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Just how contagious is COVID-19
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Apr 21, 2020 10:52:42   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
raymondh wrote:
The only thing that this lacks lacks is common sense.
If the governor can give a logical reason why we can go fishing in a canoe but not a boat, or that we can go to the store & buy milk & bread but not a bag of fertilizer to spread on our lawn while sheltering in place than I'll buy your argument.

As soon as I read your post, I thought "Grand Rapids area".

Your Governor has to be concerned by the Detroit area, which has the third largest death toll in the country - worse than larger areas; it would be nice to have some compassion on fellow Michiganders.

I'm not sure why the 'no motorboats' rule, but she may have a reason, just as the 'no vacation homes' is there to protect the tiny hospitals in vacation areas.

It is too bad if Lowe's, Home Depot, and the local hardware store cannot give you curbside service as we get.
It is nice to have them lug heavy stuff out to your car.

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Apr 21, 2020 10:57:03   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
pendennis wrote:
COVID-19 does not cause death; it's an "underlyer", causing pneumonia, heart problems, ARDS, renal failure, among others. Those are "causae mortis". Doctors who pronounce pneumonia, heart attack, etc., are absolutely correct.

But it reduces the apparent cost of Covid-19.

In my state, they attempt to determine whether a person would have continued living if not hit with a "co" disease - as is true of the 'flu' statistics that are so often quoted and mis-used.

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Apr 21, 2020 10:57:38   #
drobvit Loc: Southern NV
 
TriX wrote:
You do whatever you think is best for you and everyone you come in contact with and is in compliance with the laws wherever you live. For me and my wife, we are in our 70s, I have heart disease and another grandchild on the way (who I hope to see), so we are staying home. I prefer to die in my own bed in my own home if possible, not alone on a vent in an ICU. I can tell you from having had two heart attacks, that when you’re lying on a gurney in the ER fighting for your life, you don’t give a damn about your bank balance. Once you’ve had that experience, it puts everything else in perspective. I hope you avoid it.
You do whatever you think is best for you and ever... (show quote)


👍 I see waaay too many people here not using any sort of protection... in grocery stores, 7-11s, Lowe's, etc. Must all think they're bulletproof! Just can't believe the ignorance I've been witnessing. Those types are definitely the ones to stay away from. Wonder what they'll be thinking when they're in ICU and intubated...🤔

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Apr 21, 2020 10:58:22   #
ntonkin Loc: western Upper Peninusla of Michigan
 
Retired CPO wrote:
So you want to get a wake up call when you wake up DEAD broke? And the country is DEAD broke. Guess what, a country that is DEAD broke isn't a country.


Someone with this mind set has a higher probability of contracting the virus. IF they do "wake up" or survive, I'm sure they will have a different view of the importance of their portfolio. The real crime here is that this type of person will likely infect dozens of other people before they end up dying or recovering. . . and some of those people will likely die from this person's foolish, selfish and greedy actions.

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Apr 21, 2020 11:00:35   #
Paul Diamond Loc: Atlanta, GA, USA
 
Dennis,

What problem do you have with

We need facts more than opinions, guesses, even 'educated' guesses. Push your elected officials for the ability to do all the tests that the medical professionals say they need and want. Facts.

You chose to reply to a medical cause of death that does not include the facts of what weakened the body to allow another illness or organ to fail. With no tests of the deceased, this vital information is lost to all professionals and to history. (So, HIV isn't a cause of death if pneumonia/rare cancers/etc. are the listed cause on the death certificate?)

What I am reading tells me that Covid-19 is not going to disappear in the future as a one time 'asteroid' event in the history of the Earth. Professional opinions I have read tell me that Covid-19 will come back again and again in the future, perhaps as soon as this Fall. If we don't learn and prepare for what we are dealing with now, how will we handle a return of the same illness in a few months?

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Apr 21, 2020 11:07:25   #
ntonkin Loc: western Upper Peninusla of Michigan
 
TriX wrote:
You do whatever you think is best for you and everyone you come in contact with and is in compliance with the laws wherever you live. For me and my wife, we are in our 70s, I have heart disease and another grandchild on the way (who I hope to see), so we are staying home. I prefer to die in my own bed in my own home if possible, not alone on a vent in an ICU. I can tell you from having had two heart attacks, that when you’re lying on a gurney in the ER fighting for your life, you don’t give a damn about your bank balance. Once you’ve had that experience, it puts everything else in perspective. I hope you avoid it.
You do whatever you think is best for you and ever... (show quote)


The problem here is that a person is usually infectious long before they start exhibiting symptoms. That is assuming that the person isn't a "carrier" and never actually comes down with the disease themselves, in which case they go around spreading the virus and never realize what they are doing.

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Apr 21, 2020 11:12:29   #
yssirk123 Loc: New Jersey
 
andesbill wrote:
Where are you getting your information. I haven’t read that in any of the hundreds of articles on COVID19 that I’ve read. Seriously, please include a link.
I just read about a California county which is reporting a .3% mortality rate based on antibody tests, so it does show a lower rate than previously thought. However, we don’t know the accuracy of the specific test as there are currently a great number with varying degrees of accuracy. It hasn’t been peer reviewed. Also we don’t know whether they can get reinfected, or whether their original infection can pop up again (as my 1957 flu did-twice) and cause severe problems that way.
Still, 3 times as many deaths is nothing to sneeze at, and since none of us not infected has immunity against this disease, even if the same % died as with normal seasonal flu, a great many more of us will get infected, with a correspondingly greater number of deaths.
I want to add that seeing all the closed stores, the empty ones that are opened, knowing the social deprivation that our kids are suffering, as well as all the pain that the unemployed are going through makes me want to cry.
Where are you getting your information. I haven’t... (show quote)


Relatively new studies - with more information online. As more data becomes available, our knowledge about the virus increases.

https://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-death-rate-20200331-ocftueotwvcure2p42d3blgwwy-story.html
https://news.yahoo.com/stanford-study-coronavirus-exposure-far-180622931.html

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Apr 21, 2020 11:13:50   #
ntonkin Loc: western Upper Peninusla of Michigan
 
Bill_de wrote:
Since there has been relatively little testing for covid-19 and no existing statistics to fall back on, how do they come up with a figure like 2% mortality rate? There could be millions of people that were infected and got over it without any medical intervention. Wouldn't that drastically reduce the mortality percentage?

I'm not saying there isn't a big problem and we should all do what we have to to stay safe. I just wonder how all the facts are determined.

---

---


Clearly, we won't know the full extent of this pandemic's true mortality rate until it has been "controlled" and testing is available for all.

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Apr 21, 2020 11:24:38   #
Retired CPO Loc: Travel full time in an RV
 
ntonkin wrote:
Someone with this mind set has a higher probability of contracting the virus. IF they do "wake up" or survive, I'm sure they will have a different view of the importance of their portfolio. The real crime here is that this type of person will likely infect dozens of other people before they end up dying or recovering. . . and some of those people will likely die from this person's foolish, selfish and greedy actions.


Foolish, selfish and greedy. I hope you remember this when you wake up standing on a street corner hoping someone with a little money left in their pocket comes by and feels sorry for you.
I'm not talking about my personal "portfolio", which by the way, is nothing to write home about.
Let me repeat this one more time for the simpletons. A country without an economy is not a country. If you want to count unicorns while the country goes up in flames, go for it. "Someone with this mindset" doesn't want to see that.

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Apr 21, 2020 11:25:53   #
ntonkin Loc: western Upper Peninusla of Michigan
 
TriX wrote:
I certainly hope that is the case. However, I would point out that (a)the presence of antibodies does not indicate that a person has actually had the disease (although they may), just that they have been exposed to it, and (b) considering that even if the mortality rate were no more than common influenza, the total number of deaths so far (more in the last month than the entire flu season) would indicate that it is much more contagious (and for the near future, there is no vaccine). It’s the number of deaths that matter, not just the percentages. Time and better/more testing will tell...
I certainly hope that is the case. However, I woul... (show quote)


Another thing that I would imagine there is no way to address is: What would the infection and death rate have been had there been no lockdowns or other measures most of the country has taken?

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Apr 21, 2020 11:37:56   #
EAM Loc: Milwaukee W
 
You state she is a nurse. The points made are by an ER physician. What is the name of that physician?
I'd like more details re: credibility of information, statistics etc.
Thank you

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Apr 21, 2020 11:41:25   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
Retired CPO wrote:
Foolish, selfish and greedy. I hope you remember this when you wake up standing on a street corner hoping someone with a little money left in their pocket comes by and feels sorry for you.
I'm not talking about my personal "portfolio", which by the way, is nothing to write home about.
Let me repeat this one more time for the simpletons. A country without an economy is not a country. If you want to count unicorns while the country goes up in flames, go for it. "Someone with this mindset" doesn't want to see that.
Foolish, selfish and greedy. I hope you remember t... (show quote)

What is your point??

We still have an economy.
Yes, it is sick right now, but it will recover.

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Apr 21, 2020 11:49:12   #
FrankR Loc: NYC
 
Retired CPO wrote:
So you want to get a wake up call when you wake up DEAD broke? And the country is DEAD broke. Guess what, a country that is DEAD broke isn't a country.


A society that laments the loss of income over the loss of life, doesn’t need a virus, it’s already sick.

Glad to see you’ve got your republicon/donald rump priorities in order, dollar signs over vital signs. You’re a good little lemming.

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Apr 21, 2020 11:54:24   #
Retired CPO Loc: Travel full time in an RV
 
rehess wrote:
What is your point??

We still have an economy.
Yes, it is sick right now, but it will recover.


I have made my point three times now. If you can't grasp it I can't help you. Our "sick" economy can only last so long. Then it either has to die or get better. The only way it can get better is if the country goes back to work.

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Apr 21, 2020 11:58:27   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
Retired CPO wrote:
I have made my point three times now. If you can't grasp it I can't help you. Our "sick" economy can only last so long. Then it either has to die or get better. The only way it can get better is if the country goes back to work.

You may have made your point before, but not in this post.
Yes, we have to go back to work, but that can happen only after we beat back this virus.
We will beat back this virus, but that will happen only after time of keeping our distance.

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