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JPEG white balance CAN be changed
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Jan 23, 2023 23:16:07   #
Grahame Loc: Fiji
 
bikinkawboy wrote:
Styrofoam plate. Great idea!

These will become photographers collectors items soon, Styrofoam plates, cups and takeaway containers already banned in my country

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Jan 23, 2023 23:16:14   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
imagemeister wrote:
Pretty pictures SELL - even if they are not technically perfect .......This is ART ! there is NO perfect, NO accurate - only pleasing ....


Amen! You are wise beyond your years

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Jan 24, 2023 05:55:58   #
kymarto Loc: Portland OR and Milan Italy
 
bikinkawboy wrote:
Folks keep saying that the white balance can’t be changed on jpegs. I found an old Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 3 disc my kids had given me years ago. Loaded it and it will change the white balance on jpegs. You have three choices, as shot, auto or custom.

I had taken photos of completed construction at work using my Canon Rebel XS. A while back I was messing with the white balance at home with mixed LED-fluorescent light. The construction photos were taken with the camera set to auto mode. On a Nikon, auto ignores manual changes made to iso, WB, etc. Not so on the Canon to my surprise. VERY blue photos that couldn’t be fixed using Picasa or NX2. The Lightroom program easily fixed them using the auto WB setting. I don’t see Lightroom being useful for much else, but it saved my butt this time.
Folks keep saying that the white balance can’t be ... (show quote)


Of course jpg WB can be changed, but in a much more restricted way than RAW. RAW chroma adjustments directly influence the separate RGB channels, whereas with jpg a color cast is introduced which affects all three channels equally. Nowhere near as flexible.

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Jan 24, 2023 07:40:29   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
Grahame wrote:
These will become photographers collectors items soon, Styrofoam plates, cups and takeaway containers already banned in my country


How about a 3x5 card? Paper is not likely to be banned in the near future.

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Jan 24, 2023 08:44:06   #
SuperflyTNT Loc: Manassas VA
 
DirtFarmer wrote:
How about a 3x5 card? Paper is not likely to be banned in the near future.


Paper is often not pure white.

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Jan 24, 2023 09:37:45   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
DirtFarmer wrote:
How about a 3x5 card? Paper is not likely to be banned in the near future.


The problem with paper is that it always seems to reflect a tint of some sort. Papers are generally coated with optical brighteners. Often these absorb UV and emit a lower frequency of visible blue light. The same is true of many white fabrics, which will appear different depending upon the detergent used to clean them last.

I have found made-for-photography white balance targets to be "pretty good." I have three of many available:

> ExpoDisc — a white translucent lens cover used for custom/manual/preset white balance

> Delta-1 18% Gray Card — White on one side, gray on the other, 8x10 inches

> One Shot Digital Calibration Target — 24" square, three neutral stripes (near black, gray, near white)

The best is a ColorChecker Passport, a wallet-like affair with a lot of color tiles on it. It is used with software to create an ICC profile for your camera. If you need to be "commercial grade picky" about color, this is the tool you need.

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Jan 24, 2023 09:41:00   #
David in Dallas Loc: Dallas, Texas, USA
 
ysarexm, I scored an 8, which is pretty good.

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Jan 24, 2023 10:43:28   #
pecohen Loc: Central Maine
 
bikinkawboy wrote:
A while back I asked a question about raw vs jpeg and 21 pages later I was pretty well convinced that you can fiddle with the colors on a jpeg but not do an actual white balance alteration to one. I’m now convinced that you can do one but it will never be truly accurate, if there actually is such a thing as an accurate color replication.

I’ve learned from automotive painting that actually seeing color variations is where us men come up short. If you want to see if your new paint is a good match to the old one, you better call in your wife, mom, sister, daughter or the crazy cat woman next door because it’s a known fact that women see colors better than men. If any men on this forum claim to have superior color differentiation over some other guy or gal, they need to stop by the local body shop and ask a painter. Any honest one will confirm what I’ve said. And if the painter says otherwise, don’t take your car to him for a paint job. Besides, most men have no idea of what color taupe or sea foam is. But women do!

If you use the wrong white balance on a raw image you still won’t get accurate results. Which is one problem I’ve found with standardized WB settings on a camera or photo program. My kitchen lights are a mixture of LED and fluorescent bulbs, which really confuses a camera. And no WB setting on a camera can get it right. I guess the answer is to use the gray card thing for the kitchen and another for the living room. Or change out all the bulbs to LED, which fortunately are getting less expensive.
A while back I asked a question about raw vs jpeg ... (show quote)


If your photography is for the purpose of scientific or engineering studies, I can surely understand the need for an accurate color setting. On the other hand, I have read articles that tell other photographers how to simulate the golden hour or the blue hour by making color adjustments.

I confess that I generally take a similar approach, not particularly to fool anyone but to get what I consider a pleasing picture. Maybe the lighting when shooting was not ideal; no problem I can make a little adjustment in PP. I don't really see any harm in this, but I can understand how old-time photographers who did not have this freedom in post-processing and who spent years learning to "get it right in the camera" are troubled by the changing times.

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Jan 24, 2023 10:57:02   #
SuperflyTNT Loc: Manassas VA
 
pecohen wrote:
If your photography is for the purpose of scientific or engineering studies, I can surely understand the need for an accurate color setting. On the other hand, I have read articles that tell other photographers how to simulate the golden hour or the blue hour by making color adjustments.

I confess that I generally take a similar approach, not particularly to fool anyone but to get what I consider a pleasing picture. Maybe the lighting when shooting was not ideal; no problem I can make a little adjustment in PP. I don't really see any harm in this, but I can understand how old-time photographers who did not have this freedom in post-processing and who spent years learning to "get it right in the camera" are troubled by the changing times.
If your photography is for the purpose of scientif... (show quote)


I’ll agree that for me it’s more about getting color I like rather than accuracy. That being said it’s still much easier with raw than JPEG.

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Jan 24, 2023 11:12:05   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
pecohen wrote:
If your photography is for the purpose of scientific or engineering studies, I can surely understand the need for an accurate color setting. On the other hand, I have read articles that tell other photographers how to simulate the golden hour or the blue hour by making color adjustments.

I confess that I generally take a similar approach, not particularly to fool anyone but to get what I consider a pleasing picture. Maybe the lighting when shooting was not ideal; no problem I can make a little adjustment in PP. I don't really see any harm in this, but I can understand how old-time photographers who did not have this freedom in post-processing and who spent years learning to "get it right in the camera" are troubled by the changing times.
If your photography is for the purpose of scientif... (show quote)


Some of us straddle the fence on this. We need "close to reality" color for some projects, and "pleasing" or "mood" color for others. Often, I make a judgement call: "Do I portray a scene in a manner appropriate to its mood, or do I record the colors as accurately as possible?" Knowing how to manipulate the variables in both situations is a skill worth knowing.

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Jan 24, 2023 13:19:57   #
pecohen Loc: Central Maine
 
burkphoto wrote:
Some of us straddle the fence on this. We need "close to reality" color for some projects, and "pleasing" or "mood" color for others. Often, I make a judgement call: "Do I portray a scene in a manner appropriate to its mood, or do I record the colors as accurately as possible?" Knowing how to manipulate the variables in both situations is a skill worth knowing.


In all things, judgement is likely to be needed.

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Jan 24, 2023 13:27:46   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
kymarto wrote:
Of course jpg WB can be changed, but in a much more restricted way than RAW. RAW chroma adjustments directly influence the separate RGB channels, whereas with jpg a color cast is introduced which affects all three channels equally. Nowhere near as flexible.


Maybe restricted way is good enough

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Jan 24, 2023 13:54:20   #
davyboy Loc: Anoka Mn.
 
burkphoto wrote:
Some of us straddle the fence on this. We need "close to reality" color for some projects, and "pleasing" or "mood" color for others. Often, I make a judgement call: "Do I portray a scene in a manner appropriate to its mood, or do I record the colors as accurately as possible?" Knowing how to manipulate the variables in both situations is a skill worth knowing.

It’s up to you! Remember what you see on the hog stays on the Hog

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Jan 24, 2023 14:24:44   #
Jim Plogger Loc: East Tennessee
 
I use Adobe Camera Raw to adjust white balance on jpegs. Works quite well.

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