I Don't Understand Canon and Nikon
Dec 13, 2017 06:12:27 #
Jaackil
Loc: Massachusetts
PH CIB wrote:
I am not an Engineer or a Scientist…but it would s... (show quote)
So you don’t really understand how and why businesses are in business to make money.
Dec 13, 2017 06:23:46 #
PH CIB wrote:
I am not an Engineer or a Scientist…
You've answered your own question. In the early days of digital, I used to wonder why camera makers couldn't just make a model that shot both film and digital. I would also like to be able to create gold on demand. Some things are beyond science.
Dec 13, 2017 06:25:04 #
letmedance wrote:
If the camera size and weight remain basically unchanged is there anything to be gained?
Bragging right about having a mirrorless line?
Dec 13, 2017 06:31:41 #
Rongnongno wrote:
You do not? Really?
What is to understand other than they are in the business of making $$$?
What is to understand other than they are in the business of making $$$?
So true
Dec 13, 2017 06:37:30 #
letmedance wrote:
The purpose of the Mirroless is to reduce size and weight, all those goodies are already in the DSLR cameras. The Mirroless cameras are quieter and usually capture bursts in faster frame rates due to absence of the mirror, but their main selling point is size and weight.
There are so many OTHER advantages to EVF that the manufacturers are now simly pandering to the died in the wool older generation clunk click photograhers who will not move with the times.
Dec 13, 2017 06:41:58 #
BebuLamar wrote:
I don't know about Canon but I understand how Nikon would feel. In 1959 they put the mirror into their Nikon SP and made it the Nikon F. The rest is history. Now you tell them to take the mirror out of their Nikon D??????
But their were no EVFs in 1959, or they would probably have used that instead!
Dec 13, 2017 06:55:31 #
To the OP:
Don’t sweat it. Just give one of the other mirrorless manufacturers a try. When you do you’ll wonder why you ever wanted a canikon in the first place.
Don’t sweat it. Just give one of the other mirrorless manufacturers a try. When you do you’ll wonder why you ever wanted a canikon in the first place.
Dec 13, 2017 07:04:24 #
SharpShooter wrote:
It seems to me that every car company could just take out the engine and put in a battery and an electric motor and we could almost end pollution and buying gas...., but I'm no engineer either!!!
SS
SS
If they could afford to payoff the oil companies or prevent the oil companies from buying up the patents to electric power.
Dec 13, 2017 08:13:26 #
billnikon
Loc: Pennsylvania/Ohio/Florida/Maui/Oregon/Vermont
PH CIB wrote:
I am not an Engineer or a Scientist…but it would s... (show quote)
The biggest problem is that the big lenses, 300 2.8, 400 2.8, 500 4, 600 4, 800 5.6, will not work on a Mirror less system yet. When they get that ironed out, I am sure they will come out with one.
Dec 13, 2017 08:18:48 #
I'm not an Engineer, but I am a Man of Science!!!
Best,
Todd Ferguson
Best,
Todd Ferguson
Dec 13, 2017 08:19:49 #
I'm not an Engineer, but I am a Man of Science!!!
Best,
Todd Ferguson
Best,
Todd Ferguson
Dec 13, 2017 08:27:23 #
blackest wrote:
There are some positives to mirrorless tech, but autofocus is faster and battery life longer with the optical viewfinder. Most of the mirrorless advantage really already exists with liveview.
Kinda surprising nobody has developed an electronic viewfinder which plugs into the hdmi port of many DSLR's It probably wouldn't be hard to have "liveview" in a viewfinder maybe just sat on the hot shoe...
Kinda surprising nobody has developed an electronic viewfinder which plugs into the hdmi port of many DSLR's It probably wouldn't be hard to have "liveview" in a viewfinder maybe just sat on the hot shoe...
That is exactly what I used to think, John. But last week I got a Sony RX10 Mk IV and I no longer hold those opinions about autofocus and battery life (to a degree). Without question, the hybrid PDAF/CDAF, with it's 315 PDAF sensors, has the fastest AF acquisition most consistent tracking I have ever experience in a digital camera. The claims Sony is making are true. As far as battery life, this camera comes with a 1100 mAh battery and it seems good for around 450 pics. A better design with room for a more powerful battery should be able to boost that to over 1000 images.
And here is your external "viewfinder". Offloading the role of focusing and composition to an accessory that has it's own power source should double the battery life as well.
[url]https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=details&O=&Q=&ap=y&c3api=1876%2C%7Bcreative%7D%2C%7Bkeyword%7D&gclid=CjwKCAiAvMPRBRBIEiwABuO6qTe3OHgMj1fnq1QpRgYjnpNLAqpZRCu6GawLGf809SbWsa8F6e8bIRoCfx4QAvD_BwE&is=REG&m=Y&sku=1090214{/url]
Yes, there are some collateral benefits to using an EVF, like being able to see a histogram before taking the shot, seeing the results of adjusting exposure parameters in real time, etc. I've only had it for a week and I am still exploring it's features, but I am totally impressed from what I have seen so far.
Dec 13, 2017 08:41:55 #
There will be different opinions based on your concerns but I will give you my take on this. Expect that the majority of the cameras in the future will be mirrorless.
I am not an expert on the flange length but it seems to me that once the mirror is removed and to make the camera smaller, something desirable, the flange length will be shorter. At this point it is a matter of working with the lens mount and the flange length. This is what I believe and not necessarily reality.
The idea of eliminating the mirror is not new and as a matter of fact it was Canon in 1965 the first company to come up with that idea using a Pellix mirror instead of the moving mirror of SLR cameras. The idea did not catch up at the time and cameras continued to be manufactured with the returning mirror till the introduction of mirrorless cameras. As we all know rangefinder cameras have no mirror and they have been there forever.
Canon and Nikon did not seem to pay attention when other camera manufacturers began to introduce mirrorless cameras. Both of them know that they have lost a good share of that market and both are working to introduce new mirrorless cameras and I would not be surprised at all if they already have plans to do the same with their big dSLR bodies. As I said previously, they could be considering working with the lens mount and the flange length but understand that it makes no sense to make a small camera and fit it with a big and heavy lens like the 70-200 f2.8 VR just to give you an example.
Right now Olympus, Fuji, Sonny and Panasonic are doing very well with their mirrorless cameras.
A serious issue to consider is what will happen to those lenses made for dSLR bodies. That only tells me that there will always be photographers that will use the dSLR bodies with those lenses.
BebuLamar you said it right, Nikon introduced the mirror in 1959 and that is more than 50 years ago. Technology has changed a lot since 1959 and photographers today want lighter cameras with a good assortment of small lenses. Nikon has been a great company, at least it has been for me for the past 50 + years but keeping on working on old technology has its consequences. I bet Olympus is selling as many EM-1 Mk II as Nikon is selling the D850 and understand this is only my opinion. Professionals are already using mirrorless cameras.
As I said, the future appears to be mirrorless.
I am not an expert on the flange length but it seems to me that once the mirror is removed and to make the camera smaller, something desirable, the flange length will be shorter. At this point it is a matter of working with the lens mount and the flange length. This is what I believe and not necessarily reality.
The idea of eliminating the mirror is not new and as a matter of fact it was Canon in 1965 the first company to come up with that idea using a Pellix mirror instead of the moving mirror of SLR cameras. The idea did not catch up at the time and cameras continued to be manufactured with the returning mirror till the introduction of mirrorless cameras. As we all know rangefinder cameras have no mirror and they have been there forever.
Canon and Nikon did not seem to pay attention when other camera manufacturers began to introduce mirrorless cameras. Both of them know that they have lost a good share of that market and both are working to introduce new mirrorless cameras and I would not be surprised at all if they already have plans to do the same with their big dSLR bodies. As I said previously, they could be considering working with the lens mount and the flange length but understand that it makes no sense to make a small camera and fit it with a big and heavy lens like the 70-200 f2.8 VR just to give you an example.
Right now Olympus, Fuji, Sonny and Panasonic are doing very well with their mirrorless cameras.
A serious issue to consider is what will happen to those lenses made for dSLR bodies. That only tells me that there will always be photographers that will use the dSLR bodies with those lenses.
BebuLamar you said it right, Nikon introduced the mirror in 1959 and that is more than 50 years ago. Technology has changed a lot since 1959 and photographers today want lighter cameras with a good assortment of small lenses. Nikon has been a great company, at least it has been for me for the past 50 + years but keeping on working on old technology has its consequences. I bet Olympus is selling as many EM-1 Mk II as Nikon is selling the D850 and understand this is only my opinion. Professionals are already using mirrorless cameras.
As I said, the future appears to be mirrorless.
Dec 13, 2017 08:54:43 #
billnikon wrote:
The biggest problem is that the big lenses, 300 2.8, 400 2.8, 500 4, 600 4, 800 5.6, will not work on a Mirror less system yet. When they get that ironed out, I am sure they will come out with one.
The problem is not as you have described. There is nothing to iron out but marketing.
Sony is releasing this shortly - and others to follow:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1369634-REG/sony_fe_400mm_f_2_8_gm.html
This is already available:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1333230-REG/sony_sel100400gm_fe_100_400mm_f_4_5_5_6_gm.html
But Sigma, Metabones and Sony make adapters to mount the long lenses on their mirrorless cameras. The issue is whether or not pros and serious enthusiasts will embrace using the long lenses, not about any "kinks" that need to be worked. Out.
While it's true that a long Canon lens does not work optimally on a Sony A9, The native lenses work just fine.
You probably have come across this article:
https://petapixel.com/2017/06/27/sony-a9-tested-canon-300mm-400mm-disappointing/
But it's important that adapters are being used, and they will not allow the camera/lens combo to work as well as a native lens.
Dec 13, 2017 09:02:41 #
Just a guess. It may be that C and N are taking a look at how the Sony a9 is recieved by pros. If the a9 gains wide acceptance among pro sports photographers a mirrorless model from N or C will soon follow.
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