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A Ventilator May Not be What You Think
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Jun 27, 2020 10:05:27   #
Kmgw9v Loc: Miami, Florida
 
Stephan G wrote:
More Myths.

One cannot lie when commenting about something they know so little about. I give you that point.


That is true, but it doesn’t excuse those who simply make things up to fashion a make-belief truth to suit any position.
Trump does it, but that is another topic.

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Jun 27, 2020 10:13:35   #
digit-up Loc: Flushing, Michigan
 
rmorrison1116 wrote:
Ah yes, just what we all need, more covid19 doom and gloom. I'm guessing you're one of those folks who puts on the face mask before leaving the house, wears it in the car, and doesn't take it off until safely back in your bleach sented home.


And further- more, check your spelling of “scent”. It doesn’t SMELL right. Smell, not a type-o.............. RJM

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Jun 27, 2020 10:16:51   #
Stephan G
 
Kmgw9v wrote:
That is true, but it doesn’t excuse those who simply make things up to fashion a make-belief truth to suit any position.
Trump does it, but that is another topic.


St. Ronnies's favorite phrase was "Well, I don't know." Well, he was a bit more truthful than the "I never met that guy!" Trump.

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Jun 27, 2020 10:17:11   #
digit-up Loc: Flushing, Michigan
 
Kmgw9v wrote:
You need to be informed, and you need to learn some empathy for the 125,000 that have died, and the unknown future innocents that will suffer, and die.
Good Lord, be kinder.


I checked my ignore list, once I read Morrison’s post, cuz I believed I probably had HIM on my personal IGNORE list. Sure enough, he was already there!!

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Jun 27, 2020 10:18:51   #
digit-up Loc: Flushing, Michigan
 
Bill_de wrote:
My sister, now a retired nurse, always told her friends (mostly doctors and nurses) to never use a ventilator on her. She never put it writing. When the day came that she needed it "now" the doctor who new her wishes told my brother-in-law that he had about a minute to decide. He said do it, then called my other sister and me to ask if he did the right thing. We both said yes. Now, 15 years later she is still doing fine.

Some time later I met the doctor while visiting my sister. The topic of the ventilator came up and the doctor started laughing. He said he was thinking about the day they were ready to take her off it and most of the nurses walked off the floor. They were all afraid of how mad my sister was going to be when she found out what they did.

When the dust settled she threw a party to thank them all.

---
My sister, now a retired nurse, always told her fr... (show quote)

Wow!! Wouldn’t that have been a great event to attend? Wonderful!!.........RJM

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Jun 27, 2020 10:22:41   #
digit-up Loc: Flushing, Michigan
 
Harry0 wrote:
You guys still always amaze me. Where did you put Hillary in all this.
Your article was very good, and accurate. When we hear "on a ventilator" we should already know this.
In the meantime, you're responding to yet another "metoo" right winger.
Him? Social distance? Mask? Stay home? He thinks YOU are the dumb liberal.
And I've been on a ventilator. You forgot about the thrush infections.


Oh DAMN !! Some idiot had to make the issue “POLITICAL” how refreshing?? NOT !!................RJM

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Jun 27, 2020 10:24:35   #
srscary Loc: Cary, NC
 
rmorrison1116 wrote:
Ah yes, just what we all need, more covid19 doom and gloom. I'm guessing you're one of those folks who puts on the face mask before leaving the house, wears it in the car, and doesn't take it off until safely back in your bleach sented home.


😝😒😰😥😞😳

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Jun 27, 2020 10:24:56   #
digit-up Loc: Flushing, Michigan
 
rmorrison1116 wrote:
You know not of what you speak. If anyone's a fool it's the person who passes judgement when they are making incorrect assumptions, and false accusations. You are, what my favorite cartoon rabbit says, a maroon.


Let me say this one more time for effect, you have been on my ignore list for a few years now!! You are laugh- able...........RJM

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Jun 27, 2020 10:33:18   #
phlash46 Loc: Westchester County, New York
 
Kmgw9v wrote:
You need to be informed, and you need to learn some empathy for the 125,000 that have died, and the unknown future innocents that will suffer, and die.
Good Lord, be kinder.



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Jun 27, 2020 10:36:21   #
phlash46 Loc: Westchester County, New York
 
Architect1776 wrote:
Actually it does kill people.
I have a technician who works at Walmart part time.
He had a stock person die and the determining cause of death was the mask because he could not get enough fresh air.
This is not some third party internet rumor but from the person who found the dead body in the back area.
So yes, masks will kill you.


Bullwhompy.

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Jun 27, 2020 10:37:37   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
Architect1776 wrote:
So you say that I am lying about ventilators laying around?
There is an excess of them and NO ONE was ever denied one in the USA ever from the beginning.
Death rate now is at 1/2 that of the annual flu.

I added emphasis of the last sentence.
I got tired of waiting for you to reply, so I did some reseach on my own.
For the annual flu season, the CDC estimates the total number of deaths
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/past-seasons.html
Over the last ten years, the largest estimate is 61,100 in 2017-18.
Even with shutting the country down, more correct to say "death rate is at least twice that of the annual flu".

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Jun 27, 2020 11:00:36   #
David Martin Loc: Cary, NC
 
rehess wrote:
I added emphasis of the last sentence.
I got tired of waiting for you to reply, so I did some reseach on my own.
For the annual flu season, the CDC estimates the total number of deaths
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/past-seasons.html
Over the last ten years, the largest estimate is 61,100 in 2017-18.
Even with shutting the country down, more correct to say "death rate is at least twice that of the annual flu".

But what is meant by "death rate"? Is it total number of deaths? Or number of deaths per number of cases?

For 2017-18: "The overall burden of influenza for the 2017-2018 season was an estimated 45 million influenza illnesses, 21 million influenza-associated medical visits, 810,000 influenza-related hospitalizations, and 61,000 influenza-associated deaths."
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/2017-2018.htm

So for the 2017-18 flu, total deaths = 61,000. And #deaths per #cases = 0.14%.

For Covid-19 as of this moment:
Number of cases = 2,554,906 and number of deaths = 127,691.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

So for Covid-19 (thus far), #deaths = 127,691. And #deaths per #cases = 5.0%.

So, while for raw numbers of deaths, Covid-19 "death rate" is twice that of the 2017-18 flu, for case fatality rate, meaning #deaths per #cases, Covid-19 "death rate" is 35.7 times the death rate of the 2017-18 flu (5.0% vs. 0.14%).

And we're not done with Covid-19 yet.

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Jun 27, 2020 11:01:59   #
sippyjug104 Loc: Missouri
 
Dennis, the description shared with you about the realities of being on a ventilator are sadly ever so true.

About three years ago my 82-year old business partner went into the hospital for heart surgery. Due to difficulties of him breathing he was put on a ventilator. As you described he was sedated to tolerate it. As time went by they tried to wean him from being on it. The process took most of the day to bring him out of the drugged state, remove the tube and see if he would continue breathing on his own. Each time they tried it did not go well for either him or them.

Ultimately the family made the decision to let nature take it course for he could not be on the machine forever and doubted that he would want to be that way had he had a choice. When they took him off, he did not go quietly into the night as they say.

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Jun 27, 2020 11:15:56   #
Blair Shaw Jr Loc: Dunnellon,Florida
 
dennis2146 wrote:
Sent to me by a friend:

Dennis


Yikes! My friend sent this from a co-worker. I don’t know how true it is but his wife is a nurse at Cedars. And my sister, who is a retired nurse practitioner, agrees with this.

From a source . . .

Not to scare you/ but allows u to see the other side of going out unmasked/without a shield:

Here you go folks... for those people who don't understand what it means to be on a ventilator but want to take the chance of going out without a mask...

For starters, it's NOT an oxygen mask put over the mouth while the patient is comfortably lying down and reading magazines. Ventilation for Covid-19 is a painful intubation that goes down your throat and stays there until you live or you die.

It is done under anesthesia for 2 to 3 weeks without moving, often upside down, with a tube inserted from the mouth up to the trachea and allows you to breathe to the rhythm of the lung machine. The patient can't talk or eat, or do anything naturally - the machine keeps you alive.

The discomfort and pain they feel from this means medical experts have to administer sedatives and painkillers to ensure tube tolerance for as long as the machine is needed. It's like being in an artificial coma.

After 20 days from this treatment, a young patient loses 40% muscle mass, and gets mouth or vocal cords trauma, as well as possible pulmonary or heart complications.

It is for this reason that old or already weak people can't withstand the treatment and die. Many of us are in this boat ... so stay safe unless you want to take the chance of ending up here. This is NOT the flu.

Add a tube into your stomach, either through your nose or skin for liquid food, a sticky bag around your butt to collect the diarrhea, a foley catheter to collect urine, an IV for fluids and meds, an A-line f to monitor your BP that is completely dependent upon finely calculated med doses, teams of nurses, CRNA’s and MA’s to reposition your limbs every two hours and lying on a mat that circulates ice cold fluid to help bring down your 104 degree temp.

-Anyone want to try all that out? Stay home and wear a mask when you go out! Stay safe and well!-

What this article doesn't say, is that the patient can hear everything that is said so if the staff carelessly talks about death, the patient panics. If the sedatives are lessened, the patient panics because he can't breath or talk or, in his case, move. When they begin to lower the pain medications, the patient screams in his head but can't make a sound. When they take out the tubes it's extremely uncomfortable. A trachea may replace the respirator, the patient still can't talk or eat without a tube.

Your child, your spouse, your parent, suffers from covid 19 alone in the hospital. The victims are not limited to strangers. When you choose to crowd, unmasked, into newly opened stores for some irrelevant purchase, ask yourself if it's worth a lifetime of knowing your child suffered, maybe died, alone.
Sent to me by a friend: br br Dennis br br br Y... (show quote)


AMEN .. DENNIS.....it ain't No Joke.....be careful and wear the Mask and stay alive and keep your distance.

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Jun 27, 2020 11:18:07   #
Burtzy Loc: Bronx N.Y. & Simi Valley, CA
 
dennis2146 wrote:
Actually you are 100% wrong in your assessment of what I do. There was no doom and gloom in the message. It was for information. Until this morning I had no idea what a ventilator actually did or how it was used. It opened my eyes and my purpose for posting was to simply open the eyes of others who did not know either.

Again, I don't do many things I should be doing to stop the spread of the virus. Yet as a Liberal you take the Liberal way of putting me down for simply offering information. Aren't you special little sweetheart...

I see you live just up the road from me. Maybe you are unaware that San Luis Obispo, your county, Santa Barbara and Ventura counties just had a spike in virus cases. I can't help but wonder if it is you who has spread some of the virus germs around due to your nonchalance regarding the virus.

Dennis
Actually you are 100% wrong in your assessment of ... (show quote)


You just had to go and politicize your point of view. I'll have you know, that I am a resident of Ventura County and until you turned the discussion into a Liberal vs. Conservative one, I completely agreed with you. But for your edification, let me approximate the polling that came out yesterday. More than 65 percent of the country is in favor of wearing masks. The only group that is more against than for are the Republicans. In congress, it is the Republican side of the aisle that is refusing to wear masks, not the so called "Liberals." I am what some would call a "bleeding heart liberal" and I never name-call except when the recipient is someone who truly deserves it like the President for his failure during the pandemic or the majority leader of the Senate for his refusal to bring any legislation to the floor. (He even calls himself the grim reaper.) And for the record, it is the extreme right wing in this country that attended Trump's two mask-less rallies and likely spread the virus much more widely in both Oklahoma and Arizona. So, while I totally agree with you about the necessity of wearing a mask for everyone's protection, I couldn't let your dig at Liberals stand.

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