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Is there a time when aperture-priority is the optimum exposure mode?
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Mar 24, 2017 15:56:23   #
oldtigger Loc: Roanoke Virginia-USA
 
buddingfatographer wrote:
...you guys are putting John on the cross ...!

UHH members are putting john on the cross because he claims aperture priority
only deserves a paragraph in an instruction book for photographers.
Instruction books need well explained facts, not personal opinions.

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Mar 24, 2017 16:00:44   #
cfbudd Loc: Atlanta, Georgia
 
John Gerlach wrote:
What I said in the book years ago is likely true. I do believe most photographers probably prefer aperture-priority (perhaps as they do today), and so did Barbar back then. I tried it years ago when I first went to digital in 2003, but the problems it created were so serious I soon abandoned it. And I have rarely used it for any reason since. Prior to 2003, I only used manual with film, so I did not find out how often light in the viewfinder caused underexposure. I avoided that problem accidently by just using manual exposure with film, but digital made the pitfalls readily evident. So back to manual, especially for landscapes for many reasons. If you don't think you have a light through the viewfinder problem with your system, try this test. Put the camera on any auto mode and a polarizer over the lens. Point the camera at a dark area in the shade, but arrange the camera so sun can shine into the uncovered viewfinder. Look at the auto exposure that is set by the camera. Now cover the viewfinder with your hand or close the curtain. If there is a difference, that is the problem. If the unblocked viewfinder says 1/8 second at f/16, and the covered viewfinder says 1/30 at f/16, that means the image will be seriously too dark with auto exposure due to ambient passing into the viewfinder.
What I said in the book years ago is likely true. ... (show quote)


I'm lost. What has light in the viewfinder and the problems it caused you to do with using aperture-priority exposure? And how does manual exposure then solve your problem by preventing light from entering the viewfinder?

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Mar 24, 2017 16:13:13   #
Preachdude Loc: Geneva, OH
 
John Gerlach wrote:
Hi Hogs,

I am about to begin the second revision of my landscape photography book by Focal Press.? Exposure and metering are important skills to master. Over 40 years of photographing close-ups, wildlife. and countless landscapes for fun and to earn a living, I have never found a situation where aperture-priority works better than the other choices I prefer that include shutter-priority, manual, shutter-priority and Auto ISO, or just manually setting a known exposure for stuff too small to meter like stars. Can any one think of a situation where aperture-priority really works best in case it should be in the updated book. I never have found a reason to use aperture-priority, but that doesn't mean there aren't any! Thanks for considering this question.
Hi Hogs, br br I am about to begin the second rev... (show quote)


Photography has been my hobby since 1953. I've shot a variety of film and digital formats. In the last few years, I've been doing more HDR work with landscape photography. I simply cannot imagine doing 3-9 exposures at changing apertures for HDR work. If you have done so, I'd like to know how you did it. For me, to be successful, I have found that for such work it means either doing varying shutter speeds or varying ISO.

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Mar 24, 2017 16:13:52   #
buddingfatographer Loc: Nashville
 
oldtigger wrote:
UHH members are putting john on the cross because he claims aperture priority
only deserves a paragraph in an instruction book for photographers.
Instruction books need well explained facts, not personal opinions.


Don't buy his book... buy a book that focuses on aperture priority... problem solved. If you want Johns book with more about aperture priority... START GIVING OPINIONS ON APERTURE PRIORITY! Not try to figure out if, or why he doesn't use it! You guys are regular detectives, let me tell ya! You've singlehandedly cracked the case... ole John faking an AP malfunction. You caught him. Well done men... case closed!

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Mar 24, 2017 16:19:31   #
SteveR Loc: Michigan
 
John Gerlach wrote:
I agree that aperture is often critical. So how does manual exposure not give you the same control? Just set the aperture you want, and adjust the exposure with the shutter, or even the ISO. One advantage of manual is you have shutter, aperture, and ISO available to adjust the exposure.


Although Kymarto has posted in the thread already, I think his post in the thread "Full Manual Mode" is even more succinct. Kymarto is an active professional photographer and his opinions carry extra weight with me, as I think they do with others:

"Personally I don't see the point of doing more work than necessary. I shoot with scores of vintage lenses in aperture priority mode. I let the camera decide the shutter speed--it gets me in the ballpark quick and easy, and I adjust using exposure compensation if necessary. Once I have that set up for a given scene, there is never a question of having to reset stuff if the light changes, for instance. As a pro, what counts for me is to get the shot, period. Manual is simply slower than letting the technology do what it is designed to do.

If you really want to go old school, then learn the sunny sixteen rule and don't use a meter at all. If you use a meter anyway, why not let the camera set the exposure--saves time. Then there is the AE lock button if you want to keep the exposure and move the camera. I can think of no good productive reason to use manual mode anymore."

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Mar 24, 2017 16:26:49   #
buddingfatographer Loc: Nashville
 
I had a boss once, whom I refused to call a boss because he was a fantastic leader and the smartest man I've ever met... regarding what we did or otherwise. He had been doing what we did longer than I had been alive, but never hesitated or felt embarrassed by asking me a question or what I thought about a situation, maybe a better way. Any of his crew. It didn't mean that he would do it my way... but he never felt any ego deficiency asking and I admired him greatly for that. Someone who I thought knew it all (and probably did) asking me my opinion? The thought of criticising him for that makes my skin crawl, and anyone who has served under a true leader will understand what that means. Knocking a guy for asking is the reason there are so many lost men driving around, asking for directions once in awhile or the inability to do so... is the difference in being on time or looking like an absolute jack ***.

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Mar 24, 2017 16:28:32   #
mikeroetex Loc: Lafayette, LA
 
buddingfatographer wrote:
So what's the big conspiracy here? Are you insinuating that the OP is trying to pretend like he doesn't know what AP is? What's the motive? There has to be a motive! And basing your prosecution on the limited quotes you've provided, that "AP is probably the most widely used exposure mode for serious photographers" proves his "spoof?" He stated that it is widely used... not that he personally uses it or that he understands or sees a purpose for others using it. And on to exibit 2 of your evidence... "Barbara prefers AP." Well... Barbara isn't asking the question in the post... and asking on a forum to obtain a wide variety of responses would appear to me to be an obvious approach if you were wanting to mention a mode that you don't often use in a book. The word research comes to mind. You don't survey one person, not Barbara or anyone else. You cast the net wide and see what you come up with. It's funny to me that you guys are putting John on the cross because you believe that he's trying to make it appear that he doesn't know what AP is. He hasn't said that once... and hasn't claimed at all, in whole or in part that he has no clue what it is... never heard of it. He simply asked who uses it and why. Your evidence is baseless. When I'm a professional, and after 40 years experience (in 40 years), I can guarantee I'll never ask a question if this is the result... you guys are something else. Why buy a book in the first place... does anyone here not know how to expose a photograph with a camera? Anyone? Oh... there are other ways to do it? Maybe a way you aren't used to? Good grief! Like editing... if you send a raw file to 100 different people and ask them to edit it, you think you'll get 2 that are identical? Asking how others use a tool and why and gets pounded by "fellow" photographers? SHAMEFUL!
So what's the big conspiracy here? Are you insinua... (show quote)

Maybe the forum needs to change its name to Grumpy Old Men! Never seen such vitriol over a simple, sincerely asked question. Jeez!
And then the rationalizations to justify the lack of bothering to read in context. Does no one have any civility on this board any longer? I'm starting to think this board would tell Ansel Adams that his sky on "Moon over Hernandez" was over processed and over exposed and invalidate it because it wasn't printed SOOC, LOL!
I wonder if he would have ever devised the Zone System if he had aperture priority available? Besides, what did he know after a lifetime of shooting?

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Mar 24, 2017 16:34:28   #
John Gerlach Loc: Island Park, Idaho
 
It isn't an issue. Once I manually determine the exposure I want by looking at the highlight alert now more than the histogram, I don't have to be concerned about light entering the viewfinder. While the exposure meter indicator might move, in manual exposure the camera exposure settings remain the same unless I turn the ISO, aperture, or shutter. The camera doesn't automatically do it, but don't use auto ISO here with manual. In other words, light entering the viewfinder can't change things on you when everything is in manual.
cfbudd wrote:
I'm lost. What has light in the viewfinder and the problems it caused you to do with using aperture-priority exposure? And how does manual exposure then solve your problem by preventing light from entering the viewfinder?

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Mar 24, 2017 16:39:49   #
HeatherM
 
Peterff wrote:
The important point is that you are thinking about the result and your instrument. You play in sessions, which are very dynamic situations.

...


Thanks!

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Mar 24, 2017 16:47:19   #
John Gerlach Loc: Island Park, Idaho
 
How about this one. You are photographing a hummingbird in dim light with 4 flashes set to 1/32 power. You want to freeze the motion of the bird. Do you think this will work with any auto mode? It won't because then the camera will try to expose with ambient light by slowing the shutter down in aperture-priority. Best to use manual exposure and perhaps set sync speed and f/16 to exclude the ambient. And that is what I have (usually ) against aperture-priority. In almost every situation, I see the pitfalls with it and know a faster and more precise way to get the exposure I seek. I don't find manual to be more work, but rather less work!
SteveR wrote:
Although Kymarto has posted in the thread already, I think his post in the thread "Full Manual Mode" is even more succinct. Kymarto is an active professional photographer and his opinions carry extra weight with me, as I think they do with others:

"Personally I don't see the point of doing more work than necessary. I shoot with scores of vintage lenses in aperture priority mode. I let the camera decide the shutter speed--it gets me in the ballpark quick and easy, and I adjust using exposure compensation if necessary. Once I have that set up for a given scene, there is never a question of having to reset stuff if the light changes, for instance. As a pro, what counts for me is to get the shot, period. Manual is simply slower than letting the technology do what it is designed to do.

If you really want to go old school, then learn the sunny sixteen rule and don't use a meter at all. If you use a meter anyway, why not let the camera set the exposure--saves time. Then there is the AE lock button if you want to keep the exposure and move the camera. I can think of no good productive reason to use manual mode anymore."
Although Kymarto has posted in the thread already,... (show quote)

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Mar 24, 2017 16:52:42   #
John Gerlach Loc: Island Park, Idaho
 
Don't get me started on the sunny 16 rule. I used to call it the "when to quit rule." It worked in bright sun conditions that I typically avoided with slide film at the time. Bright sun isn't so bad now that we can adjust color temp and contrast with software. Now we can shoot longer on Kenya safaris and still get pleasing images. The sun jumps up there pretty fast around the equator.
SteveR wrote:
Although Kymarto has posted in the thread already, I think his post in the thread "Full Manual Mode" is even more succinct. Kymarto is an active professional photographer and his opinions carry extra weight with me, as I think they do with others:

"Personally I don't see the point of doing more work than necessary. I shoot with scores of vintage lenses in aperture priority mode. I let the camera decide the shutter speed--it gets me in the ballpark quick and easy, and I adjust using exposure compensation if necessary. Once I have that set up for a given scene, there is never a question of having to reset stuff if the light changes, for instance. As a pro, what counts for me is to get the shot, period. Manual is simply slower than letting the technology do what it is designed to do.

If you really want to go old school, then learn the sunny sixteen rule and don't use a meter at all. If you use a meter anyway, why not let the camera set the exposure--saves time. Then there is the AE lock button if you want to keep the exposure and move the camera. I can think of no good productive reason to use manual mode anymore."
Although Kymarto has posted in the thread already,... (show quote)

Reply
 
 
Mar 24, 2017 16:56:26   #
buddingfatographer Loc: Nashville
 
Here's a quote for you... "We use a "don't cut any corners" shooting work flow that WE AND OUR SMART CLIENTS have DEVELOPED TOGETHER over the years that anyone can learn to use." (Taken from John's own site) I guess John listens to others (even clients or students) when it comes to technique or options in taking a photograph.

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Mar 24, 2017 16:57:15   #
Bullfrog Bill Loc: CT
 
You have got to be kidding me; you are writing a book on landscape photography and have to ask this question? Whenever depth of field is a priority and you want to control it. You may want to research tripods on this forum as they are useful when the photographer wants to use a low ISO (to minimize noise) and the resultant shutter speed doesn't permit hand holding (often). That should be good for a chapter!

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Mar 24, 2017 17:09:28   #
oldtigger Loc: Roanoke Virginia-USA
 
John Gerlach wrote:
... the camera will try to expose with ambient light by slowing the shutter down in aperture-priority. ...

When using flash fill inside with dim subjects and backlit widows, i set the flash level,
select auto aperture and never have to worry about the windows blowing out.

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Mar 24, 2017 17:12:20   #
JimRPhoto Loc: Raleigh NC
 
I prefer aperture priority as my "default" setting. When on the move, in a travel mode, or anywhere, your camera is already ready to take the shot. I leave it on f/8 for a better depth of field, and on ISO 200. With experience, you will know when it is time to raise the ISO. But again, the main reason is that when you see a potentially good shot, you want to be as ready as possible to take it. Now, a lot of what I do is not as rushed, but I still find the settings I mention to be my "default" for best results. Hope this is helpful. Jim R

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