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Creating a new discussion area for newbies
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Mar 24, 2017 11:41:24   #
DaveO Loc: Northeast CT
 
Star Shotz wrote:
Great idea. I for one am a newbie and would definitely be more comfortable asking questions to someone who truly doesn't mind helping.


Sounds like a good idea to me. A trial period may be in order to check out the participation. I'll bet it would be positive.

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Mar 24, 2017 11:43:09   #
DaveO Loc: Northeast CT
 
rmalarz wrote:
Along with the tidbits of valuable information, there will be a flood of misinformation, opinionated lectures not based on factual foundation, etc. All this followed by sniping within the thread.
--Bob


Yes,just like we frequently see now,only without the sniping. I think that we have enough good people to make it work.

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Mar 24, 2017 11:54:03   #
boberic Loc: Quiet Corner, Connecticut. Ex long Islander
 
bdk wrote:
We see lots of questions, such as why is everything behind my subject blurry? what is ISO , SOOC etc etc.

Then we get the people replying with nasty comments, such as read a book go to school etc. ( there are of course lots of people that try to help as well)

Then there are a lot of people that wont ask their newbie question because they are afraid of the nasty responses.
Maybe its time for a newbie question area. where they can safely ask their questions and hopefully NOT get the snide remarks that are so common here.

Then if your one of the ones that hates the newbie questions, you dont have to visit that area.

what do u think?
We see lots of questions, such as why is everythin... (show quote)


Not necessarily a bad idea, but I can see several difficulties. What's a newbie? No idea which end of the camera to point at the subject? Or someone with 6 months of experience, or perhaps 1 year. Will only those with no experience be allowed to post? If so who will b e able to answer questions. How will "newbies" be identified and who will do it? And how will trolls be kept out? Who and/or what will make the determination as to valid advice? Too many questions and not enough answers.

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Mar 24, 2017 11:55:35   #
LoneRangeFinder Loc: Left field
 
rmalarz wrote:
Along with the tidbits of valuable information, there will be a flood of misinformation, opinionated lectures not based on factual foundation, etc. All this followed by sniping within the thread.
--Bob

Exactly so. One of the things that create this situation is that "newbies" often are too new to recognize non-factual replies. Then there are the obfuscations, and pedantic lectures with posters dualing to prove who is right or impress (intimidate?) those who may be new to photography.

One of the things I appreciate about you, Bob, is that although you clearly know photography AND can demonstrate it, you do not engage in these pointless exchanges. (Note to self, here!).

It would be nice to have some way to "authenticate the facts"....

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Mar 24, 2017 11:57:08   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
Whoever moderates the section would do well to only allow comments from certain people. That has worked in other sections. My concern is that newbies are susceptible to all sorts of misinformation. This only causes more confusion and frustration. The worst is that they give up entirely and loose the fun of taking and making good photographs.
--Bob

DaveO wrote:
Yes,just like we frequently see now,only without the sniping. I think that we have enough good people to make it work.

Reply
Mar 24, 2017 12:00:24   #
billnikon Loc: Pennsylvania/Ohio/Florida/Maui/Oregon/Vermont
 
bdk wrote:
We see lots of questions, such as why is everything behind my subject blurry? what is ISO , SOOC etc etc.

Then we get the people replying with nasty comments, such as read a book go to school etc. ( there are of course lots of people that try to help as well)

Then there are a lot of people that wont ask their newbie question because they are afraid of the nasty responses.
Maybe its time for a newbie question area. where they can safely ask their questions and hopefully NOT get the snide remarks that are so common here.

Then if your one of the ones that hates the newbie questions, you dont have to visit that area.

what do u think?
We see lots of questions, such as why is everythin... (show quote)


Snide remark, "so what is a person with over 2000 posts and replies doing asking about a newbie site"
Nice remark, "so what business is it of yours to care about newbie questions?" "your post has nothing to do with photography"

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Mar 24, 2017 12:03:41   #
DaveO Loc: Northeast CT
 
rmalarz wrote:
Whoever moderates the section would do well to only allow comments from certain people. That has worked in other sections. My concern is that newbies are susceptible to all sorts of misinformation. This only causes more confusion and frustration. The worst is that they give up entirely and loose the fun of taking and making good photographs.
--Bob


I understand what you are trying to say,Bob. Essentially,if the rude comments and blowing people off stopped there would be no need for a new section. If someone has nothing constructive,they should simply pass.

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Mar 24, 2017 12:18:22   #
chevman Loc: Matthews, North Carolina
 
This is what I think. The idea is a good one, but I'm not sure that a "newbie" discussion area would be the answer. One thing I have noticed since joining, there doesn't seem to be any moderators for this site and I don't find a rules page to inform those who are createing threads or posting on a thread. I belong to another forum and it has rules and moderators who have the power to delete a post or an entire thread if the rules are violated. Usually the posts and threads are left alone and there is alot of freedom of expression. Another feature is you as a poster in a thread can delete your post for whatever reason as well as being able to delete a thread you may have started. There should be no reason to do this unless the thread becomes hostile or other posters launch personal attacks on the thread author, which I have seen here as well as elsewhere. To make condescending remarks or launch attacks toward another user is not good indeed, but some think nothing of doing so. In the early days of the internet this type of behavior was frowned upon and generally did not exist. For the most part if one chooses to be a part of a forum you just have to learn who the trolls are as well as growing a little thicker skin unfortunately. All in all a thread for new users is a good idea for newbies as well as an oldie who would like to learn about something new to him or her, and just ignore the condescending remarks because they are bound to happen

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Mar 24, 2017 12:22:40   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
Thank you very much for the compliment. I appreciate that.
--Bob

LoneRangeFinder wrote:
Exactly so. One of the things that create this situation is that "newbies" often are too new to recognize non-factual replies. Then there are the obfuscations, and pedantic lectures with posters dualing to prove who is right or impress (intimidate?) those who may be new to photography.

One of the things I appreciate about you, Bob, is that although you clearly know photography AND can demonstrate it, you do not engage in these pointless exchanges. (Note to self, here!).

It would be nice to have some way to "authenticate the facts"....
Exactly so. One of the things that create this si... (show quote)

Reply
Mar 24, 2017 12:27:53   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
On the contrary, we do have moderators, of both site and sections. As for the site, there is a rather large latitude granted to all posters. The individual sections vary per moderator, some more strict than others.
--Bob

chevman wrote:
This is what I think. The idea is a good one, but I'm not sure that a "newbie" discussion area would be the answer. One thing I have noticed since joining, there doesn't seem to be any moderators for this site and I don't find a rules page to inform those who are createing threads or posting on a thread. I belong to another forum and it has rules and moderators who have the power to delete a post or an entire thread if the rules are violated. Usually the posts and threads are left alone and there is alot of freedom of expression. Another feature is you as a poster in a thread can delete your post for whatever reason as well as being able to delete a thread you may have started. There should be no reason to do this unless the thread becomes hostile or other posters launch personal attacks on the thread author, which I have seen here as well as elsewhere. To make condescending remarks or launch attacks toward another user is not good indeed, but some think nothing of doing so. In the early days of the internet this type of behavior was frowned upon and generally did not exist. For the most part if one chooses to be a part of a forum you just have to learn who the trolls are as well as growing a little thicker skin unfortunately. All in all a thread for new users is a good idea for newbies as well as an oldie who would like to learn about something new to him or her, and just ignore the condescending remarks because they are bound to happen
This is what I think. The idea is a good one, but ... (show quote)

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Mar 24, 2017 12:29:48   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
Dave, that is very true, but we have what we have. It's unfortunate in that that leads to people becoming discouraged.
--Bob

DaveO wrote:
I understand what you are trying to say,Bob. Essentially,if the rude comments and blowing people off stopped there would be no need for a new section. If someone has nothing constructive,they should simply pass.

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Mar 24, 2017 12:44:59   #
chevman Loc: Matthews, North Carolina
 
rmalarz wrote:
On the contrary, we do have moderators, of both site and sections. As for the site, there is a rather large latitude granted to all posters. The individual sections vary per moderator, some more strict than others.
--Bob

Thank you Bob, I didn't know that. Is there a page that lists rules for conduct for the different threads?
________________________________
Jerry in NC

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Mar 24, 2017 12:57:03   #
twinhearts Loc: Southwestern Michigan
 
I would definitely post in a newbie category. I come here quite often and read through the questions posted. There is a wealth of info on here. There are times when I have Googled an issue I had and got technical answers but when I tried those, I would still have undesirable results. I would like to have the opinion of person, whom I could actually ask detailed questions pertaining to a particular photo. I read many questions that have such snide comments directed at the OP for asking a stupid question, or they tell the person to research the question before asking. It makes me hesitant to ask for fear of being called ignorant for not knowing. We must remember that everyone had to start somewhere. We are not born with the knowledge and we learn best from our peers but it is hard when so many think they are above everyone else.

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Mar 24, 2017 12:58:08   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
Generally, if you click on the Section Title, there are some posts that never expire or move, they are FAQ related. One of the sections in which I regularly post is For Your Consideration.
http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/s-119-1.html
If you go to that link, you'll see some bold type topics. Those are the ones to which I refer. They are posted by the moderators and stay at the top of the topic list. Each of the Sections should have something similar.
--Bob

chevman wrote:
Thank you Bob, I didn't know that. Is there a page that lists rules for conduct for the different threads?
________________________________
Jerry in NC

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Mar 24, 2017 13:10:42   #
Jaackil Loc: Massachusetts
 
DavidPine wrote:
This site is for everyone. If you don't like a posting – pass it by. Pretty simple really.


Unfortunately not everyone follows that rule of Human decency. I never understood why people have to jump into a post and make rude comments instead of just passing it by. But it is the nature of the beast that being so I don't think a section for beginners would be a bad thing. Newbies often ask really good questions about things that veterans may have forgotten or maybe something that can bring veterans back to looking at their photography in a different way.

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