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May 21, 2019 16:23:02   #
jldodge
 
Despite others' experiences (and NOT to discount them), I avoid "subscription" revenue models. These models allow their purveyors MORE leeway on investment in their products to maintain the value since they benefit from their customer base who is so invested in their software that the switching costs are extremel high (sorry for the runon). I am evaluating Capture One and ON1 as alternatives. Not that they won't ultimately evolve to a subscription model BUT they don't have the customer base that Adobe has so that decision is down the road a number of years. I have already resigned myself to NOT purchasing ANY subscription products from Adobe. I have a similar issue with Quicken but that is for another discussion.

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May 21, 2019 17:00:40   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
Linda From Maine wrote:
I have loved PS Elements since first purchase of version 12. Compared to Corel Paintshop Pro (back in 2013), it is very well organized, easy to see and access all the tools, plus you have different workspaces for quick, guided and expert.

In expert mode you have layers, layer masks, blend modes. It easily accepts plug-ins from Topaz and Nik Collection.

PS Elements is a stand-alone, one-time purchase. Version 2019 is currently on sale for $70.

The only time you may run into an "obsolescence" issue is when purchasing a new camera and your current version of Elements is no longer supported and doesn't recognize your raw files. At that point choice is to convert the raw to dng in a free converter, or purchase a newer version of Elements.
I have loved PS Elements since first purchase of v... (show quote)



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May 21, 2019 17:11:37   #
DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA
 
Bill_de wrote:
... I would guess that a good number of subscribers never have gone, nor will ever go, beyond the basics...


I'm with Bill. Not everyone needs the top of the line product. Some (probably many) are satisfied with software that just does what they need or know.

In grad school we had a machinist whose motto was "Better is the enemy of good enough", meaning if you try for perfection you are likely to screw things up irretrievably.

Nevertheless, I still try for "better". I think it's always good to be in danger of learning something new.
Fortunately the software I use can be used nondestructively so when I screw up I can start over.

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May 21, 2019 17:28:19   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
jldodge wrote:
Despite others' experiences (and NOT to discount them), I avoid "subscription" revenue models. These models allow their purveyors MORE leeway on investment in their products to maintain the value since they benefit from their customer base who is so invested in their software that the switching costs are extremel high (sorry for the runon). I am evaluating Capture One and ON1 as alternatives. Not that they won't ultimately evolve to a subscription model BUT they don't have the customer base that Adobe has so that decision is down the road a number of years. I have already resigned myself to NOT purchasing ANY subscription products from Adobe. I have a similar issue with Quicken but that is for another discussion.
Despite others' experiences (and NOT to discount t... (show quote)


Subscription has so far proven cheaper in the long run. I started using CC 5 yrs ago in 2014, and I have not spent half of what the last so-called perpetual licenses for CS6 Extended and LR 4 cost - approximately $1300. Photoshop and Lightroom users are "invested" in the software because it is good stuff. Switching costs are a non-issue. You stop the subscription, you stop paying. Your images are yours. Your catalog is yours. LR remains functional enough to view your catalog and your edits, export your images to other applications if you wish, etc etc. You just can't use the develop module to edit images.

It's a little different in Photoshop, but you can still use Bridge I think. In any case, I don't understand your statement "switching costs are extremel high" and my experience tells a completely different story. Your objection is not based in math, nor is it based in any rational thought process. I am not saying you are wrong - I am just saying you aren't working with good facts. and a big NO - C1 and On1 are NOT replacements for LR and PS - I know this first hand because I use all of the above. C1 does offer the subscription alternative at the present, but it is not as good a deal as Adobe's. C1 perpetual license is more expensive to purchase than LR was, and the subscription is twice the cost of LR AND PS. You can't compare C1 to LR/PS - C1 is NOT a complete photo editing solution, LR/PS is. If you think C1 is complete, then I don't have the time to explain why they aren't, other than saying that C1 is like a great bushel of apples - and LR/PS is an apple pie with a scoop of ice cream.

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May 21, 2019 17:37:02   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
kstephens43 wrote:
I have used Paint Shop Pro for a number of years and find that I can do almost anything that I would want to do in Photoshop. The exception is that Paint Shop Pro cannot use Photoshop Actions. PSP gives me high value for the dollar, and when a new version comes out, Corel lets existing user upgrade for a bargain. The customer support from Corel leaves something to be desired, but I don't have to use their services very often. I am using the latest version of PSP (2019 Ultimate), 64-bit version.
I have used Paint Shop Pro for a number of years a... (show quote)


Adobe has free upgrades - you pay just one price AND you get to use Actions. I started photo editing using PSP back in 1990 - I was avoiding the outrageously high cost of PS.

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May 21, 2019 17:38:32   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Tronjo wrote:
Two years ago I replaced Lightroom with Capture One and never looked back.


I love watching people who "never look back" get bit by the dog they left behind because they aren't looking back

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May 21, 2019 17:49:50   #
spaceytracey Loc: East Glacier Park, MT
 
PSE with the Nik Collection works for me.

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May 21, 2019 18:39:47   #
domcomm Loc: Denver, CO
 
I just noticed that Fuji is having a give-away on Luminar if you buy one of their lenses by the end of the year.

https://skylum.com/l/fujifilm?utm_source=Fujifilm&utm_medium=partner&utm_campaign=Bonus_software

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May 21, 2019 19:08:28   #
bwana Loc: Bergen, Alberta, Canada
 
fetzler wrote:
After the recent price announcements and removal of support for older versions, there is quite a bit of discussion on the internet for replacements for Lightroom and Photoshop. I sometimes use Nikon NX-D (not so powerful but sometimes more than adequate) and Olympus Workspace. Both programs are Free. I also have the Correl products (Paintshop Pro and Aftershot)

The question for discussion is what programs do you like and what programs don't you like? Why? Are you going to consider replacing Lightroom?

I am not interested in the cheapest software but value for the dollar.
After the recent price announcements and removal ... (show quote)

I've found Capture One very adequately replaces Lightroom w/ functionality to spare. Affinity Photo does everything I've ever used Photoshop for and has great Panorama, HDR, Stacking and Focus Merge/Stacking tools right up front on the menu.

Adobe's software is no longer the only kid on the block AND this is good for innovation and consumers.

bwa

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May 21, 2019 19:21:25   #
cochese
 
traderjohn wrote:
It's ten bucks a month. The value is LR & PS.
You spend how much on a camera and all the related paraphernalia. LR&PS is the best bang for your buck.


I personally use GImp and darktable. Of course I also use Linux. The best bang for MY buck is free open source software. I prefer to spend my money on photo gear not software to support the gear.
And save your arguments against Linux, it is a robust OS that can do all and more than windows. As for OSX... it's unix based too.

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May 21, 2019 20:06:57   #
dubyacee
 
I'm a Affinity fan. Does everything that I need done. PS might be better but I don't need better.

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May 21, 2019 20:12:01   #
bwana Loc: Bergen, Alberta, Canada
 
dubyacee wrote:
I'm a Affinity fan. Does everything that I need done. PS might be better but I don't need better.


Same here! And for my usage, Affinity Photo is better...

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May 21, 2019 20:22:09   #
Sentinel4
 
You might want to try Alien Skin X4. 30 day free trial. Works with light room for easy downloading.
Tutorials from Anthony Morganti as well as in support on site.
Sentinel4

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May 21, 2019 20:24:31   #
DVZ Loc: Littleton CO
 
I use ACDSee for organizing and raw developing and Affinity Photo. I'm happy with the combination but there are a lot of good alternatives out there. Cost isn't really the issue because the subscription fee is reasonable, I just got started down the road early on with ACDSee and really like it and there is nothing that comes close to Affinity for its price. I purchased it when it first came out and have been getting free upgrades ever since. I'm sure that will end at some point.

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May 21, 2019 20:51:31   #
geodowns Loc: Yale, Michigan
 
That's really something, I'm still using good old CS3 Photoshop on Windows 10, sometime Nx-D and Luminar for the fun of it. But mostly CS3, I know its old but since I don't know what the newer versions are like, I don't know any better. But if I upgrade it will probably be CS4, from what I've been told it works better with my D300. I wont get any help from Adobe, but I done good with CS3 so should be ok with CS4. I'm sure there's better options that someone gonna tell me.

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