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Experience at the big blue store
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Jan 10, 2019 13:01:11   #
NJphotodoc Loc: Now in the First State
 
I stopped going to BBS when I saw an item online and when I went to the store, it was substantially more expensive. I went to Customer Service and told them so the clerk pulled it on on the internet and confirmed the price difference. He then paged the section clerk and told him to give me a price override at the web price. When I asked if he was going to change the price in the computer, I was told that Corporate sets the price but if the customer could prove it was lower, then they would honor the lower price.
That was the last time I went there and it was over 5 yrs ago. And no, I have no desire or interest to give them a second chance

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Jan 10, 2019 15:31:59   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Cables are a high profit margin product, and since the introduction of Monster Cable and similar products, stores like BB and office supply stores have made a fortune on uninformed consumers. In the audiophile industry, there are vendors selling “polarized copper ion” AC power cables at $600 (!), and there are users that swear they can hear the difference (so much for the power of suggestion). There are indeed applications where high quality is extremely important, such as coax for RF exposed to weather, but I doubt seriously if you can see any difference in picture quality between a $10 and a $50 HDMI cable. I do prefer gold plated connector contacts, but the plating is so thin and ubiquitous that it shouldn’t increase the price that much.

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Jan 10, 2019 19:09:05   #
jackm1943 Loc: Omaha, Nebraska
 
St.Mary's wrote:
It so happens I needed a HDMI cable yesterday (Jan 9, 2018). Went to a local WalMart and bought a HDMI cable, 6 foot in length, for $6.98, plus tax. The store had a plethora of HDMI cables of varying lengths and prices.


Interesting. I drove right past a Walmart on my way to the big blue store. I don't normally think of them for this "Radio Shack" type of item.
JackM

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Jan 10, 2019 19:10:38   #
Halftrack
 
TriX wrote:
The whole “thin wire” or “thick wire” thing is a load of it - doesn’t matter except for cosmetics.


I don't know what your background is, so I will only say that with forty years as a Network Engineer, "thin wire", "thick wire" DOES matter. The current may be low, but line loss starts to come into play on runs longer than ten feet.

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Jan 10, 2019 20:11:29   #
Almostageezer Loc: USA
 
I wrote them off years ago. Never again.....

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Jan 10, 2019 22:12:59   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Halftrack wrote:
I don't know what your background is, so I will only say that with forty years as a Network Engineer, "thin wire", "thick wire" DOES matter. The current may be low, but line loss starts to come into play on runs longer than ten feet.


Well, since you asked, my background for 60 years is electronics and high performance computing including 12 years at Tektronix measuring and characterizing every type of cable and connector you can imagine from FFT BW measurements for Corning fiber to high speed sampling to characterize connectors for Western Electric and Amp. I also hold an amateur radio extra class license and formerly held an FCC 1st class license (with radar endorsement), so I “speak” RF as well. On the other end of the spectrum, I spent several years designing power distribution and UPSs, and have spent a ton of time with Telcos teaching them to troubleshoot networking and cabling issues (Tektronix built networking test sets and TDRs).

Having said that, there are many, many cases when conductor size matters - power transmission, RF/coax, etc., but HDMI, like low level audio, etc. isn’t one where it matters unless we’re talking longer lengths or extremely small diameter, and in those cases, the protocol spec for max length (timing) drives you to “active” cables. First, as you’re surely aware, the HDMI interface is operating at high impedance and very small current, so whether 20 feet of cable is 1 ohm or 0.5 ohms, the voltage drop is negligible. Second, the size (OD) of most cables is driven by the insulation, not the conductor size. Thicker packaging may appear to be a higher quality cable, but when you cut it open the conductor is the same size as the thinner cable - just marketing hype. Third, the BB salesperson was selling the thinner cable as an advantage, so exactly the opposite of your contention that larger conductors matter. And finally, just as an example, what size conductor is used in CAT5 or CAT6 cable that is often run for a hundred feet or more? 22AWG max, but more typically 24-26 AWG. Coax or electrical transmission - absolutely, but HDMI?The current is just too small to matter.

Edit: cables up to 5M (16’) can use 28AWG wire and meet specs and cables using 24AWG can meet specs up to 15M (~50’). For reference, 24 AWG wire is .020 dia. with resistance of 25 ohms/1000 feet or .025 ohms/ft. 28 AWG is .0126 dia and 64 ohms/1000 feet or .064 ohms/ft.

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Jan 11, 2019 06:35:45   #
rmorrison1116 Loc: Near Valley Forge, Pennsylvania
 
jackm1943 wrote:
Wow, I hit a nerve eh? The point I was trying to make is that the clerk did not tell me about the $10 one right away and that he literally did not mention it until I told him I was going home to order one and had turned around and was walking away. He should have told me about it right away. I did go ahead and purchase theirs and have no regrets.

I go to big box stores for the personal service. If I have to go to the trouble to look it up on their website, I'll just order from Amazon.


Really!? You go there for the service?! If I were to list, in order, the reasons I go to Best Buy, the service would be last on the list. I always go online to check their offerings and inventory; it saves wasted trips. If I wanted to pay more for something then I'd use Amazon.com; but there are four Best Buy stores relatively close to my home and one of them is in a state with no sales tax.

The last 5 cameras I purchased all came from the Best Buy in North Delaware, just a mile or so from the Pennsylvania state line. Delaware has no sales tax so I saved a good chunk of change over the years. The cameras are a Canon 5D mk IV, a Canon M50, a Canon G1X III, a Nikon D500 and a Nikon D7200. The only interaction between myself and a sales rep was asking the rep to retrieve the item for me; and that's pretty much it as far as personal service goes. Easy as pie...

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Jan 11, 2019 20:44:49   #
Halftrack
 
TriX wrote:
Well, since you asked, my background for 60 years is electronics and high performance computing including 12 years at Tektronix measuring and characterizing every type of cable and connector you can imagine from FFT BW measurements for Corning fiber to high speed sampling to characterize connectors for Western Electric and Amp. I also hold an amateur radio extra class license and formerly held an FCC 1st class license (with radar endorsement), so I “speak” RF as well. On the other end of the spectrum, I spent several years designing power distribution and UPSs, and have spent a ton of time with Telcos teaching them to troubleshoot networking and cabling issues (Tektronix built networking test sets and TDRs).

Having said that, there are many, many cases when conductor size matters - power transmission, RF/coax, etc., but HDMI, like low level audio, etc. isn’t one where it matters unless we’re talking longer lengths or extremely small diameter, and in those cases, the protocol spec for max length (timing) drives you to “active” cables. First, as you’re surely aware, the HDMI interface is operating at high impedance and very small current, so whether 20 feet of cable is 1 ohm or 0.5 ohms, the voltage drop is negligible. Second, the size (OD) of most cables is driven by the insulation, not the conductor size. Thicker packaging may appear to be a higher quality cable, but when you cut it open the conductor is the same size as the thinner cable - just marketing hype. Third, the BB salesperson was selling the thinner cable as an advantage, so exactly the opposite of your contention that larger conductors matter. And finally, just as an example, what size conductor is used in CAT5 or CAT6 cable that is often run for a hundred feet or more? 22AWG max, but more typically 24-26 AWG. Coax or electrical transmission - absolutely, but HDMI?The current is just too small to matter.

Edit: cables up to 5M (16’) can use 28AWG wire and meet specs and cables using 24AWG can meet specs up to 15M (~50’). For reference, 24 AWG wire is .020 dia. with resistance of 25 ohms/1000 feet or .025 ohms/ft. 28 AWG is .0126 dia and 64 ohms/1000 feet or .064 ohms/ft.
Well, since you asked, my background for 60 years ... (show quote)


Thank you

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Jan 11, 2019 21:10:20   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Halftrack wrote:
Thank you


And I value your experience in networking and agree in general that larger conductors are important in many/most applications. I have multiple runs of 3/4” heliax with very large center conductors running from my amateur radio station to my tower, but unfortunately, I didn’t follow your advice on the gauge of the rotor control cables and had intermittent operation on one rotor because of the voltage drop (which I addressed by raising the voltage - not always an option). Gentlemen can agree to respectfully disagree.

Cheers

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Jan 12, 2019 15:40:25   #
AlColter Loc: Michigan
 
It's not just Best Buy, dishonesty is epidemic.
rmorrison1116 wrote:
OMG, another bitch fest about Best Buy?! You sure did out smart that band of thieves. The nerve of a retail store to try and hide product from the consumer. I'm sure they were so unhappy you bought the cheaper item from their secret hidden stock.

You do realize their inventory is online and you just needed to go to the web site, look up what you wanted and go pick it up. It's not like they are actually hiding anything or purposely making it next to impossible to buy cheaper things in their stores. Or are they...!!??
OMG, another bitch fest about Best Buy?! You sure... (show quote)

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