dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho

I honestly don't think photographers are any meaner than other groups of people. One thing I do find in common these days is that we are all talking to each other via computer rather than face to face. Not one of us can accurately judge what the other person's mood is, his experience in photography, whether he/she is normally a mean tempered soul and so on. So when we post photos and someone says, I think it would look better if you did this or that, it is often taken as that person telling us that the photo is not any good and it needs to be changed to suit the taste of the commenter. Often nothing could be farther from the truth.

A few years ago after just starting with UHH and not really knowing the rules of decorum I thought I was being helpful by suggesting that the OP crop the photo, something simple like that. I was immediately jumped on by not only the OP but by others as well. What did I know about photography, how dare I make any suggestions toward another posters photo, and so on. Since that time I have not made any comments unless asked or the photo is in the section where feedback is desired. My trying to offer a suggestion brought me only anger from others. My intentions were good in that I was trying to be helpful to someone who was not sure of composition. But as I was told, I had no business offering suggestions.

Even when asked for suggestions on a photo I try to apologetically offer what I think may make the photo somewhat better and that seems to work for the most part.

There are photos submitted every day that are simply exquisite in their color, subject matter, composition, exposure, everything it takes to make a photograph a prizewinner. On the other hand there are tons of photos that are submitted that are out of focus, poor composition, no known idea of why the photo was taken regarding subject matter and so on. But what do we see from viewers? Great shot Fred, you sure nailed that one, great subject matter and so on. How on earth can a new person or even an experienced photographer get better if we all say what a good job they are doing but really not good at all?

Dennis

fotobyferg

“On the other hand there are tons of photos that are submitted that are out of focus, poor composition, no known idea of why the photo was taken regarding subject matter and so on. But what do we see from viewers? Great shot Fred, you sure nailed that one, great subject matter and so on. How on earth can a new person or even an experienced photographer get better if we all say what a good job they are doing but really not good at all?”

I’ve noticed that as well, people trying to be nice....such a contrast to those who make crabby remarks regardless of the picture or question.

Flyerace Loc: Mt Pleasant, WI

I think people criticize others because they apply their own opinions to others' work. I do not like jazz music. I listen politely, clap my hands because they did a good job and get out to go home as fast as I can. I try to see the other photographer's work the way they were looking at it. When I look at my photos, I'm trying to capture something "my way". Everyone today is so "sensitive". It is time to take a breath, go to the concert, gallery or personal show and enjoy the effort of the performer/photographer. Remember, variety is the spice of life. Stay nice!

photogeneralist Loc: Lopez Island Washington State

My camera club is built around the idea of friendly critiques Here's the rules we use for critiques:

Thoughts on constructively critiquing photographs .

GENERAL (The Prime Directive )
Photography produces art.
Art is in the eye of the beholder
Art is very subjective
Different people like different things.

Therefore, your opinions or thoughts about a photograph are not right! Nor are they wrong! They are just one person’ s opinion.


Responsibilities of the person submitting work to be critiqued

1. Explain your pre-visualization at the time of the photograph
a. What attracted you to take the photo?
b. What story did you want the photo to tell?
c. What is the “Hero” of your photo?
d. How did you plan to identify the hero? What compositional elements did you use to identify the “hero”?
e. What story did you want your photo to tell? Do you think your photo tells the same story you were pre-visualizing when you captured the image? Does it tell a different story now? Does it tell the story well?
f. What would you do differently next time?

NOTE: This self analysis is not easy. In fact it’s very hard work! But as you gain experience and knowledge, and develop the “ instincts “ of self-analysis it will become a part of your thought processes.


Responsibilities of the person critiquing a photograph.

1, Remember that your opinion is just an opinion
2. Avoid presenting your opinion as fact. Your “facts” might be opposite to another person’s facts. Photography is after all, subjective and you are only one person among many different people and see the world through your unique paradigms which are (gasp) not universally shared or accepted.
3. Always state your critique comments as your opinion. IE: In my opinion… , or If this were my photograph, I would…
4. Absorb the submitter’s pre-visualization explanation and restrict your comments to help the photographer toward their goals. Your goals for their photograph are not important to the photographer unless your comments help them move closer to their pre-visualization
a. Say what you think is right with a photo before you offer suggestions for how it might have been done differently to better support the pre-visualized story . What compositional elements were well done and contribute to the story?
5. Say what (and state it as your opinion only) suggestions you might have to help the photo approach the photographer’s vision of what they wanted to photo to be.
a. Explain why you made the suggestion and why and how (in your opinion) it would have helped the photo more closely match the photographer’s pre- visualization.
6. Don’t forget to applaud the photographer’s effort and willingness to open their work to constructive critique. Praise what you think they got right. Share your opinion of their growth as a photographer. NEVER say or do anything that could be possibly construed (by the most sensitive and/or least self-confident among us) as equating a photographer’s work with their value as a person and colleague.
7. Avoid use of one word reviews. Don’t say “Super photo” or “Beautiful” etc. That does the photographer no good except for a temporary ego boost. It doesn’t let them know your opinion of what makes the photo good nor how it might have been improved or done differently in support of the photographer’s pre-visualization. They cannot learn from a one -word review.

As we get further into the composition elements, you might be able to discuss a photo in terms of YOUR OPINION OF :
Separation of subject and background (field separation)
Use of depth of focus
Framing
Tonal values overall (and of individual elements of the photo)
Contrast
Layering --- foreground, middle ground, and background --- depth of the photo
Impact of color
Balance of visual weights
Rule of thirds (or not)
Eyes
Leading lines
Line of sight of subject’s gaze
Frame breaks
Format of the rectangle (the ratio of the sides of the cropping) What effect does it have on the photo?
Timing.
Clarity of what is the subject “Hero” of the photo
What is the secondary focal point? Does it reinforce or detract?

dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho

I don't disagree with you at all but put it in context. We ALL apply our opinions to everything we see and hear in life. All we have is our own opinions to go on. I am not even saying our opinions are correct but unfortunately is what our lives have brought us. But some opinions are totally obvious and correct. An out of focus photo is almost 100% not a good photo. Some parts of the photo not being in focus are perfectly fine and we call that bokeh. But we want that in our photos or most of us do to a degree. Waterfalls or moving water can be sharp as a bell or soft, moody and even cloud like. Groups of people like some but not the other affects of that type of photo. It depends on the photo. But it also depends on what the photographer want us to see. If he or she want us to see flowers in a soft, romantic light then the flowers may be blurred somewhat. But if the photographer wants us to see a geometric pattern in a flower then it should be sharp as a tack. Everything comes into play.

Dennis

sleeper54

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From the linked article...

"The next time you receive advice from another photographer regarding your own photography, consider: 'Is this criticism, or is this feedback?' Once you know the difference, you can decide whether to take the advice or disregard it."

..?!? Why would one disregard valid advice..?? Whether delivered as criticism or feedback..??

...tom...

photogeneralist Loc: Lopez Island Washington State

Getting back to the original question: Most photographers are NOT mean people. Some may be socially inept but not consciously mean. As an example compare the decorum and helpfulness in this website to the vile vitipritude you are likely to find in nearly any other discussion blog, Yeah -- there are a few who seem to determined to tear down other folks to their level, but far fewer and far less intensely vile than other blogs dedicated to other fields of interest.

You are apparently running with the wrong bunch of photographers.