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Correct way to downsize an image .
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Mar 10, 2014 13:12:45   #
TheDman Loc: USA
 
Armadillo wrote:

When we send an image on the internet to be viewed on a monitor we are "Printing" that image on the screen, it has been that way since day One with CRT monitors and has not changed with flat panel monitors.


Printing PIXELS, not inches. This is why the pixel dimensions determine how large or small the image appears on your screen, but not the dpi.


Armadillo wrote:
The default resolution for Mac is 72dpi, the default for Microsoft Windows is 96dpi


The origin of the 72 ppi screen resolution dates all the way back to the mid 1980&#8242;s when Apple released its first Macintosh computers. These computers included a built-in 9 inch display with a screen resolution of 72 pixels per inch. Why 72 pixels per inch? It’s because the Macintosh screens were specifically designed to work in perfect harmony with Apple’s ImageWriter printers, which had a print resolution of 144 dots per inch – exactly twice the resolution of the screen. This made it easy to scale the screen display to the printed page, which meant that your text and graphics could be previewed on the screen at the exact size they would appear when printed. Later on, as Apple began making larger displays for the Macintosh, they made sure to keep the screen resolutions set to the same 72 pixels per inch so users would always see an accurate on-screen preview of the printed document (as long as they were using an ImageWriter printer).

But the 72 pixels per inch screen resolution was a standard only with Apple, and it didn’t last. Third party companies selling monitors for the Macintosh didn’t stick to the standard, and neither did competing PC monitors. Today, nearly three decades later, technology has greatly improved and the days of screens with a resolution of only 72 ppi are long gone. Even Apple, the company that started the whole thing, now sells their displays with much higher resolutions. No one is making 72 ppi screens anymore. No one is using 72 ppi screens anymore.

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Mar 10, 2014 13:18:43   #
TheDman Loc: USA
 
In fact, a digital image, on its own, has no inherent resolution at all. It’s just pixels. It has a certain number of pixels from left to right and a certain number from top to bottom. The width and height of an image, in pixels, is known as its pixel dimensions, and that’s all a computer screen cares about.

The size at which an image appears on your screen depends only on two things – the pixel dimensions of the image and the display resolution of your screen. As long as you’ve set your screen to its native display resolution as we discussed earlier, then an image will be displayed pixel-for-pixel. In other words, each pixel in the image will take up exactly one pixel on your screen. For example, a 640×480 pixel image would fill a 640×480 pixel area of your screen. An 800 pixel-wide banner on a website would appear 800 pixels wide on the screen. No more, no less. And no matter what you set the image’s resolution to in Photoshop, whether it’s 72 ppi, 300 ppi or 3000 ppi, it will have no effect at all on how large or small the image appears on the screen.

That’s because image resolution affects only one thing – the size of the image when it’s printed. By setting the resolution in Photoshop, we tell the printer, not the screen, how many of the pixels in the image to squeeze into an inch of paper. The more pixels you’re squeezing into every inch of paper, the smaller the image will appear when printed. And generally speaking, the more pixels you’re printing per inch, the higher the print quality.

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Mar 10, 2014 13:52:06   #
Kuzano
 
Do it all at once ... Bite the Compression Bullet ONE TIME.

Set save quality (compression) at the max (least compression)

Doing incremental saves on a compression algorythm will run the algorythm each time saved, if using compressible TIFF or in particular Jpeg.

If you do it in increments, use file editing formats that do not compress until the final one. Ie, In photoshop used PSD, or non compressed TIFF.

I still would never do incremental reductions. Just one time.

Last two work flow items... sharpen, then reduce. Perhaps the other way around.

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Mar 10, 2014 14:12:08   #
imagemeister Loc: mid east Florida
 
TheDman wrote:
I need to open my mind, says the guy who won't even click the link I give him.

This isn't about opening your mind. It's just a fact. There is no room for interpretation. Video systems are arranged in pixels, not inches. There are no inches on the internet. The ppi setting of your jpg does NOT control your total pixels! This should be obvious to you, as you can edit both without changing the other.

Here are 4 different photos, each saved at a different ppi. Notice that the pixel dimensions, file size, and quality NEVER changes:

1 ppi
72 ppi
105 ppi
300 ppi
9,999 ppi

How can that be if ppi controls pixel dimensions, as you claim? Those images right there prove you wrong.
I need to open my mind, says the guy who won't eve... (show quote)


FYI - I have been to your link - and many others. If you "CONSTRAIN PROPORTIONS" and "RESAMPLE IMAGE" in Elements - when you change the PPI, it changes the overall pixel numbers. So, you can use 96ppi just as a gage for reduction of your pixel count to give the approximate monitor image size you are looking for. As such, it is just a computational element - again with no DIRECT correlation to how many PPI the monitor is actually showing or providing.

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Mar 10, 2014 14:40:10   #
TheDman Loc: USA
 
imagemeister wrote:
FYI - I have been to your link - and many others. If you "CONSTRAIN PROPORTIONS" and "RESAMPLE IMAGE" in Elements - when you change the PPI, it changes the overall pixel numbers. So, you can use 96ppi just as a gage for reduction of your pixel count to give the approximate monitor image size you are looking for. As such, it is just a computational element - again with no DIRECT correlation to how many PPI the monitor is actually showing or providing.


Why would you do that though? When you set out to email a photo or post it to a website you must have a desired pixel dimension in mind, so why would you not just change the image to that exact number of pixels, rather than use the tail to wag the dog so to speak and change the ppi, hoping you get close?

The 'resample image' feature that allows you to change pixel dimensions when you change ppi is for print sizing. If you want to print an 8"x10" photo at 300 ppi you can simply input those numbers and Photoshop will resize the image to match.

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Mar 10, 2014 14:41:19   #
sjbegres Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
 
Is FastStone Image Viewer better than Photoshop Elements 11 for resizing, which is what I have been using?

amehta wrote:
Do you mainly want a smaller file size? Then you can adjust two things: the image resolution and the jpeg quality.

I completely disagree that it is better to do it in stages, I believe one step is better, it lets the software algorithm do the best job of reducing the size.

I use FastStone Image Viewer (link), it even lets me pick the algorithm to use.

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Mar 10, 2014 14:47:07   #
amehta Loc: Boston
 
sjbegres wrote:
Is FastStone Image Viewer better than Photoshop Elements 11 for resizing, which is what I have been using?

I have never used photoshop or photoshop elements, so I cannot say which is better.

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Mar 10, 2014 15:16:43   #
countrydan1
 
Thanks for the precise and important information . You folks really impress me with your knowledge of photoshop. I shall try both methods, since they are much better than the method I was using. It is a crime to take what could be a good shot and mess it up in post-processing. Thanks again. Dan

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Mar 10, 2014 17:31:53   #
jamesl Loc: Pennsylvania
 
countrydan1 wrote:
I am going to try to download the origional file again. Would appreciate any comments.


I created the two attached from your original and resized them. I resized the original TIF first, then converted it to a JPG and set the quality.

25% Size 90% Quality
25% Size 90% Quality...
(Download)

50% Size 90% Quality
50% Size 90% Quality...
(Download)

Original TIF
Original TIF...
(Download)

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Mar 10, 2014 20:13:39   #
dar_clicks Loc: Utah
 
countrydan1 wrote:
This really drives me nuts. I have always lost quality in Photoshop Elements when I downsize an image. I have been told to do it in increments, but don't know the actual workflow to do this correctly . Sure could use some advice. I usually shoot in JPG 16MB and the file sizes are huge. Thanks.

You've noticed something important -- re-sizing changes the appearance of a photo, particularly sharpening and sometimes even color.

The purpose of the re-sizing can make a difference, so I'm only going to speak from experience of resizing downward to get a better e-Mail size. I've used a resizing plug-in in both Elements and Photoshop. Usually the plug-in does a better job but sometimes the downsized photo looks better using one of the Photoshop options (kinda depends on the subject!). Sometimes a very slight noise reduction has to be done first (not enough to destroy sharpness) in order to keep from having artifacts introduced.

Sometimes experimenting a few times with various sliders or settings can lead to a result that looks best and you can find what looks best to you most of the time from then on.

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Mar 11, 2014 10:42:33   #
tuffsheet Loc: WPB FL.
 
Lots of great information here....Thanks for those of you who participated!

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Mar 21, 2014 21:39:49   #
Nan333 Loc: near Baltimore, MD
 
For all my images that I may want to print, I crop if necessary, then in Image Size unclick Resample Image. Then change to 300 Resolution. Then change the size in inches. Then make Adjustments (Enhance). I learned this from Photoshop Elements 5 book by Scott Kelby even though I have Elements 9. It is my bible. He writes well and with humor.

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Apr 6, 2014 11:38:35   #
Alby144 Loc: Northern Nevada
 
Who would have known re-sizing an image would be so controversial? I've been re-sizing for years and have seen no image degradation, but my purpose may not be as critical as some of yours. I e-mail them, post them to forums, print them and use them for wallpapers on my PC...

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