tnste Loc: New Westminster, BC

I have a Canon 7D but have just purchased the 7D Mark II. I got it for a better than the black friday price and the dealer threw the Canon kit and a memory card. I have not unpacked the camera as I am not sure if I am going to keep it. I would like to know from those who have upgraded from the 7d to the 7d Mark II what you think of the 7D Mark II compared to the 7D. Did you find the 7D Mark II perform significantly better than the Mark II?

haroldross Loc: Walthill, Nebraska

You don't mention what you photograph.

The AF in the 7D MKII is far better at tracking moving subjects than the original 7D. It AF is quicker and has more AF points. If you shoot in LiveView or shoot video, the dual pixel AF is great. You can shoot at a little higher ISO (only you can determine how much noise you are satisfied with). In my experience, the noise cleans up much better than the original 7D.

Anandnra Loc: Tennessee

Much better AF and it can withstand higher ISO's.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

How much do you process your 7D images? Although I don't have the 7DII, I did have the old 7D body. Canon made significant improvement in ISO performance and noise from the sensors in the 7D / 60D generation and all models that came after. But, you've just paid a premium for lighting fast AF, market leading frames per second in a rugged weatherized professional body. If those aren't things you really need for your photography, you can upgrade from the 7D ISO capabilities to an 80D at a lower cost.

tnste Loc: New Westminster, BC

Sorry for the confusion in my question. I meant to ask if people who upgraded to the 7d mark II if they found a significant improvement over the original 7D. I probably will keep the camera. I do not want to go with the 80D. I have used my 7D mostly for landscapes, architecture and nature but want to get more involved in taking wildlife photography. If I had the money I would have like to have bought the 5D Mark III. I will keep my 7D as a backup camera if I keep the 7D Mark II. I also have a panasonic Lumix FZ1000 bridge camera I use for travel and hiking as it is much lighter and smaller than the 7D and has a great 25-400 mm zoom lens.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

The price on used 5DIIIs are now at or lower than $1500 USD. If that's in the neighborhood of the new 7DII, I wouldn't give up on the full frame idea ...

SharpShooter Loc: NorCal

t, you have obviously not used the capabilities of the 7Dmkl.
Yes, the 7ll is a LOT better than the mkl but ONLY if you use its capabilities.
A few big advantages. The latest processor to run virtually the same focus system as the 1D series. Big if you do sports, less so if you do wildlife.
The flicker mode, again big if you do indoor sports but useless if you do wildlife. The ability to focus with an extender on some zoom lenses, that's pretty big. Better weather sealing, again for shooting sports in foul weather.
More mp, for a slightly better crop.
For landscape the crop cameras are working against you because of the lack of wide angle and DoF.
You can easily talk yourself into the 7ll. In your shoes I would sell the 7l and send back the 7ll. You could then afford a used 5lll. By my philosophy keeping a back-up camera is an exercise in mental ego and almost nobody needs one or ever uses it. You'd be far better off with a camera that's BETTER at what you actually do than one that's a compromise just because of what you MIGHT do but have not done.
The 5lll is twice the landscape camera as the 7ll by virtue of its being FF and having more mp. It's also a pretty darn good action camera as well, so crosses over to sports and nature.
I don't think it's a tough call. Gear up for what you shoot most, not for what you might shoot. Get rid of the backup, you don't need it.
Just my opinion. Good luck t!
SS

tnste Loc: New Westminster, BC

Thank you for the information. Since I live in BC Canada in one of the most expensive places on the planet, prices are a lot higher. Best price I have seen on a good used 5D Mark 111 (body only) is $2250. That $1500 US translates into about $2,025 CDN. That is over $400 more than the 7D Mark II. I purchased. Opinions from other readers seem to favour not getting the 7D Mark II. I have some thinking to do.

tnste Loc: New Westminster, BC

Thank you for your comments. You have given me something to think about. I will reconsider my purchase. I have to Dec. 15 to decide if I want to keep the 7D Mark II or not. I would really like to get the 5D Mark III but it is just to expensive for me as I am now just retired. If I were still working it would be an easier decision for me to make. Also, most of my lenses are not compatible with the 5D Mark III (the 70-200 mm L series, and the 100 mm L macro are okay but my 15-85, 50 mm, Sigma 10-20 mm, Sigma 150-500 mm, and Lensbaby fisheye would not be.

markngolf Loc: Bridgewater, NJ

I had a 7D for about a year, sold it on Ebay and purchased a 7D MII. I've had it about 1.5 years. It is a vast improvement in auto focus system and burst shooting. Fabulous camera for action/sports photography. It's your decision. The II has many new features.
I also have the 5D MIII. Fantastic camera. I've owned it for 4+ years. I usually mount different lenses and carry both. I understand your financial considerations. I was able to use an Amazon Credit card - no interest for 18 months - when I purchased the 5D MIII. It took some of the sting out of the finances.
Good luck making your decision.
Mark

tnste Loc: New Westminster, BC

Wow; you have the best of both worlds. Ideally I would love to have both the 7D Mark II and the 5D Mark III but my spouse would kill me. She already gave me a hard time when I bought the 7D Mark II. She says I have enough equipment. I suppose I could get a used 5D Mark III I saw at the cameral store where I bought the 7D Mark II for $2299 (body only) if I take back the 7D mark II and sell the 7d Mark I. Anyway, I appreciate your comments and it has helped me make a decision. I will keep the 7d Mark II. Now I can finally open the box and start learning to use the camera. Now I need to decide if I will keep the 7D Mark I with battery grip as a back up or sell it.

Islandgal Loc: Vancouver Island, British Columbia. Canada

Tim, I've also been sitting on the fence trying to decide between the 7Dmark II or the 5DmarkIII for quite a while. I like the crop sensor for it's extra reach with wildlife and the fine AF system, but I think I'm going to hold out for the 5DmarkIII eventually. And I agree, the cost here is still quite high compared to over the border. If I'm lucky I'll find a well kept used one with low actuations. I currently use a 5D classic and a 20D aps-c, so the version III would be a nice upgrade.
You've taken some nice shots with your 7D though! Trish

markngolf Loc: Bridgewater, NJ

Hi,
I found the Kindle, "The 7D MII Experience" by Doug Klostermann very helpful. $9.99 download from Amazon. http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Mark-III-Experience-Photography-ebook/dp/B007RGWZVM
Also I downloaded the complete PDF manual:http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/5/0300016615/01/eos7d-mk2-im-en.pdf and
http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/0/0300016630/01/eos7d-mk2-qrg-en.pdf (cheat cheat card)
Good luck. It's a fabulous camera!!
Mark

amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

I used a pair of 7D for about five years and took upwards of 300,000 shots with them. I would have been fine continuing to use them, but I knew they were getting up in "mileage" and had seen some pretty hard use. Not that they'd ever failed me... they hadn't. But, early this year I updated to a pair of 7DII, when they were both discounted nicely and bundled with some other items that were of value to me (worked out to about 30% discount off the cameras' list price, taking into consideration the cost of the bundled items if I'd bought them separately). I've kept my old 7Ds as backups, but they haven't been getting out much lately.

I do appreciate the 7DII's AF system, though I frankly didn't have any problem with the original 7D's. I don't see the 7DII being all that much faster or better tracking, but the additional AF points (65 versus 19) come in handy at times and the new model does better with multi-point AF patterns. Plus it has more choice of AF patterns: seven versus five. Original 7D has: Single Point and All Points (as do all Canon DSLRs), plus Zone Focus, Expansion Points and Spot Focus. 7DII has: Single Point, All Points, two different Zone (large 25-point and small 15-point), two different Expansion (4-point and 8-point), and Spot Focus. Despite all that, I tend to use both the original 7D and now the 7DII with Single Point most of the time. That means more work for me, but gives me the lowest percentage of missed-focus shots (under 2%). With 7DII I am a bit more inclined to use multi-point focus patterns, particularly Small Zone or one of the Expansion Points.

For reference, 80D only has four focus patterns: Single Point, All Points and two Zone Focus (large 15-point and smaller 9-point zones). It also has slightly fewer (45 points versus 65), but it has more "f8 capable" points than 7DII (up to 27 of them, depending upon lens, versus just one f8 capable point at the center on 7DII). Both cameras have much improved Dual Pixel Auto Focus in Live View/Video, but the Touch Screen of the 80D gives a fast, easy way of selecting point of focus, while the 7DII doesn't have touch screen control. Also, 80D's rear LCD monitor is articulated, while 7DII's is not.

One added feature I find very helpful is Canon's Anti-Flicker for use in fluorescent and similar types of lighting, which tend to confound many cameras' metering systems (incl. original 7D and all other Canon models intro'd prior to 7DII in 2014) and make for a lot of poorly exposed shots under those types of lighting. Anti-Flicker times the camera's shutter release to the peak output of the lighting and makes for much more consistent exposures under these types of lights. Works great! I no longer have to factor in that perhaps as many as 2/3 my shots will be badly exposed under this lighting, and take gobs of extra shots to be sure to get some good ones. Because the lighting "peaks" 120 times per second, you really don't notice any sort of delay in the shutter release in real world shooting situations. 80D has this feature, too, and they both have pretty similar shutter lag (I think it's 55ms in 7DII and 58ms in 80D).

I use OEM Canon battery grips on both my 7DII (as well as all other Canon DSLRs I've owned). Yes, the additional battery capacity is nice, but my main reason for using the grips is the vertical controls. 7DII's grip now has a secondary joystick for AF point selection, a feature Canon first put on 5D Mark III, if memory serves. This is very nice to have (80D doesn't have it, but the multi-directional controller it uses for AF point selection is reachable with one's thumb whether holding the camera in landscape or in portrait orientation.) Canon also added a collar-switch around the joystick on the camera (push button next to the joystick on the grip), that gives another means of toggling through the different AF patterns, more directly than using the AF button and Multi-Function button on the 7D.

7D's 18MP to 7DII's 20MP wasn't much difference. But I do think the newer model captures a bit more fine detail, possibly due to a less aggressive anti-alias filter on the newer model (I always felt Canon got a little carried away with the AA filter on the orig. 7D). 7DII is higher ISO capable than 7D, another thing that I find helpful. I would occasionally, reluctantly use 7D to ISO 6400. That high ISO required some additional post-processing work. Now with 7DII I've shot as high as ISO 8000 and 16000, though it also means more PPing. This is a test shot done with 7DII at ISO 16000, without any extra in-camera noise reduction, shot RAW while being careful to avoid underexposure, and converted in Lightroom 6 at default NR settings:


Yes, there is some noise at ISO 16000, but I think it's pretty well controlled, as can be seen in this enlarged detail from that image:


I've shot entire events at ISO 8000 and 16000, and sold 8x10 and 11x14 prints made from the images.

Complementing the high ISO capabilities, the 7DII also is able to focus down to -3EV (i.e., moonlight).... while the original 7D was only able to focus to -0.5 or -1EV. (80D can focus to -3EV, too.)

I don't have 80D, but I think it's roughly the same or not quite as good at high ISOs.... But it's got roughly a 20% higher resolution sensor (24MP versus 20MP in 7DII... both APS-C). The 80D's slightly newer sensor seems to have a bit more dynamic range (maybe 0.5EV's worth). However, to me both the greater number of pixels and slightly increased DR are at least partially offset by the higher resolution being more susceptible to diffraction. The 7DII is approx. f7.1 diffraction "limited", while the 80D is more like f5.6.

7DII's 10 frames per second versus the 7D's 8 fps (and 80D's 7 fps) wasn't all that big a difference for me. I do find I end up with more 3 or 4 frame bursts with 7DII, than I did with 7D in continuous drive mode. I leave the cameras in top speed continuous mode most of the time and just control the number of clicks with my shutter release.... it's probably a bit less easy to take a single shot that way, with 7DII, so I probably tend to take more shots with them. As a result, I suppose it's a good thing the 7DII has a somewhat higher rated shutter than the original 7D (200,000 clicks versus 150,000... not sure about the 80D, but most cameras in that series have been 100,000 click rated.)

You didn't indicate whether or not you are using a battery grip, but I've seen a couple minor "issues" with the 7DII's OEM battery grip...

I think the thumb buttons on it's battery grip are a little smaller, closer together, and maybe less prominent. Using Back Button Focus, which I always do, I have been a bit more prone to pressing the wrong button or two buttons at the same time accidentally. After some 30,000 or so clicks on each camera, I'm getting used to it. But it was something I noticed quite a bit at first.

And, where the original 7D's battery grip used a door on the rear and you simply dropped batteries into one or both of the slots, Canon has gone to using a "battery tray" or "magazine" inside the 7DII's grip, that holds the same size LP-E6/E6N batteries and instead slides into the grip from one end (more like the 1D-series batteries do). This was probably done to help keep the grip from being too bulky and works just fine. However, I've been trying unsuccessfully to buy a couple spare tray/magazines to be able to have them pre-loaded with batteries, for quicker and less clumsy changes in the field. Retailers, Canon support, Canon parts and repair dept. and even Canon Prof'l Services all have been utterly and frustratingly clueless about this... They don't appear to offer spares or understand what I want even when I've read them the exact (and unique) part number right off the trays themselves. They've even tried to sell me the completely wrong battery tray (for AA batteries on one occasion, and even an AA tray for 5D Mark II on another!). This really shouldn't be a big deal and seems to me to be a very logical thing to want spares! I hope they figure it out eventually, in the meantime I'll just keep doing the clumsy and slower battery swaps. I certainly ain't gonna buy a whole additional battery grip just to have a spare battery tray!

On a much more minor and probably rather silly note.... The battery grip for the original 7D happened to be the "BG-E7".... I kinda wish Canon had called the 7DII's grip a "BG-E7 Mark II" instead of "BG-E16". In fact, I wish they'd use this naming convention with all the battery grips, where the grip's designation matches the model it's intended for. Should be doable, since the grips are for the large part unique to particular camera models or a few models within a series.

Regarding 5D Mark III... That's a fine 22MP camera and full frame is great for landscapes and architecture. The Mark III's AF system is so much improved over the Mark II's. The newer model's AF is up to the demands of action shooting, where the earlier models' weren't. I still have and use a Mark II myself, and use it for portraits, landscape, architecture and some macro.... just rarely for any sort of action shooting. I'll probably update to the Mark IV, but even then for sports and wildlife I still want the "free teleconverter" effect of the APS-C cameras that allows me to work with smaller, lighter, less expensive tele lenses... Or gets me 1.6X more out of big, long, expensive telephotos. So, much as the Mark III and IV have improved their AF, I'm still not likely to use them much for action/sports/wildlife.

Can't really advise you... but I feel the 7DII update was good for me. Since I fairly frequently need to shoot in "iffy" lighting conditions, the 7DII's better low light capabilities and it's Anti-Flicker feature have

tnste Loc: New Westminster, BC

You provided a lot of information. Thank you. I am going to keep the 7D Mark II. Now I just have to get familiar with it. I was going to keep my 7D Mark I but am thinking of selling it but have not made up my mind yet. Would appreciate what others think about this.