saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

Wow..Bruce with the Big Gun./????

You have over 2300 posts and nothing to offer the new people about Jpeg?

Oh well, it's going well as is.

Nikonian72 Loc: Chico CA

You do realize that your camera captures in raw format only, yes?
If you so instruct your camera (JPG only), it will edit that raw image to some programer's set tweaks, the same edits, everytime, then provide to you, a JPG format of original raw image.

saycheese Loc: By the Big Lake in West Michigan

Forgive me, but I think your skivvies are in a bunch.Chill out.Have a hot Ovaltine. Google RAW v Jpeg, and you will see many opinions touting one over the other.That way you won't have to suffer through the responses from people on this board who are not up to your standards of posting.
Annie

saycheese Loc: By the Big Lake in West Michigan

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

Ah Annie... smarter than most... you are simply onto me. My skivvies are quite comfortable, thank you. (Silk boxers Paisley design) The ovaltine is a good suggestion...Chill out... there's snow on the ground and it's about 34 degrees outside. No problem staying cool.

I think you gathered by now that this post has nothing to do with Jpeg and Jpeg only. Although I do wonder why the moderators are so reluctant to call BS on the vast number of Jpeg vs. RAW threads and the degree of uncivility raised in such post. Somebody has to be paying for all this futile bandwidth and we certainly are not.

I got exactly what I expected from the thread, I say this now and will continue to watch and see how many more people actually can't do something requested, and simply try to cannonball such threads..... (or Canon-ball)

It's been real, and it's been fun, but as they say, It has NOT been real fun!

Call me a troll if you like, but certainly call me a trouble maker. Again, where are the moderators?

Wendy2 Loc: California

1. Why jpeg? Initially jpeg is a safe why to go until you learn about your camera and all its possibilities.. There is quite a learning curve moving from a point and shoot to a DSLR.

2. Why not jpeg? You lose quality in jpeg, if you save as. In TIF and PSD you do not.

3 and 4. Fully utilize your cameras processing abilities? No, I do not, because I typically use raw for editing. However, I should set my camera up to use its capabilities so that my jpegs are the best they can be for my tastes. Such as sharpening, saturation, contrast and all the other choices available. If I did that, my jpegs would be more usable right out of the camera.

5. I do not operate as if there is no Raw. Maybe if I did I would be learn to be more careful how I shoot, and try harder to make it perfect in jpeg, or as close as possible. I try to get it right in camera with jpeg, but not as hard as I should.

saycheese Loc: By the Big Lake in West Michigan

"Smarter than most?" That's a pretty condescending comment to make considering a gazillion people are logged in here at any given time? The only "smart" thing about me is that I have a built-in snot radar,and can ferret one out immediately.
As to uncivility?You should try to not be that way. Have fun here.Don't nit-pick and you will make some good friends and learn an awful lot that you may not know already.
Annie

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

Nikonian72... Certainly you are knowledgeable as your 9000 posts would imply, and your are certainly correct.

Of course, one of the major shortcomings of digital sensors is that they CAN ONLY capture a RAW image. And to add to that, each manufacturers sensor captures a different RAW. Sony has captured a large part of that market. However, Kodak, Panasonic, ad infinitum sensors all had various rendering configurations for the RAW they captured, which, as you say, is ALL the sensor can do. The Foveon and Fujifilm sensors are considerably different in the final rendition of RAW they capture. One of the knowns is that the color cast from the sensors used by Canon and those used by Nikon before the Sony transition, was somewhat different.

So, it follows that a processing engine must be placed between the sensor and the buffer. That processing engine has the programming to correct a lot of sensor deficiencies, although it also allows a pass through of RAW capture to the card. This is controlled in the processing engine and selectable by the user, hence in camera processing in the choice of Jpeg.

But you pull me back into a RAW discussion here, you sly devil.

Jpeg processing in camera, and in Post gives the user so much more choice that the sensor does not allow. So, I am asking to simply overlook the shortfall of the sensor in only being able to capture one specific RAW file, and look at the capability of Jpeg. Of course, if the manufacturers had continued to offer three file formats, as some early DSLRs did....(my Olympus' could save RAW, TIFF, and Jpeg), my choice would have always fallen to TIFF because of the lossless, OR lossey choices available for TIFF. As it is, I still shoot a couple of Olympus DSLRs, for the selection of TIFF, which is one of the choices I offered for this thread.

So.... standoff here. Yes, camera sensors only capture RAW. In camera processing offers processing at the first compression of Jpeg, IF YOU TOTALLY KNOW your camera.

(Annie... Skivvies still loose and comfy, and I do have an Ovaltine on my desk. Oh Yes, I do appreciate the your comment regarding my superior posting powers) :thumbup:

sinatraman Loc: Vero Beach Florida, Earth,alpha quaudrant

I use jpeg fine with my p+s cause it doesn't shoot RAW. also if i am shooting something that is going to the web immediately,i will save some time and effort. Shooting with Lucille my d-100 I shoot raw unless i know i am going to shoot over 200 photos then i shoot jpeg to save space. (gotta buy another cf card)

2. why not jpeg? i like the control. also if i am working in layers I can't save and comeback if in jpeg.
3. in camera processing lets the camera make the choices. in addition the p+s means i have to search through menus and is a distracting pain in the but. The d-100 is like second generation dslr and has few processing modes. If I had a newer dslr i would try it just to see, but probably stick to post processing.

4 I just like tweaking and experimenting. i would rather do it on a 17 inch monitor then a 3 inch LCD screen.. course I do not understand why anyone wants to watch a movie on their cell phone sized screen either. I happen to enjoy the post processing, even though I do a great job of capturing in the camera, there is always room for improvement Unlike more important comparisons (coke vs Pepsi, ford vs Chevy, wolverines vs buckeyes (icky!) I have no bias one way or the other concerning jpeg. What works for you is the only thing that matters. Some like porterhouse steaks others like fillet Mignon. there isn't one style steak universally better then another. Does this answer your question?

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

Fantastic Post.... Thanks Wendy2... you really do play fair!!!

And on the point about doing a form of photography that makes you more intent on form and taking time in the process, my choice in that area is to put the Large Format 4X5 in the car and head out for 2-3 days into photogenic countryside. I also shoot a lot of MF. I am only about 40% digital at this point and having shot film since about 1960, I am still soaking up new information all the time. Education and open-mindedness never ends, no matter WHAT others say about me. :XD:

Thank you very much for participating and in a concise manner. :-D

Wendy2 Loc: California

Thanks!! I wish I could shoot manual focus, but wearing glasses or not, just can't focus as well, and fast as the camera. A 4X5 would be such a great experience! I envy you.

I am totally digital. Did film years ago but really sucked at it. Digital has helped me become a better photographer because of the immediate feedback.

GoofyNewfie Loc: Kansas City

While I have several Nikons, I still use the Fuji S5 in the studio and shoot jpeg only. It has an amazing sensor. I used to love Fuji color neg film, so it's no surprise the color is so good coming from a film maker. While it is capable of stopping/saving the "other" file format, if you dial the camera and lights in, there isn't much point for r@w files in what I need to do. Fuji r@w files are big and clunky anyway, in my opinion.
I shoot several events a year requiring prints on-site. No time for dinking with raw files. I have to get the jpeg's right in camera and let 'er rip.

I equate jpeg to shooting transparencies.

Is this what you were looking for, saichiez?

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

There is a great resurgence of large and Ultra large format photography. I buy and sell film cameras on eBay and best sellers are Large Format (prices good but rising, as is interest). Second best Medium Format. Digital is not a good seller... too many very recent cameras on the market.

Perhaps you'll give Large Format a try one day. Nothing pleases like a nicely exposed 4X5 transparency that would convert into a 450 to 600 Megapixel digital file. :thumbup:

saichiez Loc: Beautiful Central Oregon

Wonderful GoofieNewfie... thanks for participating. What you say here offers another and refreshing look... your take.

I've owned two S2, one S3 and two S5. The S5, as you know is built on the Nikon D200 chassis. The first one I sold had 284,000 shutter click and still shooting fine when I sold it to a fellow in the Federation of Russia.

Getting back to the Post.... All the Fujifilms Pro models made wonderful Jpegs, and the Wide Dynamic Range setting on the S5 made super Jpegs with extended Dynamic Range. Fuji dropped the ball when they did not continue with an S6, in my estimation. Looking right now for another S5.

lorenww Loc: St. Petersburg

In today's modern cameras your JPEG comes from a raw image.
The big question should really be, do you want your camera to convert your RAW image to a JPEG or would you prefer to make your own JPEG's.
I like to make my own personally.
Bottom line is that somewhere along the line there will be a JPEG conversion because you can't display a RAW file on a webpage or print them out.