PHRubin wrote:
I particularly take issue with the angle of view statement. It is totally irrelevant what AOV a lens has outside a camera. The AOV captured by the sensor is what is important to the photo and, hence, the photographer. If I have two cameras of the same MP, one FF, one crop, for any given lens f/l the crop camera, in the photo, will put more pixels on the subject. That is more reach and shallower AOV, as far as the product, and therefore, the photographer is concerned. It really boils down to how you express it.
I particularly take issue with the angle of view s... (
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Paul.... I will make one more attempt to help you understand where you are confused. If this does not work, we will still be friends... and I will remain silent… I truly wish to help you understand..... But, it is OK if we have different views.
The following statement is a direct quote from the introduction of Internet 'Wiki' entitled “Crop Factor” and I will post the link below... it says...
....." Of course, the actual focal length of a photographic lens is fixed by its optical construction, and does not change with the format of the sensor that is put behind it....."
The same "Wiki" also says...
..... " Because of this crop, the effective field of view (FOV) is reduced by a factor proportional to the ratio between the smaller sensor size and the 35 mm film format (reference) size. ...."
So Paul, what a photographer is doing -- is taking a 'smaller piece' of the 'FOV' and stretching it to what a FF camera would be... therefor creating an illusion or MYTH.... Read the below URL link.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crop_factor#IntroductionI might also add that, by using a smaller sensor, and ‘stretching’ the actual ‘captured’ smaller image, you have now introduced much more ‘noise’ into the resulting, enlarged rendition…. If you were to shoot the picture with a full frame sensor… you will have the exact image in the center of that full frame… AND, this will be on a ‘better quality sensor with less noise’ ….
Simply put Paul, the photographer is ‘capturing a smaller piece’ of the FOV, stretching it, and by doing so, ‘reducing the quality’ of the partial capture… and you are doing this on a sensor of ‘lesser quality..’
But, your basic argument is that, if someone take a 300 mm lens, from a FF (24mm x36mm -FF) sensor camera, and they put it onto a APS-C (22.3mm x 14.9mm) or 1.6 crop sensor camera.. you now have a 480 mm lens………….
Now, my question to you is…... If that is such a wonderful idea? Why stop there…. Let’s put the same 300mm lens onto a Micro 4/3 sensor (which is 18mm x 13.5m) which has a crop factor of 2.0 and now…. You have a 600mm lens…. WOW!!!..... OR…. Your using a 300m which cost $ 5,000 and replacing a 600 mm lens which cost about $ 12,000… What you have done is created a negative equivalent size equal to that of the old 110 cameras… and saved one heck of a bunch of money…. NO, it does not work that way Paul
Camera companies make smaller sensors because they can reduce their cost, there is less the difficulty of manufacturing the smaller sensor, and they can provide a cheaper product to the consumer…. It is a given fact that Full-Frame sensors can cost as much as 10 to 20 times the cost of a APS-C sensor… Camera companies do NOT make smaller sensors to help photographers think that they have a ‘BETTER’ system for a cheaper price………… There is NO logic in that…
So, basically, your theory is …. Reduce the size of the sensor, that make the size of the lens bigger, and bigger, and you still get this wonderful and glorious, beautify picture… and OH, BTW, the cost just keeps going down.?? How does that work?
I would invite you to read the article from B & H, which is one of the most trusted camera stores out there and it is entitled…. “Understanding Crop Factor” … the link is below…
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/explora/photography/tips-and-solutions/understanding-crop-factorIn the sixth paragraph of this article it says… and I quote …. “However, regardless of what kind of camera or sensor you place behind the lens, the focal length will not change just because you have a larger or smaller sensor or frame of film…. “
Next, continue to read, down to the section entitled “Crop Factor” and you will see that what you are doing is, in fact, just ‘capturing a small’ piece or area of the FOV, then through what is known as Post Processing, you are ‘Stretching’ this ‘small capture’ and making it bigger…. Therein lies the the ‘false illusion’ …
I would like to point out to you that “if you shoot in the Full-Frame to begin with” …. You still have the same image in the center, only with more canvas or sensor area around it….
I would also point out to you that this is what camera manufacturers actually make what Canon calls the “S” lens… which means ‘smaller’ sensor… and they are made at a cheaper price and cover only the small sensor, and not the FF sensor… and even with this “S” lenses, the lens is NOT designated as a 480mm lens when it is actually a 300mm lens. Everyone thinks it is “480mm” because, again, you ‘stretch’ the image …. Put a different way… ‘Stretching an image does NOT make you lens bigger…or longer…’
So Paul, in the wise words of the Canadian based Philosopher, Matshona Dhliwayo, who is known for this quote …. “Knowledge is wealth, wisdom is treasure, understanding is riches, and ignorance is poverty.”… I will ‘leave you’ to choose the path which best fits your needs…
Cheers
GeoVz
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