Bloke Loc: Waynesboro, Pennsylvania

I am always looking to expand my skills, trying my hand at macro, portraits, HDR, etc. I recently upgraded my equipment quite a bit, and want to try my hand at sports photography.

First, a bit of background... I am a school bus driver, currently with more than 10 years on the job. This year, I have pulled back a bit, and am basically driving as a substitute, and taking field trips for the sports teams.

So, here I am, spending a couple of afternoons a week sitting on a bus, waiting for the teams to finish their games and come back, so I can run them back to school again.

Seems like a recipe for happiness, yes? Or at least serendipity...

Yesterday afternoon, I was to take our middle-school girl's basketball team to a neighboring school district. I know that some school districts are a bit 'peculiar' when it comes to photos of students (I had a discipline issue on the bus, and the mother of the culprit was called in to the school - she was not allowed to watch the video, because it portrayed other students...), so I called the school that we were to visit. The secretary wouldn't even consider the question, and passed me on to the principal, who of course was not at his desk, so I left a message. I explained that I was a bus driver, bringing the visiting teams for their games, and would like to photograph the games.

He never called back, or at least not until after I left. Someone on his staff *did* however, call the transportation director of this district, basically saying "why is this pervert wanting to take photos of our students?". My boss got a phone call that she really couldn't answer.

I was told that under no circumstances was I to enter their school building with a camera.

An administrator from the school we were visiting did eventually call back and leave me a message. Apparently, they only allow professional press photographers to take pictures of their games...

Do these people realize that every single person who comes to watch the games is carrying a camera in their phone??? Parents, friends, even other members of the team, are all snapping away on their cellphones. The kids on the team were all comparing their photos on the bus going back afterwards...

What kind of sick minds do these people have, that they can only think a pervert might want to take photos? I do this for my church, and occasionally for the local Y, when I run trips for their summer daycare. I am strictly amateur, and when I have processed the images, I drop off a CD, and tell them that they can pass pictures on to interested parents. My church pictures usually get posted on Facebook, and/or the church's own website.

So, here I am, wanting to take sports photographs, and I get to sit on the bus waiting for the kids to come out... I could go in, but I am only interested in the photography side, and have no real interest in the game, per se.

Anybody else come across this kind of stupidity???

orrie smith Loc: Kansas

unfortunately we live in a very paranoid society.

cmc65

It's a new world and this is the order of the day.I would have been more surprised if they HAD given permission.

oldtigger Loc: Roanoke Virginia-USA

When you consider that the students being protected are probably sharing near naked photos of themselves with each other, it does seem rather stupid.
The authorities do however have to protect themselves from parents who like to sue so there is no likely hood the protective restrictions are going to do anything but get worse.
Time will come that you are the only person on the bus not allowed to have a camera.

jim quist Loc: Missouri

Yes, I made the mistake of asking the superintendent about taking sports pictures. He gave me the "I need to talk to our attorneys first." I forgot the old phrase to ask forgiveness not permission.
He told me that outdoor pictures at any event were okay, but none in the school building. They are genuinely worried about law suits.
To get around it you just have to go to the newspaper and offer them sports pictures, they can call the school and clear up this mess.
My photography mentor was a photojournalist most of his life and now submits photos for the AP. He says that unless there is a sign posted that says no one is allowed to take pictures, then they cannot stop you.
But if you are employed by them, and you take the pictures, they might just find a reason to fire you.
When I go to photograph a game I have never been stopped, the equipment I have generally speaks for itself. One time I was asked by a sports director who I was, and I told him I sell sports pictures, we talked for a while, and no problems.

Darkroom317 Loc: Mishawaka, IN

We live in not only a paranoid society but an illogical one. A true pervert, terrorist etc... would want to be discrete in order to not get caught. Most likely they would use a cell phone or would use an extremely long lens to hide. A person with a regular DSLR standing in plain sight is far more likely a photographer or photography enthusiast than someone with an immoral agenda.

rook2c4 Loc: Philadelphia, PA USA

The media (particularly tv media) is constantly pushing the notion that we are surrounded by predators, and no one should be trusted. As a result, there is a lot of paranoia going on in society - anyone with a camera is up to no good has become the dominant attitude.

Wingpilot Loc: Wasilla. Ak

Could it be that the school authorities are more interested in protecting themselves, liability-wise, than they are the students? I understand being careful, but these days, things are taken to extremes. This included. It's too bad, because a lot of parents like to photograph their kids participating in sporting events at school. And what's the deal with taking pictures at an outdoor sporting event being ok but not inside? How ludicrous is that? Sheesh!

Dan De Lion Loc: Montana

Welcome to the world of bureaucrats. These people are great at shuffling papers but are always hesitant to make decisions. If you asked to go to the bathroom they’d have a committee meeting that would recommend hiring an outside consultant before answering your question.

When dealing with the little minds of beaurocrats, it is always easier to apologize for something you did than to ask for permission. Don’t ask for permission, go take the pics until someone asks you to stop. Remember, asking you to stop requires making a bureaucratic decision.

jim quist Loc: Missouri

I almost forgot about this one.
I am semi retired now so I have time to do what I really enjoy. One of those is teaching dual credit classes at a community college. Dual credit means that high school students can take a college class and receive credit for high school and for college.
One of my classes had a girl in softball playing a home game. So I went to the game and saw several students I knew. I stood at first base taking pictures, and was showing one of the kids on the yearbook staff how to set his camera.
The next day of classes I got called into my supervisors office at the college. Parents had been calling her complaining about one of their faculty taking pictures at a softball game. The only thing that kept me from being fired was that I had given the teacher of the yearbook copies of the pictures. The kicker on this is that I also photographed the couple pictures at their Spring Dance and the sports pictures where students buy the team photos. Also, I have an actual photo studio in the town.
Talk about weird.

WayneT Loc: Paris, TN

I believe if you are outside at a public arena photographing a game the people should have absolutely no expectation of privacy. If you don't want to be photographed don't go to the game.

brucewells Loc: Central Kentucky

Most people simply do not share our passion for photography, and if you're wanting to take pictures of the kids, then there must be something sinister going on.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

And a true pervert will know that and use it.

Permission or not this is a matter of intent so nothing makes any sense regardless of existing policy.

I get the feeling that the op is more upset of having been called a pervert than the policy at hand. I do not know who called him that nor do I care, it is an extreme point of view that does NOT make sense either unless the school or the person has had problems.

It is interesting to note that the more strident about an issue are usually perpetrators, not victims or potential victims.

If you recall in the 70~80 David Hamilton was selling openly in bookstores all over the world books of barely nubile girls and was accepted as an 'artist' now he would be thrown in jail for child pornography if nothing else.

Society 'morals' mean strictly nothing in the long run as they change from one pole to another and usually destroy lives that should never have been.

Ying and yang crap and all that. The simmering religious war taking place since the fall of the Shah of Iran is not helping either but polarizing opinions on many if not all subject. I get the feeling we are entering a new human dark age era. On one side the christian 'puritanism' under the form of politicization of beliefs and other a destabilization of 'established norms' from a more active muslim population.

Extremists on all sides show their ugly heads in the middle east as well as in the US as demonstrated recently in Oregon.

Photography of school kids in all that? Just a symptom of our mental illness. Kids sending each other sexually explicit images? Well, if you do not recall 'playing doctor' when a kid you are either lying or are senile. The difference is that before it was very private when now it is rather public and the social issues associated with sex are closing down creating a fertile ground for abuse and bullying.

I know I am going against the grain when typing this but hey! Being aware and awake does not mean being silent because few and fewer folks accept honesty.

Bloke Loc: Waynesboro, Pennsylvania

I discussed the issue last night with the coach on the bus, and she was just as surprised as I had been. She suggested that I contact the district Athletic Director. I just sent him a message putting my case. I pointed out that I have no problem with my photos being used for yearbooks, or any other reasonable purpose. I also pointed out that their soccer pitches, for example, are across the street from the school building, and it would be really easy to photograph those games without setting foot on school property. The fact that shooting through a fence from the street is more likely to attract attention is also true however.

The reason for my original call was that I didn't want to get turned away at the door, after taking my camera gear along. I have seen enough of this paranoia to be aware of the risk.

I am not actually employed by the school district, but a contractor. However, the district is quite capable of having drivers fired; it has happened before. The situation is, though, that if I *weren't* a contractor/employee, there would probably not be an issue...

I just think that the idea of banning photography at a public event like a sports game these days, is ludicrous. Unfortunately, my gear is a bit more obtrusive than a cellphone...

RRS Loc: Not sure

Bloke, if I didn't know better I could think you live in Iowa. That's just the nature of the beast in our ever changing country, not all changes are for the good. A few bad apples have spoiled the barrel. Think of the possible trouble you'd be in if you stopped driving school buses and just went to a high school sports event, you'd be sending this from some jail. Good Luck and leave your camera at home and stay a free man. :)