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Sony announces new A9 camera... and it's a KILLER!!!
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Apr 20, 2017 12:43:47   #
planepics
 
CHOLLY wrote:
My friend, good to hear from you! Hope you are well.

The camera has been in development for about 3.5 years. Pre-production copies have been in use since just before last summer's Olympics where several Sony Artisans Beta tested it during the Games.

I type that to say that the performance and features have been demonstrated in the field under actual conditions.

And unlike MOST new camera announcements, this is actually a roll-out with orders for new units possible this FRIDAY for delivery in June.

As for comparison with the A99II?

Well...

A99II is of course, an A mount camera using legacy Minolta/Konica Minolta/Sony AF lenses. The A99II has a higher resolution sensor (42 mp compared to the 24 of the A9), but a slower max frame rate (12 compared to 20fps) and limitation of 8 fps without blackout where the A9 can shoot 20 without blackout.

Both can be used as sports shooters... but the A9 has a much deeper buffer for both RAW and JPEG bursts.

Additionally, the A9 has an electronic shutter without the normal distortion; the A99II lacks an electronic shutter.

BOTH cameras offer class leading features, and "punch way out of their weight class".

And while the A99II could compete in limited ways with the Nikon D5 and Canon 1DXII, the A9 EXCEEDS their performance in EVERY respect and does so for SIGNIFICANTLY LESS MONEY.
My friend, good to hear from you! Hope you are wel... (show quote)


The a9 might cost "significantly less" money than a top-shelf pro Nikon or Canon, at, what was it, $4,200?, it's a significant amount of money for some people. I was thinking that the a99ii would be my first digital FF camera because I didn't want to buy new lenses or get an ugly adapter. Besides, my next upgrade might be the a77ii until I can save enough money to play with the big boys...I still need to finish paying off my car. If the lens I'm renting this summer impresses me I may even buy it and wait on a new camera for a while. Isn't that the way it should be done anyways? Get the best glass you can afford and keep it while upgrading the camera? The a9 DOES sound impressive, though but I heard the memory cards you have to buy to make it work at it's best cost a mint!
 
Apr 20, 2017 12:46:22   #
Quantus5
 
JohnFrim wrote:
Can you explain your rationale for saying a mechanical shutter is only needed for flash photography?

I would have thought the main reasons for a mechanical shutter are dark frame subtraction on longer exposures, and protection of the sensor from dirt and dust when changing lenses.


[quote=JohnFrim]Can you explain your rationale for saying a mechanical shutter is only needed for flash photography?
quote]

Thanks for correcting me. Yes, you are completely correct, I had forgotten about dark frame subtraction. Yes, you still need a mechanical shutter for dark frame subtraction.

I do think the dark frame subtraction problem (i.e. hot pixel/noise issues when taking longer exposures ), can be solved eventually electronically. improved stacked sensor technology IMHO will eventually solve this issue.

Note: John Frim does bring up an interesting point re: his comment about dark frame subtraction, that leads to an interesting little piece of trivia. Because smart phones don't have mechanical shutters (at least none that I know of have mechanical shutters), they suffer from the hot pixel/noise issue when taking long exposures.
Apr 20, 2017 12:52:14   #
CHOLLY
 
Steve Perry wrote:
In my experience, mirrorless tends to look good on paper but disappoint in the real world. I have yet to meet anyone in the field who prefers mirrorless to a DSLR. Maybe this will be the tipping point, but history is not on its side.

Either way, it's a monster and will maybe get Nikon and Canon innovating again - or at least get them to release technology they have but are sitting on for incremental updates.


Steve this thing was beta tested at the Summer Olympics. It was also used for a number of NFL games this past season. And with 3.5 years of development time and existing, proven technology at the heart of this camera, I think it will live up to both the hype AND serious professionals expectations.
Apr 20, 2017 12:59:49   #
CHOLLY
 
John_F wrote:
The A9 has 24 MP on a 24x36 sensor which is the same number of pixels on its APS-C sensor of the a6xxx line of mirrorless'. This means an A9 pixel covers a larger subject area. For its $4500 price wouldn't one expect a larger number of pixels. The camera has other whiz-bangs but all quality comes down to the sensor pixel count.


John, the D5 and 1DXII, SERIOUS professional sports cameras this thing is targeted towards, have 20.8 and 20.2 mega pixel sensors respectively. Larger sensor pixel counts would increase the data to be processed and consequently SLOW DOWN the frames per second rate of the camera.

The A9 with a 24.2 megapixel sensor can shoot at 20 fps for up to 241 raw and 362 continuous images before the buffer clogs. That would NOT be possible at this price point for a 42 or even 36 megapixel sensor.
Apr 20, 2017 13:05:46   #
CHOLLY
 
Peterff wrote:
Looking between the lines this sounds like the death knell for Sony A-mount cameras and lenses. A-mount lenses can be used on E-mount cameras with an adapter but not the other way round, so it looks as though Sony is abandoning the A-mount. Think about all the pissing and moaning people on UHH still make about Canon's move to the EOS system and EF mount in 1987 - 30 years ago - a move that propelled Canon to a sustained market leadership position ahead of Nikon and all others. It will be interesting to to see how well Sony handles this transition.
Looking between the lines this sounds like the dea... (show quote)


Peter, Sony has said they will continue to both offer AND support A mount cameras. In fact, Sony has release at least ONE A mount camera a year since buying out Minolta in 2006.

Sony is also updating it's line of A mount lenses at a steady pace, so I don't see it going anywhere anytime soon.
Apr 20, 2017 13:06:48   #
chrisg-optical (a regular here)
 
CHOLLY wrote:
Full frame Stacked CMOS sensor with 24 mp able to shoot 20 frames per second.

Silent shutter, can shoot up to 1/32000 of a second with NO vibration!

693 AF points covering the entire frame!

20 frames per second with NO EVF black out!

New battery system with 2X times the capacity of current E mount batteries.

Available next month (pre-orders begin this friday) for $4500 US $5600 Canadian.

Sony also introducing a new 100-400mm G Master lens.

This camera is aimed DIRECTLY at the pro market... look out D4 and 1DXII!!

Sony is also expanding Sony Imaging Pro Support with 24/7 support, next day repair, and 2 walk-in centers in NY and LA. This will be in addition to new teams of professional support technologists who will be in the field.

Sounds like Sony is making a SERIOUS play for market dominance.
Full frame Stacked CMOS sensor with 24 mp able to ... (show quote)


Yeah, it's a killer alright - but also will kill my bank account :) I think the price will help them limit market share :) Now, if they could do that at half the price NOW we are talking! Sony, the one and only - in their dreams...
 
Apr 20, 2017 13:06:52   #
RRS (a regular here)
 
CHOLLY wrote:
Peter, Sony has said they will continue to both offer AND support A mount cameras. In fact, Sony has release at least ONE A mount camera a year since buying out Minolta in 2006.

Sony is also updating it's line of A mount lenses at a steady pace, so I don't see it going anywhere anytime soon.


That's good news!
Apr 20, 2017 13:10:50   #
Quantus5
 
Steve Perry wrote:
In my experience, mirrorless tends to look good on paper but disappoint in the real world. I have yet to meet anyone in the field who prefers mirrorless to a DSLR. Maybe this will be the tipping point, but history is not on its side.

.


You must work in a very DSLR centric circle. Almost every Sony, Fuji, Olympus, Panasonic, etc... photographer prefers mirrorless. If you are interested I can recommend names of very successful professional photographers that you Sony for you to YouTube, examples: Gary Fong and Jason Lanier.

Also -- if you are into shooting video -- even if you are using a Canon or Nikon DSLR -- you are probably shooting in mirrorless mode. As time goes on DLSR are adopting more and more mirrorless features. :-)

This a9 release was a major technical achievement. The last technical bastion was crossed by a mirrorless camera, autofocus speed. Jury is still out (until we see some more reviews of the a9), but the a9 should prove that fast autofocus can be achieved (that matches that of the flagship DSLRs) on a full-frame mirrorless camera.
Apr 20, 2017 13:12:45   #
JohnFrim
 
ecurb1105 wrote:
My issues with Sony are not with the A9, which sounds great,but with their product support. I was burned by both their BetaMax system and their eBook Readers. And I never liked Minolta cameras either.

Yeah, this is getting a bit off topic of the A9, but I -- and a lot of others who bought a Sony KDL-70R550A 70-inch TV -- now have expensive black boat anchors because the LCD panel (from Sharp, actually) is a defective design and fails after a few years. The Sony forum is full of complaints about this model of TV but Sony will not stand behind it, other than a paltry discount on a new TV. Bad, bad Sony. I hope the camera division has more integrity.
Apr 20, 2017 13:13:12   #
CHOLLY
 
planepics wrote:
The a9 might cost "significantly less" money than a top-shelf pro Nikon or Canon, at, what was it, $4,200?, it's a significant amount of money for some people. I was thinking that the a99ii would be my first digital FF camera because I didn't want to buy new lenses or get an ugly adapter. Besides, my next upgrade might be the a77ii until I can save enough money to play with the big boys...I still need to finish paying off my car. If the lens I'm renting this summer impresses me I may even buy it and wait on a new camera for a while. Isn't that the way it should be done anyways? Get the best glass you can afford and keep it while upgrading the camera? The a9 DOES sound impressive, though but I heard the memory cards you have to buy to make it work at it's best cost a mint!
The a9 might cost "significantly less" m... (show quote)


This one is aimed SQUARELY at the pro sports photographer and the photojournalist that has a bigger budget for gear than the average hobbyist or part-time wedding photographer. And in that market the 5DIII and 5DIV are king. Well, the 5DIV is $3500 but it can't touch this thing specs wise. It can't even touch the A99II you are interested in and THAT camera is $300 cheaper!

BTW, the A9 runs on SD cards... and it even has a slot for a SD XCII card. Not that expensive.

They're keeping the footprint small.
Apr 20, 2017 13:18:08   #
CHOLLY
 
chrisg-optical wrote:
Yeah, it's a killer alright - but also will kill my bank account :) I think the price will help them limit market share :) Now, if they could do that at half the price NOW we are talking! Sony, the one and only - in their dreams...


If you are in the market for a professional sports camera and can afford a D5 or a 1DXII, then you can CERTAINLY afford a camera $1500 to $2000 LESS expensive that out performs BOTH of those competitors in EVERY respect.

Can't you?
 
Apr 20, 2017 13:23:34   #
CHOLLY
 
JohnFrim wrote:
Yeah, this is getting a bit off topic of the A9, but I -- and a lot of others who bought a Sony KDL-70R550A 70-inch TV -- now have expensive black boat anchors because the LCD panel (from Sharp, actually) is a defective design and fails after a few years. The Sony forum is full of complaints about this model of TV but Sony will not stand behind it, other than a paltry discount on a new TV. Bad, bad Sony. I hope the camera division has more integrity.


Sony sold off the TV division, but reacquired it a couple years ago. Still, the company has slimmed down a LOT in recent years. It is not the huge corporate monster it once was.

The re-focus is on doing fewer products MUCH BETTER, and the have launched an expansion of their professional support system to keep pro shooters happy.

They are doing 1 day turn around and offering loaners too... just like canikon pro support. So I think the company is at least making the effort.
Apr 20, 2017 13:34:54   #
chrisg-optical (a regular here)
 
CHOLLY wrote:
If you are in the market for a professional sports camera and can afford a D5 or a 1DXII, then you can CERTAINLY afford a camera $1500 to $2000 LESS expensive that out performs BOTH of those competitors in EVERY respect.

Can't you?


They are targeting a different market than the pro D5/1DXII shooters - mirrorless is still a tough sell for pros - just witness any sporting event. It might be good for wedding pros though where a silent full frame might be handy. I am not a pro, but a serious enthusiast. Even if I had Bloomberg's bank account I would probably not buy it - a D810 would be more my style.
Apr 20, 2017 13:37:24   #
Peterff (a regular here)
 
CHOLLY wrote:
Peter, Sony has said they will continue to both offer AND support A mount cameras. In fact, Sony has released at least ONE A mount camera a year since buying out Minolta in 2006.

Sony is also updating it's line of A mount lenses at a steady pace, so I don't see it going anywhere anytime soon.


We shall see. Companies and politicians say many things that never come to pass, but it looks as though the emphasis is switching to the E-mount. Offering and supporting is not the same as introducing new products or technology.

We shall find out for whom (or what) the bell tolls...
Apr 20, 2017 13:48:27   #
planepics
 
CHOLLY wrote:
This one is aimed SQUARELY at the pro sports photographer and the photojournalist that has a bigger budget for gear than the average hobbyist or part-time wedding photographer. And in that market the 5DIII and 5DIV are king. Well, the 5DIV is $3500 but it can't touch this thing specs wise. It can't even touch the A99II you are interested in and THAT camera is $300 cheaper!

BTW, the A9 runs on SD cards... and it even has a slot for a SD XCII card. Not that expensive.

They're keeping the footprint small.
This one is aimed SQUARELY at the pro sports photo... (show quote)


I guess I was thinking of another video on You-Tube ($1K camera vs $8K camera) about Canon models...just verified it now...and the 1Dx or whatever it was called uses C-fast cards (sp?) and said that a 128 GB card cost about $800.
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