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Armed Vigilantes on the US/Mexican Border is Repulsive!
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Apr 23, 2019 12:11:04   #
letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.
 
Blurryeyed wrote:
I'm interested in the citizenship question on the census, that comes before the Supreme Court today.


Can't wait!

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Apr 23, 2019 12:15:45   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
letmedance wrote:
Can't wait!


It's not a slam dunk, it should be but it is not, the courts sometime ago decided that illegals should be represented in congress, don't know how they ever decided that but the bastiches did, it complicates the issue.

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Apr 23, 2019 12:19:20   #
Bazbo Loc: Lisboa, Portugal
 
yhtomit wrote:
Felon in possession of ammo and guns.
So?


So...its a violation of Federal law.

Do you think laws that you don't like can be broken without consequence? How Trumpie of you. And unpatriotic.

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Apr 23, 2019 12:20:21   #
Elaine2025 Loc: Seattle, Wa
 
Bazbo wrote:
So...its a violation of Federal law.

Do you think laws that you don't like can be broken without consequence? How Trumpie of you. And unpatriotic.


Cool your jets big mouth. He didn't know. Anything to be an AS#.

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Apr 23, 2019 12:23:21   #
letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.
 
Bazbo wrote:
So...its a violation of Federal law.

Do you think laws that you don't like can be broken without consequence? How Trumpie of you. And unpatriotic.


I do really think he was saying that the Vigilantes were not arrested, only the felon with the gun, thus it might not be against the law to protect our borders from illegal immigrants even if you are only a civilian. .

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Apr 23, 2019 12:25:23   #
Bazbo Loc: Lisboa, Portugal
 
Blurryeyed wrote:
It's not a slam dunk, it should be but it is not, the courts sometime ago decided that illegals should be represented in congress, don't know how they ever decided that but the bastiches did, it complicates the issue.


Well, here is where your strict constructionist philosophy runs into a rough patch. The Constitution does not require a person to be a citizen to be counted in the required census. As I have pointed out before, the Founders were quite happy to have non citizens counted.

What you are unhappy with is designed into the system.

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Apr 23, 2019 12:31:46   #
Elaine2025 Loc: Seattle, Wa
 
Bazbo wrote:
Well, here is where your strict constructionist philosophy runs into a rough patch. The Constitution does not require a person to be a citizen to be counted in the required census. As I have pointed out before, the Founders were quite happy to have non citizens counted.

What you are unhappy with is designed into the system.


Well, it is being challenged. Let the SCOTUS decide.

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Apr 23, 2019 12:33:51   #
Bazbo Loc: Lisboa, Portugal
 
letmedance wrote:
I do really think he was saying that the Vigilantes were not arrested, only the felon with the gun, thus it might not be against the law to protect our borders from illegal immigrants even if you are only a civilian. .



A lesson in our recent history: the Klan were vigilantes.

No one is going to be arrested for "protecting our border" (a rather ill-defined term). They can be arrested for specific actions, like false imprisonment. These are not sworn LEOs. They are detaining people without any authorization whatsoever to do so.

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Apr 23, 2019 12:34:14   #
dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho
 
mjmoore17 wrote:
Keep up your delusions. This was discussed In Detail once already.

Here are a few with sources from the report included. You can thank me for educating you.

1. Trump did try to sabotage the investigation. His staff defied him.
When Attorney General Jeff Sessions told Mr. Trump that a special counsel had been appointed in May 2017, Mr. Trump grew angry: “I’m f$cked,” he said, believing his presidency was ruined. He told Mr. Sessions, “This is the worst thing that ever happened to me.”

Mr. Trump began trying to get rid of Mr. Mueller, only to be thwarted by his staff. In instance after instance, his staff acted as a bulwark against Mr. Trump’s most destructive impulses. In June 2017, the president instructed Donald F. McGahn II, the White House counsel, to remove Mr. Mueller, but Mr. McGahn resisted. Rather than carry out the president’s order, he decided he would rather resign.

Two days later, Mr. Trump asked another trusted adviser, Corey Lewandowski, to tell Mr. Sessions to end the investigation. Mr. Lewandowski did not want to, so he punted to a colleague, Rick Dearborn. He, too, “was uncomfortable with the task and did not follow through.”

Mr. Trump was angry that Mr. Sessions recused himself from the investigation. (Vol. II, Page 78)

2. So many lies. So many changed stories.
One of the unanswered questions of the past two years — which helped fuel the F.B.I. investigation, congressional inquiries and journalistic scrutiny — is why so many people lied, changed their stories and issued misleading statements to both the public and federal authorities.

The report recaps one false statement after another. Just a few examples:

Mr. Trump was livid when journalists revealed that he had unsuccessfully ordered Mr. Mueller’s firing. The president tried to get Mr. McGahn to say publicly that was false, but Mr. McGahn refused, saying that the news reports were accurate. Mr. Mueller’s report notably declared that Mr. McGahn was “credible.”

Mr. Trump also pressed the deputy attorney general, Rod J. Rosenstein, to give a news conference about the firing of the F.B.I. director, James B. Comey. The White House press office wanted Mr. Rosenstein to say it was his idea. Mr. Rosenstein told the president that a news conference was a bad idea “because if the press asked him, he would tell the truth.”
The White House press secretary, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, admitted issuing a statement to the news media “in the heat of the moment that was not founded on anything.”

No, F.B.I. agents didn’t actually call the White House offering support for Mr. Comey’s firing. (Vol. II, Page 72)

Mr. Mueller can’t explain why the stories about Mr. Comey’s firing keep changing. (Vol. II, Page 77)

3. Fake news? Not so much.
The president has spent the past two years denouncing the news media. He has repeatedly accused reporters of making up sources to destroy his presidency. The report, though, shows not only that some of the most unflattering stories about Mr. Trump were accurate, but also that White House officials knew that was the case even as they heaped criticism on journalists.
That tweet coincided with outreach to Mr. Cohen by Mr. Trump’s associates, and Mr. Cohen understood that this was all part of an effort to get him to “stay on message and be part of the team.”
In May 2017, for instance, The New York Times disclosed that Mr. Trump had asked Mr. Comey to end the F.B.I.’s investigation into the president’s national security adviser, Michael T. Flynn. Mr. Trump tweeted, “I never asked Comey to stop investigating Flynn. Just more Fake News covering another Comey lie!”

“Despite those denials,” Mr. Mueller wrote, “substantial evidence corroborates Comey’s account.”

In another instance, Mr. Trump appeared to use criticism of the news media as a legal strategy. He attacked a Times article suggesting that his former lawyer, Michael D. Cohen, might cooperate with the Justice Department and provide information about Mr. Trump.
That tweet coincided with outreach to Mr. Cohen by Mr. Trump’s associates, and Mr. Cohen understood that this was all part of an effort to get him to “stay on message and be part of the team.”

The president accused the “dishonest media” of making up stories that turned out to be true. (Vol. II, Page 147)

No obstruction? Not so fast.
Mr. Trump was quick to declare the report a total vindication.
But federal authorities went out of their way not to exonerate Mr. Trump. They wrote that his conduct in office “presents difficult issues that prevent us from conclusively determining that no criminal conduct occurred.”

If the evidence cleared the president, Mr. Mueller would have said so. It didn’t. (Vol. II, Page 8)

5. Evading an F.B.I. interview proved a successful strategy.
Mr. Trump repeatedly said he was eager to sit for an interview with Mr. Mueller’s team, despite his lawyers’ insistence that doing so would be a terrible idea.

The report makes clear why his lawyers were so worried about it. Mr. Mueller had a huge cache of unanswered questions, misleading and conflicting statements, and unexplained actions with which to confront the president. Sitting for an interview, the report makes clear, would have exposed Mr. Trump to far more problems.

Mr. Mueller said he chose not to subpoena the president because a court fight would delay the investigation. But that decision meant that the authorities were never able to ask the central question in the obstruction case: What was Mr. Trump thinking when he tried repeatedly to undermine the federal investigation?

Mr. Mueller believed he had the authority to subpoena the president. (Vol. II, Page 13)

6. No conclusive evidence of conspiracy, but lots of reason to investigate.
Mr. Mueller makes explicit what Mr. Trump has repeatedly cast doubt on: Russia secretly manipulated the 2016 presidential election.

The investigation ultimately found no evidence that anyone from Mr. Trump’s campaign participated in that effort, but the report reveals in stark detail the many suspicious interactions that had the F.B.I. so worried. Many of those have been reported, but the report amounts to a compendium that helps explain the origins of the F.B.I. investigation, known as “Crossfire Hurricane.”

For instance, it has long been known that George Papadopoulos, a young campaign aide, was told that the Russian government had “dirt” on Hillary Clinton in the form of thousands of emails. But the report goes much further, revealing that Mr. Papadopoulos suggested an explicit offer by the Russian government to work with the Trump campaign to sabotage Mrs. Clinton.

Mr. Papadopoulos indicated that Russia wanted to coordinate with the Trump campaign. (Vol. I, Page 89)


7. Imagine reading this report cold.
Prosecutors describe a president who was preoccupied with ending a federal investigation, a White House that repeatedly told misleading and changing stories, and a presidential campaign that was in repeated contact with Russian officials for reasons that are not always clear.

Even though prosecutors concluded that didn’t amount to provably criminal conduct, the report is astounding in its sweep. Yet it is also a reminder of how much the public has learned over the past two years about Mr. Trump’s conduct.

If the American public or members of Congress were learning these things for the first time, the political fallout would normally be devastating. The consequences of the report remain to be seen, but if people are not surprised or shocked by the revelations, then Mr. Trump may have benefited by the steady drip of news stories he has so loudly criticized.

The special counsel suggests a pattern of behavior by Mr. Trump to harm the investigation. (Vol. II, Page The157)
Keep up your delusions. This was discussed In Deta... (show quote)


WOW!!! All very neatly typed out. You probably used Cut and Paste. Still, nice job. But the problem, YOUR problem, still remains; had there been actual proof or something that the Left could actually CHARGE Trump with criminal charges they why didn't they? You and yours are nothing but Coulda, Woulda, Shoulda. Sure you will continue to have investigations after investigations to prop up the Liberal base, all the while telling them that the NEXT investigation will be the one, that real investigation that will bring Trump down. Good luck with that.

Your number 6 reads: Russia secretly manipulated the 2016 presidential election. One more time I will ask you or anyone else. Why didn't Obama do something about Russia manipulating the election? Even Obama stated that the Russians were trying to manipulate the system. Yet he did absolutely nothing. Why is that. Answer that question.


A pattern of behavior. Hmmmm. There was a pattern of corrupt unethical and criminal behavior with Obama, Hillary, Lois Lerner, Susan Rice, Eric Holder, James Clapper, John Brennan, John Kerry and a book load of others in the corrupt Obama administration to fill the Library of Congress. Yet here they all are, well respected by the likes of you and Frank T. Many lied to Congress. Hillary lied to the FBI, all lied to the American people.

You idiots want to see Trump's tax returns. Interesting that you did not want to see Timothy Geithner's tax returns when he was proven a tax cheat. Apparently tax cheats on the Left are acceptable. There is just one more example of your Leftist hypocrisy, traitor boy.

Always a pleasure my traitor boy BFF,

Dennis

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Apr 23, 2019 12:35:23   #
Elaine2025 Loc: Seattle, Wa
 
Bazbo wrote:
A lesson in our recent history: the Klan were vigilantes.

No one is going to be arrested for "protecting our border" (a rather ill-defined term). They can be arrested for specific actions, like false imprisonment. These are not sworn LEOs. They are detaining people without any authorization whatsoever to do so.


Ever hear of Citizens arrest?

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Apr 23, 2019 12:39:30   #
dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho
 
Bazbo wrote:
So...its a violation of Federal law.

Do you think laws that you don't like can be broken without consequence? How Trumpie of you. And unpatriotic.


You continue to push something stupid. Every one of us has stated that we are glad the felon in possession of a firearm SHOULD go to prison and we are happy he was arrested. Get real for a change. It is you on the Left who are unwilling to push for illegal aliens obeying Federal law regarding crossing the American sovereign border. You applaud for every illegal aliens who crosses the border undetected. How do you explain the millions of people you Liberals actually invite into America which is in violation of established law? You either agree with obeying the laws of the land or you don't. Conservatives do and Liberals do not. Simple as that.

Dennis

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Apr 23, 2019 12:40:58   #
dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho
 
letmedance wrote:
I do really think he was saying that the Vigilantes were not arrested, only the felon with the gun, thus it might not be against the law to protect our borders from illegal immigrants even if you are only a civilian. .


That is exactly my thought too, as in, The felon with the gun was arrested, so what is the problem.

Dennis

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Apr 23, 2019 12:47:06   #
dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho
 
Bazbo wrote:
A lesson in our recent history: the Klan were vigilantes.

No one is going to be arrested for "protecting our border" (a rather ill-defined term). They can be arrested for specific actions, like false imprisonment. These are not sworn LEOs. They are detaining people without any authorization whatsoever to do so.


Not true Bucko. Any American citizen does have the power of a citizen's arrest. He can detain the suspect/perpetrator to be turned over to the proper law enforcement agency. It is not false imprisonment at all as you are trying to tell us. Illegal aliens are violating a Federal law for which there is a criminal penalty. That law is still on the books and until it is no longer on the books it can be enforced.

I thought you were an attorney. I thought you knew this stuff. Apparently you don't know your butt from a hole in the ground. You really should read up on this stuff. Pretty interesting, especially when you have done it for a living. If the other people involved had been in the wrong don't you think they would have been arrested too. Apparently they were in the Right.

Let's do this again sometime,

Dennis

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Apr 23, 2019 12:47:56   #
letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.
 
Bazbo wrote:
A lesson in our recent history: the Klan were vigilantes.

No one is going to be arrested for "protecting our border" (a rather ill-defined term). They can be arrested for specific actions, like false imprisonment. These are not sworn LEOs. They are detaining people without any authorization whatsoever to do so.


Then why was not the entire group arrested?

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Apr 23, 2019 12:57:26   #
mjmoore17 Loc: Philadelphia, PA area
 
Blurryeyed wrote:
That's all you got? Good Luck, you and yours are going to need it. BTW when cutting and pasting it is generally considered proper to site the source.


Each area have the place in report that pertained to it, why would you need more? Next time, research yourself.

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