to some day visit the camps in Poland and Germany and I plan to photograph and post the images. Yes, I'll probably walk on the ashes of my family members who were not killed as combatants but merely for their beliefs. Despite the pain, my hope is that people can appreciate the hardship our troops endured during the Vietnam War by seeing and reading about this awful place so we don't repeat the mistakes we made. The memory of hardships suffered must be kept alive for the younger generations.
Thanks for commenting Tom. br I posted these with... (show quote)


I totally agree with your view, we must never forget the atrocities that have happened throughout our history no matter how painful. I was there in 1971-1972. Some of the people I meet there were wonderful, helpful and many that were forced to fight were quick to surrender. There are many things that are etched into my mind and heart, some good some bad but remembering is a must. Thanks for your post.

Reply
Sep 4, 2022 12:24:16   #
GeneB Loc: Chattanooga Tennessee
 
srfmhg wrote:
Thanks so much ND. I completely agree with all you said!


Agreed

Reply
Sep 4, 2022 12:34:32   #
phlash46 Loc: Westchester County, New York
 
A tale of the beast in all of us...

Reply
 
 
Sep 4, 2022 13:59:02   #
Moondoggie Loc: Southern California
 
Mark, I was visiting the same Hanoi Hilton. Thanks for bringing back the memories.

Reply
Sep 4, 2022 14:41:16   #
srfmhg Loc: Marin County, CA
 
VietVet wrote:
I totally agree with your view, we must never forget the atrocities that have happened throughout our history no matter how painful. I was there in 1971-1972. Some of the people I meet there were wonderful, helpful and many that were forced to fight were quick to surrender. There are many things that are etched into my mind and heart, some good some bad but remembering is a must. Thanks for your post.


Thank you so much for your kind comments Charles. They made me really feel good since it was not my intent to offend anyone - especially Vietnam Vets - but to merely try and educate those non- vets who were unaware that this hellhole existed.

Reply
Sep 4, 2022 14:41:40   #
srfmhg Loc: Marin County, CA
 
GeneB wrote:
Agreed


Thanks Gene.

Reply
Sep 4, 2022 14:42:04   #
srfmhg Loc: Marin County, CA
 
phlash46 wrote:
A tale of the beast in all of us...


I agree with you Bruce.

Reply
 
 
Sep 4, 2022 14:42:43   #
srfmhg Loc: Marin County, CA
 
Moondoggie wrote:
Mark, I was visiting the same Hanoi Hilton. Thanks for bringing back the memories.


You’re most welcome Moondoggie.

Reply
Sep 4, 2022 20:29:47   #
Bubalola Loc: Big Apple, NY
 
srfmhg wrote:
We visited the remnants of the Hoa Lo Prison in Hanoi, now a museum, where many of our Vietnam War POW's were held.

Hỏa Lò Prison (Vietnamese: [hwa᷉ː lɔ̂], Nhà tù Hỏa Lò; French: Prison Hỏa Lò) was a prison in Hanoi originally used by the French colonists in Indochina for political prisoners, and later by North Vietnam for U.S. prisoners of war during the Vietnam War. During this later period, it was known to American POWs as the "Hanoi Hilton". The prison was demolished during the 1990s, although the gatehouse remains as a museum.

French era:
The name Hỏa Lò, commonly translated as "fiery furnace" or even "Hell's hole", also means "stove". The name originated from the street name phố Hỏa Lò, due to the concentration of stores selling wood stoves and coal-fire stoves along the street in pre-colonial times.

The prison was built in Hanoi by the French, in dates ranging from 1886–1889 to 1898 to 1901, when Vietnam was still part of French Indochina. The French called the prison Maison Centrale, 'Central House', which is still the designation of prisons for dangerous or long sentence detainees in France. It was located near Hanoi's French Quarter. It was intended to hold Vietnamese prisoners, particularly political prisoners agitating for independence who were often subject to torture and execution. A 1913 renovation expanded its capacity from 460 inmates to 600. It was nevertheless often overcrowded, holding some 730 prisoners on a given day in 1916, a figure which rose to 895 in 1922 and 1,430 in 1933. By 1954 it held more than 2000 people; with its inmates held in subhuman conditions, it had become a symbol of colonialist exploitation and of the bitterness of the Vietnamese towards the French.

The central urban location of the prison also became part of its early character. During the 1910s through 1930s, street peddlers made an occupation of passing outside messages in through the jail's windows and tossing tobacco and opium over the walls; letters and packets would be thrown out to the street in the opposite direction. Within the prison itself, communication and ideas passed. Many of the future leading figures in Communist North Vietnam spent time in Maison Centrale during the 1930s and 1940s. Conditions for political prisoners in the "Colonial Bastille" were publicised in 1929 in a widely circulated account by the Trotskyist Phan Van Hum of the experience he shared with the charismatic publicist Nguyen An Ninh.

Democratic Republic of Vietnam, 1954:
Following the defeat at the Battle of Dien Bien Phu and the 1954 Geneva Accords the French left Hanoi and the prison came under the authority of the Democratic Republic of Vietnam. Thereafter the prison served as an education center for revolutionary doctrine and activity, and it was kept around after the French left to mark its historical significance to the North Vietnamese.

Vietnam War:
During the Vietnam War, the first U.S. prisoner to be sent to Hỏa Lò was Lieutenant Junior Grade Everett Alvarez Jr., who was shot down on August 5, 1964. From the beginning, U.S. POWs endured miserable conditions, including poor food and unsanitary conditions. The prison complex was sarcastically nicknamed the "Hanoi Hilton" by the American POWs, in reference to the well-known Hilton Hotel chain. There is some disagreement among the first group of POWs who coined the name but F8D pilot Bob Shumaker was the first to write it down, carving "Welcome to the Hanoi Hilton" on the handle of a pail to greet the arrival of Air Force Lieutenant Robert Peel.

Beginning in early 1967, a new area of the prison was opened for incoming American POWs; it was dubbed "Little Vegas", and its individual buildings and areas were named after Las Vegas Strip landmarks, such as "Golden Nugget", "Thunderbird", "Stardust", "Riviera", and the "Desert Inn". These names were chosen because many pilots had trained at Nellis Air Force Base, located in proximity to Las Vegas. American pilots were frequently already in poor condition by the time they were captured, injured either during their ejection or in landing on the ground.


The Hỏa Lò was one site used by the North Vietnamese Army to house, torture and interrogate captured servicemen, mostly American pilots shot down during bombing raids. Although North Vietnam was a signatory of the Third Geneva Convention of 1949, which demanded "decent and humane treatment" of prisoners of war, severe torture methods were employed, such as rope bindings, irons, beatings, and prolonged solitary confinement. When prisoners of war began to be released from this and other North Vietnamese prisons during the Johnson administration, their testimonies revealed widespread and systematic abuse of prisoners of war. In 1968, Walter Heynowsk and Gerhard Scheumann from East Germany filmed in the prison the 4-chapter series Piloten im Pyjama with interviews with American pilots in the prison, that they claimed were unscripted. Heynowski and Scheumann asked them about the contradictions in their self image and their war behavior and between the Code of the United States Fighting Force and their behavior during and after capture.

Regarding treatment at Hỏa Lò and other prisons, the North Vietnamese countered by stating that prisoners were treated well and in accordance with the Geneva Conventions. During 1969, they broadcast a series of statements from American prisoners that purported to support this notion. The North Vietnamese also maintained that their prisons were no worse than prisons for POWs and political prisoners in South Vietnam, such as the one on Côn Sơn Island. Mistreatment of Viet Cong and North Vietnamese prisoners and South Vietnamese dissidents in South Vietnam's prisons was indeed frequent, as was North Vietnamese abuse of South Vietnamese prisoners and their own dissidents.

Beginning in late 1969, treatment of the prisoners at Hỏa Lò and other camps became less severe and generally more tolerable. Following the late 1970 attempted rescue operation at Sơn Tây prison camp, most of the POWs at the outlying camps were moved to Hỏa Lò, so that the North Vietnamese had fewer camps to protect. This created the "Camp Unity" communal living area at Hỏa Lò, which greatly reduced the isolation of the POWs and improved their morale.

Post-war accounts:
After the implementation of the 1973 Paris Peace Accords, neither the United States nor its allies ever formally charged North Vietnam with the war crimes revealed to have been committed there. In the 2000s, the Vietnamese government has had the position that claims that prisoners were tortured at Hỏa Lò and other sites during the war are fabricated, but that Vietnam wants to move past the issue as part of establishing better relations with the U.S. Tran Trong Duyet, a jailer at Hỏa Lò beginning in 1968 and its commandant for the last three years of the war, maintained in 2008 that no prisoners were tortured. However, eyewitness accounts by American servicemen present a different account of their captivity.

After the war, Risner wrote the book Passing of the Night detailing his seven years at Hỏa Lò. A considerable amount of literature emerged from released POWs after repatriation, depicting Hỏa Lò and the other prisons as places where such atrocities as murder, beatings, broken bones, teeth and eardrums, dislocated limbs, starvation, serving of food contaminated with human and animal feces, and medical neglect of infections and tropical disease occurred. These details are revealed in famous accounts by McCain (Faith of My Fathers), Denton, Alvarez, Day, Risner, Stockdale and dozens of others. In addition, Hỏa Lò was depicted in the 1987 Hollywood movie The Hanoi Hilton.

Hỏa Lò in the late 1970s and early 1980s:
The prison continued to be in use after the release of the American prisoners. Among the last inmates was dissident poet Nguyễn Chí Thiện, who was reimprisoned in 1979 after attempting to deliver his poems to the British Embassy, and spent the next six years in Hỏa Lò until 1985 when he was transferred to a more modern prison. He mentions the last years of the prison, partly in fictional form, in Hỏa Lò/Hanoi Hilton Stories (2007)

Demolition, conversion and museum:
John McCain's flight suit and parachute, is on display in the museum part of the Hoa Lo site.
Most of the prison was demolished in the mid-1990s and the site now contains two high-rise buildings, one of them the 25-story Somerset Grand Hanoi serviced apartment building. Other parts have been converted into a commercial complex retaining the original French colonial walls.

Only part of the prison exists today as a museum. The displays mainly show the prison during the French colonial period, including the guillotine room, still with original equipment, and the quarters for male and female Vietnamese political prisoners.

For a list of notable inmates, please see the link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%E1%BB%8Fa_L%C3%B2_Prison


For additional images of Hanoi, Please see my previous posts:
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-749364-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-749643-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-749886-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-750093-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-750394-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-750606-1.html

I hope you enjoy these!
Mark
We visited the remnants of the Hoa Lo Prison in Ha... (show quote)


Another Never Again reminder...

Reply
Sep 5, 2022 15:50:54   #
srfmhg Loc: Marin County, CA
 
Bubalola wrote:
Another Never Again reminder...


Amen to that Eugene!

Reply
Sep 5, 2022 18:00:44   #
merrytexan Loc: georgia
 
srfmhg wrote:
We visited the remnants of the Hoa Lo Prison in Hanoi, now a museum, where many of our Vietnam War POW's were held.

Hỏa Lò Prison (Vietnamese: [hwa᷉ː lɔ̂], Nhà tù Hỏa Lò; French: Prison Hỏa Lò) was a prison in Hanoi originally used by the French colonists in Indochina for political prisoners, and later by North Vietnam for U.S. prisoners of war during the Vietnam War. During this later period, it was known to American POWs as the "Hanoi Hilton". The prison was demolished during the 1990s, although the gatehouse remains as a museum.

French era:
The name Hỏa Lò, commonly translated as "fiery furnace" or even "Hell's hole", also means "stove". The name originated from the street name phố Hỏa Lò, due to the concentration of stores selling wood stoves and coal-fire stoves along the street in pre-colonial times.

The prison was built in Hanoi by the French, in dates ranging from 1886–1889 to 1898 to 1901, when Vietnam was still part of French Indochina. The French called the prison Maison Centrale, 'Central House', which is still the designation of prisons for dangerous or long sentence detainees in France. It was located near Hanoi's French Quarter. It was intended to hold Vietnamese prisoners, particularly political prisoners agitating for independence who were often subject to torture and execution. A 1913 renovation expanded its capacity from 460 inmates to 600. It was nevertheless often overcrowded, holding some 730 prisoners on a given day in 1916, a figure which rose to 895 in 1922 and 1,430 in 1933. By 1954 it held more than 2000 people; with its inmates held in subhuman conditions, it had become a symbol of colonialist exploitation and of the bitterness of the Vietnamese towards the French.

The central urban location of the prison also became part of its early character. During the 1910s through 1930s, street peddlers made an occupation of passing outside messages in through the jail's windows and tossing tobacco and opium over the walls; letters and packets would be thrown out to the street in the opposite direction. Within the prison itself, communication and ideas passed. Many of the future leading figures in Communist North Vietnam spent time in Maison Centrale during the 1930s and 1940s. Conditions for political prisoners in the "Colonial Bastille" were publicised in 1929 in a widely circulated account by the Trotskyist Phan Van Hum of the experience he shared with the charismatic publicist Nguyen An Ninh.

Democratic Republic of Vietnam, 1954:
Following the defeat at the Battle of Dien Bien Phu and the 1954 Geneva Accords the French left Hanoi and the prison came under the authority of the Democratic Republic of Vietnam. Thereafter the prison served as an education center for revolutionary doctrine and activity, and it was kept around after the French left to mark its historical significance to the North Vietnamese.

Vietnam War:
During the Vietnam War, the first U.S. prisoner to be sent to Hỏa Lò was Lieutenant Junior Grade Everett Alvarez Jr., who was shot down on August 5, 1964. From the beginning, U.S. POWs endured miserable conditions, including poor food and unsanitary conditions. The prison complex was sarcastically nicknamed the "Hanoi Hilton" by the American POWs, in reference to the well-known Hilton Hotel chain. There is some disagreement among the first group of POWs who coined the name but F8D pilot Bob Shumaker was the first to write it down, carving "Welcome to the Hanoi Hilton" on the handle of a pail to greet the arrival of Air Force Lieutenant Robert Peel.

Beginning in early 1967, a new area of the prison was opened for incoming American POWs; it was dubbed "Little Vegas", and its individual buildings and areas were named after Las Vegas Strip landmarks, such as "Golden Nugget", "Thunderbird", "Stardust", "Riviera", and the "Desert Inn". These names were chosen because many pilots had trained at Nellis Air Force Base, located in proximity to Las Vegas. American pilots were frequently already in poor condition by the time they were captured, injured either during their ejection or in landing on the ground.


The Hỏa Lò was one site used by the North Vietnamese Army to house, torture and interrogate captured servicemen, mostly American pilots shot down during bombing raids. Although North Vietnam was a signatory of the Third Geneva Convention of 1949, which demanded "decent and humane treatment" of prisoners of war, severe torture methods were employed, such as rope bindings, irons, beatings, and prolonged solitary confinement. When prisoners of war began to be released from this and other North Vietnamese prisons during the Johnson administration, their testimonies revealed widespread and systematic abuse of prisoners of war. In 1968, Walter Heynowsk and Gerhard Scheumann from East Germany filmed in the prison the 4-chapter series Piloten im Pyjama with interviews with American pilots in the prison, that they claimed were unscripted. Heynowski and Scheumann asked them about the contradictions in their self image and their war behavior and between the Code of the United States Fighting Force and their behavior during and after capture.

Regarding treatment at Hỏa Lò and other prisons, the North Vietnamese countered by stating that prisoners were treated well and in accordance with the Geneva Conventions. During 1969, they broadcast a series of statements from American prisoners that purported to support this notion. The North Vietnamese also maintained that their prisons were no worse than prisons for POWs and political prisoners in South Vietnam, such as the one on Côn Sơn Island. Mistreatment of Viet Cong and North Vietnamese prisoners and South Vietnamese dissidents in South Vietnam's prisons was indeed frequent, as was North Vietnamese abuse of South Vietnamese prisoners and their own dissidents.

Beginning in late 1969, treatment of the prisoners at Hỏa Lò and other camps became less severe and generally more tolerable. Following the late 1970 attempted rescue operation at Sơn Tây prison camp, most of the POWs at the outlying camps were moved to Hỏa Lò, so that the North Vietnamese had fewer camps to protect. This created the "Camp Unity" communal living area at Hỏa Lò, which greatly reduced the isolation of the POWs and improved their morale.

Post-war accounts:
After the implementation of the 1973 Paris Peace Accords, neither the United States nor its allies ever formally charged North Vietnam with the war crimes revealed to have been committed there. In the 2000s, the Vietnamese government has had the position that claims that prisoners were tortured at Hỏa Lò and other sites during the war are fabricated, but that Vietnam wants to move past the issue as part of establishing better relations with the U.S. Tran Trong Duyet, a jailer at Hỏa Lò beginning in 1968 and its commandant for the last three years of the war, maintained in 2008 that no prisoners were tortured. However, eyewitness accounts by American servicemen present a different account of their captivity.

After the war, Risner wrote the book Passing of the Night detailing his seven years at Hỏa Lò. A considerable amount of literature emerged from released POWs after repatriation, depicting Hỏa Lò and the other prisons as places where such atrocities as murder, beatings, broken bones, teeth and eardrums, dislocated limbs, starvation, serving of food contaminated with human and animal feces, and medical neglect of infections and tropical disease occurred. These details are revealed in famous accounts by McCain (Faith of My Fathers), Denton, Alvarez, Day, Risner, Stockdale and dozens of others. In addition, Hỏa Lò was depicted in the 1987 Hollywood movie The Hanoi Hilton.

Hỏa Lò in the late 1970s and early 1980s:
The prison continued to be in use after the release of the American prisoners. Among the last inmates was dissident poet Nguyễn Chí Thiện, who was reimprisoned in 1979 after attempting to deliver his poems to the British Embassy, and spent the next six years in Hỏa Lò until 1985 when he was transferred to a more modern prison. He mentions the last years of the prison, partly in fictional form, in Hỏa Lò/Hanoi Hilton Stories (2007)

Demolition, conversion and museum:
John McCain's flight suit and parachute, is on display in the museum part of the Hoa Lo site.
Most of the prison was demolished in the mid-1990s and the site now contains two high-rise buildings, one of them the 25-story Somerset Grand Hanoi serviced apartment building. Other parts have been converted into a commercial complex retaining the original French colonial walls.

Only part of the prison exists today as a museum. The displays mainly show the prison during the French colonial period, including the guillotine room, still with original equipment, and the quarters for male and female Vietnamese political prisoners.

For a list of notable inmates, please see the link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%E1%BB%8Fa_L%C3%B2_Prison


For additional images of Hanoi, Please see my previous posts:
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-749364-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-749643-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-749886-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-750093-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-750394-1.html
https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-750606-1.html

I hope you enjoy these!
Mark
We visited the remnants of the Hoa Lo Prison in Ha... (show quote)


Enjoyed the tour mark...great set of shots!

Reply
 
 
Sep 5, 2022 18:03:32   #
srfmhg Loc: Marin County, CA
 
merrytexan wrote:
Enjoyed the tour mark...great set of shots!


Thanks very much Merry.

Reply
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