My Pastor (Page 3): No it's not. It's one version among many. True...however that doesn't automatically mean that the translation is somehow suspect. No he didn't. You don't know jack...

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

jaymatt wrote:

I hope you all realize that the primary protestant Bible that most folks adhere to is the King James version,

No it's not.

It's one version among many.

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so-called because its translation was commissioned by King James of England.

True...however that doesn't automatically mean that the translation is somehow suspect.

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James had many sections of the Bible written and re-written until they served his wishes.

No he didn't. You don't know jack crap about this subject...stop pretending like you do.

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Given that, I find it pretty hard to see the Bible as anything other than a guideline for good, benevolent behavior.

Considering the falsity of everything you've said so far, I'm not surprised you don't know what it is.

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Then of course, there’s the Catholic Bible which is different, and the newer translations that sometimes differ from the KJ version, etc. Given those facts, I find it hard to assume that any version or interpretation is any more correct than anyone else’s.

All of which illustrates your woeful lack of knowledge on this subject.

So now that we've established that you don't know anything about the translation and transmission of the bible, don't bother to say anything further about it...you are speaking from a place of ignorance.

I've done a LOT of studying in this area and have no issues with many translations; 99% are fine, some better than others but in no way does that mean that no version can be correct.

I'd discuss any specifics about the certain translation choices but since you don't actually know anything about it, it would be a waste of time.

Vietnam Vet

rpavich wrote:

All of which illustrates your woeful lack of knowl... (show quote)

What I hear is a lot of self-righteousness and judgementalism of others because they don't believe the same as you do.

Vietnam Vet

rpavich wrote:

No she doesn't.

PS: Getting your wife to do something isn't sexist, it's normal. God set up the household hierarchy, the husband is the head of the household because Jesus is the head of the church. The picture of the husband and wife team mirror Jesus and the church. (That's in the bible by the way).

Right, I am the head of my household, not the church. And also correct, Jesus is the head of the church. As the head of the church my wife correctly depends on the Holy Spirit to lead her in ministry, and not me.

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

Vietnam Vet wrote:

What I hear is a lot of self-righteousness and judgementalism of others because they don't believe the same as you do.

I bet you do.

Truth isn't a free for all. That is to say truth isn't defined by whatever you want it to be and feel strongly about.

Truth is objective, not subjective.

Truth by its very nature is divisive. There cannot be alternate competing contradictory truths.

In today's messed up version of Christianity whatever a person wants and feels strongly about is "right" and "true" but the fact is...God sets the standard of what's true and correct and whether you like it or not, women have their role just as men do.

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

Vietnam Vet wrote:

Right, I am the head of my household, not the church. And also correct, Jesus is the head of the church. As the head of the church my wife correctly depends on the Holy Spirit to lead her in ministry, and not me.

Sorry, wrong again.

Not only did you not get what I said, you seem to know very little about what the bible says on this subject. I'm sure your wife is sincere, she means well but if she's at all concerned about truth then she'll get her truth from God's OBjective word and not her SUBjective feelings about what she does or doesn't want or "feels led" to do or not do.

This is precisely why God's word is the standard and not feelings and emotions.

Vietnam Vet

rpavich wrote:

Sorry, wrong again.

Not only did you not get what I said, you seem to know very little about what the bible says on this subject. I'm sure your wife is sincere, she means well but if she's at all concerned about truth then she'll get her truth from God's OBjective word and not her SUBjective feelings about what she does or doesn't want or "feels led" to do or not do.

This is precisely why God's word is the standard and not feelings and emotions.

Should I defer to you, the apparent the all-knowing self-righteous one, who apparently feels like he can limit what God wants to do?

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

Vietnam Vet wrote:

Should I defer to you, the apparent the all-knowing self-righteous one, who apparently feels like he can limit what God wants to do?

Is this really the level of discussion that you bring to the table when it comes to the proper exegesis of God's word?

If someone challenges your wife's position then they are "all knowing self righteous"?

Really?

That's your retort?

And the "you are limiting God" thing?

That's about the weakest thing you could bring.

What God can or cannot do doesn't have a darn thing to do with the question of "What does God's word say about how men should act"?

If this is the level of discussion you are bringing I'm not at all surprised that you started this thread. This is a sad illustration of what the modern church has come to in much of the world.

If you (on the other hand) want to put forth your exegesis of specific passages that support what your wife is doing then we can discuss that, but until then, get a shovel and keep digging.

Vietnam Vet

I have seen the changes in peoples lives that she helps bring about as their pastor. I see a woman who is in love with God, and is looking forward to working on a Doctorate because she thinks this will help her bring people closer to God. She even leads a mission trip to Mexico every year to build a house for a family, and when they are done building each day, she takes a couple of people with her to share the gospel with the folks who live there.
You can do all the exegesis you want, and you can argue all you want about what the bible says and who understands it correctly. But in the parable of the sheep and goats there were no discussions about the scripture, the only thing that mattered is what people did or did not do for others in need. And she is doing it.
As some cooks say, the proof is in the pudding.

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

Vietnam Vet wrote:

I have seen the changes in peoples lives that she helps bring about as their pastor.

Subjective.

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I see a woman who is in love with God, and is looking forward to working on a Doctorate because she thinks this will help her bring people closer to God.

Subjective.

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She even leads a mission trip to Mexico every year to build a house for a family, and when they are done building each day, she takes a couple of people with her to share the gospel with the folks who live there.

Subjective.

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You can do all the exegesis you want, and you can argue all you want about what the bible says and who understands it correctly. But in the parable of the sheep and goats there were no discussions about the scripture, the only thing that mattered is what people did or did not do for others in need. And she is doing it.
As some cooks say, the proof is in the pudding.

Subjective and 100% wrong. This is a PERFECT illustration of why God's word is OBjective and not open to cherry picking due to our feelings about who things ought to be.

No...lol....there's not discussion about the sheep and goats but what that has to do with this subject I can't imagine. I'd have thought you'd go to something relevant to the discussion but nope....more perfect illustration of what's so wrong with this.

You can keep illustrating it or you can stop now, your choice.

Vietnam Vet

She loves God and loves others, whereas you are judgmental of others. I will take what's in her heart over what's in your heart any day.

Vietnam Vet

I assume you see yourself as a Christian God-fearing man who knows and understands the Bible in its truest form. However, you spend your time here criticizing a minister and her husband, and if you knew that my daughter became a minister of a country church a couple of weeks ago you would be criticizing her too.
And it takes a special kind of stupid to do that.
I don't stand for people who criticize my family, or a servant of God. So get lost.

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

Vietnam Vet wrote:

She loves God and loves others, whereas you are judgmental of others. I will take what's in her heart over what's in your heart any day.

I'm sure you will.

I'll take truth over subjective feelings any day also...Paul praised the Bereans for checking what he said against the written word, I'm in good company.

Feelings:
Judg. 21:25
"In those days there was no king in Israel. Everyone did what was right in his own eyes." (a negative according to the bible)

And
The bible's statement on how reliable feelings are:

Jer. 17:9
"The heart is deceitful above all things and desperately sick; who can understand it?

And of course Paul praising certain folks for checking what is said against the word:

Acts 17:10
"The brothers immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea, and when they arrived they went into the Jewish synagogue. Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessalonica; they received the word with all eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see if these things were so."

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

Vietnam Vet wrote:

I assume you see yourself as a Christian God-fearing man who knows and understands the Bible in its truest form.

Would you quit it with the lightly veiled insults?

I am a student of the bible (as all Christians should be) and thus I treasure it above subjective opinions. I'm merely fairly competent at exegeting it.

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However, you spend your time here criticizing a minister and her husband, and if you knew that my daughter became a minister of a country church a couple of weeks ago you would be criticizing her too.

If what you meant to say was that I value God's truth and I call out error instead of keeping my mouth shut, then yes...I do. That's biblical. The idea that "anything goes as long as it makes you happy and seems right to you!" Is not biblical.

And yes...I'd rightly criticize her also. (and the country church for allowing it to happen.)

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And it takes a special kind of stupid to do that.
I don't stand for people who criticize my family, or a servant of God. So get lost.

You've already illustrated how little your family cares about God's word, don't make it worse by tossing insults too.

SteveR Loc: Michigan

It is easy to find fault and say "a woman preacher is not Biblical." The Apostle Paul pointed out preachers who, in his time, preached the Gospel not out of love for Christ, but in order to make money. Despite the bad motivation, Paul said, "nevertheless the Gospel is preached." Sometimes spiritual women have had to fill the void when men were not available as spiritual leaders. If that's what it takes for the Gospel to be preached, I believe Paul would say, "nevertheless the Gospel is being preached." I am making an assumption, ofc, that this pastor, is a Bible believing, Bible preaching pastor.

bodiebill

rpavich wrote:

I bet you do. br br Truth isn't a free for all. T... (show quote)

Sola Scriptura!