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Romney's Lies
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Oct 5, 2012 21:22:03   #
BigBear Loc: Northern CT
 
Richard94611 wrote:
I forgot to add that the big culprit here in logical error is BlurryEyed. He's the one who tried to pull the wool over your eyes by comparing one type of unemployment figure with another.


Blurry has it exactly right.
Logic has nothing to do with the liberal state of mind.

Reply
Oct 5, 2012 21:30:20   #
Richard94611 Loc: Oakland, CA
 
Your response is symptomatic of one of the major things wrong with present-day members of the Republican Party. You are anti-logic, anti-science, anti-evidence. Jesus may save you when the waters rise, but will he dry your feet ?




BigBear wrote:
Richard94611 wrote:
I forgot to add that the big culprit here in logical error is BlurryEyed. He's the one who tried to pull the wool over your eyes by comparing one type of unemployment figure with another.


Blurry has it exactly right.
Logic has nothing to do with the liberal state of mind.

Reply
Oct 5, 2012 21:31:53   #
BigBear Loc: Northern CT
 
Richard94611 wrote:
Your response is symptomatic of one of the major things wrong with present-day members of the Republican Party. You are anti-logic, anti-science, anti-evidence. Jesus may save you when the waters rise, but will he dry your feet ?


Hey people ... we have another babbler.

Reply
 
 
Oct 5, 2012 21:47:42   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Richard94611 wrote:
Talk about total confusion and denial -- the Republican reaction to the just-released job numbers is a scream. It is one of the funniest things I have seen in a long, long time.


Let's have a chuckle shall we Richard???? Do you know where the drop in unemployment came from today... Did you know that it was almost historic, the largest gain in that sector for in over 30 years??? Do you even know how the collect the data to determine unemployment???

They do two surveys Richard, one is a business or establishment survey where they collect data from about 450 thousand businesses or about 1/3 of the businesses in America and use that data to predict jobs in that sector, many economists expected that number to come in at something like 110,000 to 112,000 jobs having been created in September, the actual number came in at 114,000. The economists also predicted the unemployment rate to rise back to 8.3%, but it didn't instead it dropped to 7.8, but how could this be, how could those economist be so wrong???? Well Richard, it was the Household Survey where we saw the economy heat up, and it got really hot, it added 873,000 jobs, the economists did not see that coming, no way Jose....

So what is the Household Survey Richard? It is where they poll 60,000 homes in America to try and determine the number of people working out of their homes or in home based businesses, it is by far the smallest statistical sample and the most unreliable sample included in the jobs data, somehow this number took off in September adding almost 900,000 jobs. I am sure that the president is taking much solace in this number, but I am also sure that he has no more confidence in it than I do....

http://www.bls.gov/web/empsit/ces_cps_trends.pdf

Reply
Oct 5, 2012 22:16:52   #
Richard94611 Loc: Oakland, CA
 
Again, Blurry, you are up to the same old trick -- trying to compare apples with oranges. When you look at the same measure each time, the jobless rate is going down. You can try your sophistry all you want, but it doesn't cut the mustard,, except perhaps with fools.



Blurryeyed wrote:
Richard94611 wrote:
Talk about total confusion and denial -- the Republican reaction to the just-released job numbers is a scream. It is one of the funniest things I have seen in a long, long time.


Let's have a chuckle shall we Richard???? Do you know where the drop in unemployment came from today... Did you know that it was almost historic, the largest gain in that sector for in over 30 years??? Do you even know how the collect the data to determine unemployment???

They do two surveys Richard, one is a business or establishment survey where they collect data from about 450 thousand businesses or about 1/3 of the businesses in America and use that data to predict jobs in that sector, many economists expected that number to come in at something like 110,000 to 112,000 jobs having been created in September, the actual number came in at 114,000. The economists also predicted the unemployment rate to rise back to 8.3%, but it didn't instead it dropped to 7.8, but how could this be, how could those economist be so wrong???? Well Richard, it was the Household Survey where we saw the economy heat up, and it got really hot, it added 873,000 jobs, the economists did not see that coming, no way Jose....

So what is the Household Survey Richard? It is where they poll 60,000 homes in America to try and determine the number of people working out of their homes or in home based businesses, it is by far the smallest statistical sample and the most unreliable sample included in the jobs data, somehow this number took off in September adding almost 900,000 jobs. I am sure that the president is taking much solace in this number, but I am also sure that he has no more confidence in it than I do....

http://www.bls.gov/web/empsit/ces_cps_trends.pdf
quote=Richard94611 Talk about total confusion and... (show quote)

Reply
Oct 5, 2012 22:26:00   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Richard94611 wrote:
Again, Blurry, you are up to the same old trick -- trying to compare apples with oranges. When you look at the same measure each time, the jobless rate is going down. You can try your sophistry all you want, but it doesn't cut the mustard,, except perhaps with fools.



Blurryeyed wrote:
Richard94611 wrote:
Talk about total confusion and denial -- the Republican reaction to the just-released job numbers is a scream. It is one of the funniest things I have seen in a long, long time.


Let's have a chuckle shall we Richard???? Do you know where the drop in unemployment came from today... Did you know that it was almost historic, the largest gain in that sector for in over 30 years??? Do you even know how the collect the data to determine unemployment???

They do two surveys Richard, one is a business or establishment survey where they collect data from about 450 thousand businesses or about 1/3 of the businesses in America and use that data to predict jobs in that sector, many economists expected that number to come in at something like 110,000 to 112,000 jobs having been created in September, the actual number came in at 114,000. The economists also predicted the unemployment rate to rise back to 8.3%, but it didn't instead it dropped to 7.8, but how could this be, how could those economist be so wrong???? Well Richard, it was the Household Survey where we saw the economy heat up, and it got really hot, it added 873,000 jobs, the economists did not see that coming, no way Jose....

So what is the Household Survey Richard? It is where they poll 60,000 homes in America to try and determine the number of people working out of their homes or in home based businesses, it is by far the smallest statistical sample and the most unreliable sample included in the jobs data, somehow this number took off in September adding almost 900,000 jobs. I am sure that the president is taking much solace in this number, but I am also sure that he has no more confidence in it than I do....

http://www.bls.gov/web/empsit/ces_cps_trends.pdf
quote=Richard94611 Talk about total confusion and... (show quote)
Again, Blurry, you are up to the same old trick --... (show quote)


You're full of dung Richard, I gave you a link to the report, where you can see the number for yourself and if you look a few pages in you will see an explanation of the report and the sampling data as well as error calculation.... Now that is the actual BLS site... you know... Bureau of Labor Statistics, the govt agency that is covering the presidents backside for the day, so if you have a problem with it it is because like I said, your full of dung and it is kinda like Romney said when he smacked the president in the debate... You somehow keep thinking that if you keep saying it someone will believe that it is the truth, that is the democratic way of doing things these days... I have had fun with you today Richard, I have shown your posts to be little more than lip service to the one, but I have also shown them to contain nothing of substance... but I must say, our little dance has been entertaining.

Reply
Oct 5, 2012 22:36:39   #
Danilo Loc: Las Vegas
 
If a liberal tells me the car coming down the road is going to hit me, I will look at the car and make my own decision.
If Obama tells me the sun is going to come up tomorrow, I will check in the morning for myself.
That they can express joblessness as a percentage, while discarding unemployed people from the equation tells me they are separated from reality by something I cannot help them with.
2+2=4 and I'm sticking with it!

Reply
 
 
Oct 6, 2012 05:44:45   #
skip549
 
Why is it when republicans tell the truth, democrats think they are lying

Reply
Oct 6, 2012 07:22:04   #
wbym300 Loc: Wisconsin
 
Richard,I live in an area that is very typical middle america. I work for a small city public works department. What I can tell you for sure is that there is less money for the tax payers now than 2 years ago and certainly less than 5 years ago. Our budgets are cut to the absolute minimun for equipment, repairs, and personel. I have been with this job for 20 years and have never seen an economy this bad. And now Obama is going to add the increased burden of healthcare on businesses and people that are barely hanging on. I don't understand what kind of so called expert this Tom Dick is but he is just another In a long line of the Progressive Mantra Spin (PMS). Based on Obama's record I dont believe Tom or Obama. jb

Reply
Oct 6, 2012 08:34:13   #
TimS Loc: GA
 
Big Bird? BIG BIRD? ARE YOU NUTS? Lets take a quick look at how Big Bird is doing in this economy shall we?

Shows like Sesame Street are multi-million dollar enterprises capable of thriving in the private market. According to the 990 tax form that all nonprofits are required to file, Sesame Workshop president and CEO Gary Knell received $956,513 in compensation in 2008. And from 2003 to 2008, Sesame Street made more than 211 million dollars on merchandising sales.


Richard94611 wrote:
Republican logic error # 1: To compare two different types of unemployment statistics, hoping we won't see that it is like comparing apples and oranges.

Folks, the unemployment figure is dropping, by any measure. Obama is having some success, despite the efforts of Republicans' in the House trying to prevent it.

Wall street is higher than it ever has been or has been in a long, long time. That should please the 1% among you.

And you're taking on an adversary more powerful than you -- Big Bird.





Blurryeyed wrote:
Richard94611 wrote:
Just thought you would like to see information about Romney's five biggest lies during the first presidential debate:

Tim Dickinson
October 4, 2012 9:32 AM ET
Mitt Romney turned in a polished performance in last night's presidential debate – and revealed himself to be an accomplished and unapologetic liar. In an evening where he sought to slice and dice the president with statistics, Romney baldly misrepresented his own policy prescriptions, made up numbers to fit his attacks and buried clear contrasts with the president under a heaping pile of horseshit.

Here are mendacious Mitt's five most outrageous statements:

1. "I don't have a $5 trillion tax cut." Romney flatly lied about the cost of his proposal to cut income-tax rates across the board by another 20 percent (undercutting even the low rates of the Bush tax cuts). Independent economists at the Tax Policy Center have shown that the price tag for those cuts is $360 billion in the first year, a cost that extrapolates to $5 trillion over a decade.

2. "I will not reduce the taxes paid by high-income Americans." Romney has claimed that he will pay for his tax cuts by closing a variety of loopholes and deductions. The factual problem? Romney hasn't named a single loophole he's willing to close; worse, there's no way to offset $5 trillion in tax cuts even if you get rid of the entire universe of deductions for the wealthy that Romney has not put off the table (like the carried interest loophole or the 15 percent capital gains rate.) The Tax Policy Center report concludes that Romney's proposal would create a "net tax cut for high-income tax payers and a net tax increase for lower- and or middle-income taxpayers." Moreover, some of Romney's tax cuts are micro-targeted at American dynasties, particularly his proposal to eliminate the estate tax, which would reduce his own sons' tax burden by tens of millions of dollars.

3. "We've got 23 million people out of work or [who have] stopped looking for work in this country." Romney is lying for effect. The nation's crisis of joblessness is bad, but not 23 million bad. The official figure is 12.5 million unemployed. An additional 2.6 million Americans have stopped looking for jobs. How does Romney gin up his eye-popping 23 million figure? He counts more than 8 million wage earners who hold part-time jobs as also being "out of work."

4. Obamacare "puts in place an unelected board that's going to tell people ultimately what kind of treatments they can have." Romney is reviving Sarah Palin's old death panels lie here. Obamacare does establish an Independent Payment Advisory Board to help constrain the growth of Medicare spending. The body has no authority to dictate the practices of the private insurance marketplace. And the law also makes explicit that this body is banned from rationing care or limiting medical benefits to seniors.

5. "Pre-existing conditions are covered under my plan." In the biggest whopper of the night, Romney suggested that his health care proposal would guarantee coverage to Americans with pre-existing conditions. This is just not true. Under Romney, if you have a pre-existing condition and have been unable to obtain insurance coverage or if you have had to drop coverage for more than 90 days because you lost your job or couldn't afford the premiums, you would be shit out of luck. Insurance companies could continue to discriminate and deny you coverage, as even Romney's top adviser conceded after the debate was over.



Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-first-debate-mitt-romneys-five-biggest-lies-20121004#ixzz28T8MM512
Just thought you would like to see information ab... (show quote)


Rolling Stone.... Such a credible partisan source, most people would be embarrassed to quote their articles... Weren't they exposed for a huge lie in the last week or two... Fact checkers have already stated that Obama's claims about Romeny's tax plans are false...

Let's just take a look at what the actual Tax Policy center says about that particular lie....

Quote:
As a political matter, such reticence is understandable. To sell yourself and your policy, it’s natural to emphasize the things that people like, such as tax cuts, while downplaying the specifics of who will bear the accompanying costs. Last February, President Obama did the same thing when he rolled out his business tax proposal. The president was very clear about lowering the corporate rate from 35 percent to 28 percent, but he provided few examples of the tax breaks he would cut to pay for it. Such is politics.

What should we infer from this result? Like Howard Gleckman, I don’t interpret this as evidence that Governor Romney wants to increase taxes on the middle class in order to cut taxes for the rich, as an Obama campaign ad claimed. Instead, I view it as showing that his plan can’t accomplish all his stated objectives. One can charitably view his plan as a combination of political signaling and the opening offer in what would, if he gets elected, become a negotiation.

http://taxvox.taxpolicycenter.org/2012/08/08/understanding-tpcs-analysis-of-governor-romneys-tax-plan/
As a political matter, such reticence is understan... (show quote)


It is the labor department who is hood winking you about unemployment as U-6 is at 14.7% as of today's report and that does indeed represent approximately 23 million people in a workforce of about 150 to 155 million people.
quote=Richard94611 Just thought you would like t... (show quote)
Republican logic error # 1: To compare two differ... (show quote)

Reply
Oct 6, 2012 08:36:51   #
hj Loc: Florida
 
Richard94611 wrote:
BigBear wrote:
I'll take whatever Romney has over the Obozo we have now.


With the unemployment numbers going down, you may not have that opportunity.


You mean the fabricated unemployment numbers going down??? After 42 straight months above 8%, suddenly it drops just before the election. Right! More Obama generated lies that don't take into consideration those who just gave up looking for work, or are working a meager part-time job just to get by.

Reply
 
 
Oct 6, 2012 08:43:44   #
bvargas Loc: Palm Harbor, Florida
 
Now you should also list the lies that Obama has done, (NOT SAID) but done. He is on record. By listing both parties, you will have a more fair playing field. This is our Country, we better save it. Let's stop playing sides and go for what's best for all.
It all depends on what side of the fence you are on. I would call all the part time, under waged workers, employed, UNEMPLOYED
Who can raise a family on these ridiculous wages and exist.
Whoever is in office, should be voted out and maybe in time, they won't Lie as much.

Reply
Oct 6, 2012 09:25:58   #
ted45 Loc: Delaware
 
In the interest of fairness and we all know Democrats are all about fairness: Richard posted Romney"s Lies today. I would assume he is creating a list of Obama's Lies for posting tomorrow.

I would like to help him with his research:

http://factcheck.org/2012/10/dubious-denver-debate-declarations/


I do appreciate the Democrats desire to be fair and balanced.

Reply
Oct 6, 2012 10:11:13   #
jvance Loc: Granbury, Texas
 
Richard94611 wrote:
Just thought you would like to see information about Romney's five biggest lies during the first presidential debate:

Tim Dickinson
October 4, 2012 9:32 AM ET
Mitt Romney turned in a polished performance in last night's presidential debate – and revealed himself to be an accomplished and unapologetic liar. In an evening where he sought to slice and dice the president with statistics, Romney baldly misrepresented his own policy prescriptions, made up numbers to fit his attacks and buried clear contrasts with the president under a heaping pile of horseshit.

Here are mendacious Mitt's five most outrageous statements:

1. "I don't have a $5 trillion tax cut." Romney flatly lied about the cost of his proposal to cut income-tax rates across the board by another 20 percent (undercutting even the low rates of the Bush tax cuts). Independent economists at the Tax Policy Center have shown that the price tag for those cuts is $360 billion in the first year, a cost that extrapolates to $5 trillion over a decade.

2. "I will not reduce the taxes paid by high-income Americans." Romney has claimed that he will pay for his tax cuts by closing a variety of loopholes and deductions. The factual problem? Romney hasn't named a single loophole he's willing to close; worse, there's no way to offset $5 trillion in tax cuts even if you get rid of the entire universe of deductions for the wealthy that Romney has not put off the table (like the carried interest loophole or the 15 percent capital gains rate.) The Tax Policy Center report concludes that Romney's proposal would create a "net tax cut for high-income tax payers and a net tax increase for lower- and or middle-income taxpayers." Moreover, some of Romney's tax cuts are micro-targeted at American dynasties, particularly his proposal to eliminate the estate tax, which would reduce his own sons' tax burden by tens of millions of dollars.

3. "We've got 23 million people out of work or [who have] stopped looking for work in this country." Romney is lying for effect. The nation's crisis of joblessness is bad, but not 23 million bad. The official figure is 12.5 million unemployed. An additional 2.6 million Americans have stopped looking for jobs. How does Romney gin up his eye-popping 23 million figure? He counts more than 8 million wage earners who hold part-time jobs as also being "out of work."

4. Obamacare "puts in place an unelected board that's going to tell people ultimately what kind of treatments they can have." Romney is reviving Sarah Palin's old death panels lie here. Obamacare does establish an Independent Payment Advisory Board to help constrain the growth of Medicare spending. The body has no authority to dictate the practices of the private insurance marketplace. And the law also makes explicit that this body is banned from rationing care or limiting medical benefits to seniors.

5. "Pre-existing conditions are covered under my plan." In the biggest whopper of the night, Romney suggested that his health care proposal would guarantee coverage to Americans with pre-existing conditions. This is just not true. Under Romney, if you have a pre-existing condition and have been unable to obtain insurance coverage or if you have had to drop coverage for more than 90 days because you lost your job or couldn't afford the premiums, you would be shit out of luck. Insurance companies could continue to discriminate and deny you coverage, as even Romney's top adviser conceded after the debate was over.



Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-first-debate-mitt-romneys-five-biggest-lies-20121004#ixzz28T8MM512
Just thought you would like to see information abo... (show quote)


I hardly think so. you go to the Rolling stone for your info ? LOL

Reply
Oct 6, 2012 10:12:16   #
Wick Loc: Venice, Florida
 
Fair and balanced? Where were you righties when Bush was spending like a drunken sailor and lying us into war to help his war profiteer pals get filthy richer? Where were you righties when Bushco outed a CIA agent risking her life because she dared debunk the story about sales of yellowcake uranium from Niger to Iraq? This was the basis for the claims of Mushroom Clouds etc. Total Bull and you know it. Where the hell were you blind loyalists then? Where were you when Bushco made claims of Aluminum tubes photographed by spy planes being used to process Uranium? Their own scientists from defense told them it was wrong, that these tubes were completely unsuitable for that task and were likely repositories for conventional weapons, black powder and such.
Ya know, I find it strange that anyone who disagrees with you people are labeled as trolls etc and told to stay on the thread subject but you all recently went off subject to discuss the Black prison population. Very revealing. Man, the hatred for this president is so palpable that it seemingly drips from your very pores on this site. It's the same with every rightie website. Denial, hatred, namecalling, and a total inability to deal with the opines of others. I really feel sorry that Blurry and the rest of you have no life or no flesh and blood friends to talk to. I've been on vacation and I can go on here any time day or night and he's here along with many others. I suggest you get over your prejudices and get a friggin life.

ted45 wrote:
In the interest of fairness and we all know Democrats are all about fairness: Richard posted Romney"s Lies today. I would assume he is creating a list of Obama's Lies for posting tomorrow.

I would like to help him with his research:

http://factcheck.org/2012/10/dubious-denver-debate-declarations/


I do appreciate the Democrats desire to be fair and balanced.

Reply
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