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Posts for: kbmccallie
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Jan 17, 2012 20:07:54   #
robertperry wrote:
Any Bridal shows coming up soon in your area? Great place to get brochures of many photographers in the business. If you make a contract with anyone, put it in writing that you are not a professional and they understand the quality may not be what you would get from a high end photographer. This may or may not help you if a legal dispute arises. Don't let the legal stuff terrify you from doing what you enjoy doing, just be aware of it. In wedding photography, 2 is better than one. Have a backup for everything.
Any Bridal shows coming up soon in your area? Grea... (show quote)


Thank you. This is the second wedding I've done. And I learned that one the first time. I didn't get into photography for this, but I'm following the path to see where it leads. :-)
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Jan 17, 2012 20:06:09   #
ShakyShutter wrote:
And don't forget about general business liability insurance. The contract is worth looking at to be sure everyone is on the same page when it comes to expectations.

You might look into creating a printed book of the wedding. Look at Blurb.com or Adorama.com just to mention a couple.


Thank you, I will! :thumbup:
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Jan 17, 2012 20:05:34   #
mgemstone wrote:
Here is another option that many young couples prefer. For a set fee, I photograph the wedding, reception, etc. and do appropriate air brushing of the images. I then print one copy of each image on a 4"X6" photo paper and copy the air brushed tIFFs to a CD. I then take the same images and change them to Jpegs suitable for the web and copy those to a CD. I then give the CDs to the couple along with a letter with my business letterhead given then ownership and the copyright to all the images. they can print the images at walgreens or whatever and setup the images on the internet with ease. I don't have the overhead of maintaining the wedding images or sitting down with the couple to select images for aunt Anne, mother of thje bride, etc. They get to do it without me. Now I do retain a copy and backup just in case but I am under no legal liability to do so. Photographers typicallymake their money from the prints but if a client wants a cheaper package, I prefer this method as I don't have a long term committment and am just a gun for hire.
Here is another option that many young couples pre... (show quote)


Very clever! This is a young couple who are paying for most everything themselves. That may be the road I take. I've been given so many good suggestions, not sure yet. But thank you very much!
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Jan 17, 2012 20:03:18   #
robertperry wrote:
robertperry wrote:
Any Bridal shows coming up soon in your area? Great place to get brochures of many photographers in the business. If you make a contract with anyone, put it in writing that you are not a professional and they understand the quality may not be what you would get from a high end photographer. This may or may not help you if a legal dispute arises. Don't let the legal stuff terrify you from doing what you enjoy doing, just be aware of it. In wedding photography, 2 is better than one. Have a backup for everything.
Any Bridal shows coming up soon in your area? Grea... (show quote)


Let me add to my own comment. Back in the day when I did wedding photography, not only did I offer packages, but I also offered a no package deal, no set number of images in their album. By this, the clients chose which photos and what sizes they wanted in their album. Album cost this much, pages cost this much, photos cost this much. Very easy, not complicated and my clients could build their wedding album according to their budget. Add additional pages later if they wanted. This worked great for both of us, clients didn't have to base their album on a set number of photos. Choose to sell high end albums because this album needs to last a lifetime.
quote=robertperry Any Bridal shows coming up soon... (show quote)


Thank you! That may be the route I take. I got into photography to do nature photos, but it has progressed along these routes. I guess that's good in a way.
:-D :-D
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Jan 16, 2012 23:17:01   #
I have been asked to do another wedding. They like my work and have checked with several pro's, but somehow settled on me...don't ask me why...charming personality?? Anyway, they want me to do both their engagement photos and their wedding photos. They have asked me about packages...I HAVE NO CLUE HOW TO SET UP PACKAGES, MUCH LESS PRICE THEM! I am asking for your advice. You guys have always been so helpful in the past. The wedding is not until June of this year. It's a small beautiful chapel set out in the country. Three groomsmen and three bridesmaids, and the sweetest couple. HELP? I'm getting ready to say good night, but will check tomorrow. THANK YOU!
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Jan 9, 2012 21:30:50   #
George H wrote:
CanonShot wrote:
nikron7 wrote:
CanonShot wrote:
nikron7 wrote:
Here's a little twist to what's been said. In 1984 I was in Washington D.C. photographing our national monuments with a 4x5 Calumet View Camera. I was set up just outside the Lincoln Memorial when I was approached by two uniform policemen who told me I needed a permit to photograph the Lincoln Memorial. I told them I wasn't professional and I was just shooting for me. They told me they would confiscate my camera and I would go to jail if I didn't get my camera out of there. I again reiterated I was not taking photographs for commercial use,they started to grab my camera, so I left. I don't know how it is now but that was my experience.
Here's a little twist to what's been said. In 198... (show quote)


During the 2011 Cherry Blossom Festival in D.C., I photographed everything in the Tidal Basin area, the three momuments up close and personal, and Marine One crossing the basin and landing on the White House lawn. Not a word was said by any policeman or any of the military folks that were photographing family members in the area, too. Best thing was a Japanese wedding party being professionally photographed amongst the original cherry trees in full blossom. Since this event was taking place in this public location, I unobtusively became an "assistant" photographer and no one objected.
quote=nikron7 Here's a little twist to what's bee... (show quote)


I was told I had a professional camera (4x5 Calumet View) photographing a landmark monument for professional purposes without a permit. There were other folks with 35mm SLRs photographing but they didn't bother them. I think the circumstances were a little different. Although their tolerance may have improved a little, you still need a permit to photograph the monuments for commerical purposes.
quote=CanonShot quote=nikron7 Here's a little tw... (show quote)


It is nice to know about the permit concerning a landmark monument for professional/commercial purposes. It is also nice to know that my Canon 70-200 f/2.8 II IS USM flies under the professional lens radar (for professional purposes).
quote=nikron7 quote=CanonShot quote=nikron7 Her... (show quote)


Canonshot,
Actually is doesn't, if you place it on a mono or tripod, it will draw attention, and you may be stopped. I know that I have been, but then again I get the permit so I just show that. The permit is not expensive, just a little time consuming. For those of you who want, go to this site;
http://www.nps.gov/applications/digest/permits.cfm?urlarea=permits

George
quote=CanonShot quote=nikron7 quote=CanonShot ... (show quote)


Thanks for the info. So far, I haven't had any problems, but then again I live in a very small town where almost everyone knows me. Thank you for the link to get the permit...very helpful.
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Jan 9, 2012 17:06:55   #
Mike Padgett wrote:
Still a newbie learning details of photo world, so always looking for input. Love the calendars showing ancient barns and other structures, and rusted pickups in fields. And would love to shoot hot rods and collector cars at auto shows, as well as abandoned factories.
But what are legal restrictions?


It's my understanding that if it is on personal property you need the owner's permission. Living in a small town that hasn't been a problem as of yet...but I feel it's coming. I may be wrong, some more seasoned professionals may be better able to answer that question. I've never done a calender, so again I'm not much help...but if it were me, I would get some kind of release in writing.

Karen
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Jan 6, 2012 11:55:46   #
Danilo wrote:
Hi Karen!
I just looked on your site, there is certainly nothing lacking in the photography! But now I will be blunt, and to the point:
Assume MY family and I are being photographed, we're all having a good time. We enjoy all the attention from the photographer, and many great pictures are made. And then...
And then...nothing. "Go to the website and pick out you pictures."
The personal relationship is just...gone.
Cliff has brought this up many times on this forum. Posting is NOT selling, it's NOT personal, it's NOT effective.
You must be just as personally involved in the end of your transaction, as you were in the beginning.
I hope I haven't been too direct. Best of luck to you!
Hi Karen! br I just looked on your site, there is ... (show quote)


No...I like honesty and people saying what they feel, and I appreciate your advice as well as all the others. I do stay in touch with my clients while I'm editing the photos, and afterwards as well. Hoping to build a client base this way, and so far so good. I plan on using Cliff's approach, I like it very much. I think I will be the only one in this town to do this...but that is okay, I've always been somewhat of a "speak my mind in a Southern lady like way person," unless of course I'm really upset...then my Irish temper flares. :D I started my website in Nov. of 2010, and last year sold 189 photos. Don't know if that's good or bad, but I plan on doing more this year. I'm the "newbie" photographer in town, but word is spreading, and I am grateful for that! Thank you for your advice, and I will keep y'all posted.

Karen
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Jan 6, 2012 11:46:10   #
Lazy Old Coot wrote:
CaptainC wrote:
Karen, and any of the rest of you reading this and want to sell portrait images:

All the advice about watermarks and low-res is good, but the plain truth is that posting image on line for sale - and I am specifically talking portraits - is a sales killer. Nobody and I mean NOBODY, sees the images until both mom and dad and I are in the same room with their checkbook. Then they see the images and make the purchase decisions. I have some samples - most are 16x20 - of mounted prints, canvas gallery wraps, metal prints, etc. so they can see what finished products look like. (You sell what you show.)

You need to price to make a profit. An 8x10 for anything less than $25 is a money loser. Even a 4x6 should be at least $15.00. Is there really any less work in producing a 4x6? Most successful photographers I know price an 8x10 and everything smaller the same.

The customers know ahead of time that there will be no paper proofs and that is not an option.

I also do NOT offer images on a CD. If asked, I tell them I can do it, but every image is priced as an 11x14.

Go to their home, set up a projector and screen as well as taking along the samples, the customers love it.

I know the response from those starting out is along the line of, "It takes too much time," or, "I cannot afford the sales tools."
But I will tell you my first projection appointment paid for the projector, the software, and the screen.

One more online thing - There are pros and cons to this, but I do not show prices online. If you do, people tend to choose on price. You want people to call you so you can engage them and not have them concentrate on just price.

All of the above is based on experience, not a guess.
Karen, and any of the rest of you reading this and... (show quote)


Karen, I've spent forty years in sales, no not photography, business forms and data processing supplies. Based on my experience I think this advice from Captain D is right on the money. The prospect has to be able to evaluate the quality of the product he is purchasing. You accomplish that with your samples from other shoots, but not their shoot. They can hold them in their hands and understand the quality you provide. Then you can show them the shots from their shoot. Projection would be ideal. If that's not practical I would use a laptop with a large screen rather than an iPad. With an iPad I suspect you would end up selling 5x7s rather than 8x10s or larger prints (just my opinion). By having them view the photos this way, they can't ask to take proofs home with them to decide which ones they want. They have to make their decision right there and that's very important. The person that's going to write the check has to be there when you show them their shots. Otherwise they will say they have to talk to the check writer and get back to you with their decision. The turning point of the whole sales process is getting them to make their first print decision. Once the first olive is out of the bottle, the rest of them should be much easier. As you gather more experience you will likely develop ways to increase the number of prints you sell from each shoot, or convince them to buy a larger size. I would never sell them a CD so they could make their own prints. You would have no control of the quality of their final product and that product is what will establish your reputation. You seem to have pleasing personality and a logical and open mind. If you produce a quality product your reputation will spread. It will take some time, but I think you will do quite well. Good luck!!
I hope you'll keep in touch and let us know how you're doing. ....... Gray Bates/aka/Coot
quote=CaptainC Karen, and any of the rest of you ... (show quote)


Thank you Gray. I do appreciate all the advice I have received from this site. It's been amazing. Before I did my first shoot with people(started out just doing nature and architecture), I asked several photographers in town how they did their selling. Either they put them up on a website, or they had proofs for the clients to see. Being a "newbie" this is how I based my selling procedures. With the first 3 family/portrait shoots I did, I had no problem. But...I didn't feel as if I were making the money for the time I had put into the photographs. Not that I'm that great, not at all, but I do take it seriously and try to do my best for the clients. I do like the idea of not posting portrait shots on the website I have, but rather having a one on one meeting with the clients before and after the photos are edited. I think that is how I will handle it from now on. I can take my laptop and show them or else have some of my best work of other clients to show them. I will be the only one in this town to do this( I think), but I've never been one to back down from a challenge...unless it involved heights! Thank you so much for your input. I welcome all advice, and I try to learn from it all.
Karen
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Jan 6, 2012 00:03:24   #
suntomoon wrote:
kbmccallie wrote:
agej1001 wrote:
lacsar wrote:
Have you protected the photo's you have on line. It's very easy for someone with even a small amount of computer knowledge to make copies right from your site. Even if you set them up so you cannot right click on them, there are programs out there for free that can acquire them like snippet. This may not be the case, but they may have the prints already and you not know.


I agree with this as this was my first possible thought.
i as a friend took some family photos for a so valled friend and took my time as there were pictures of jus her and her boyfriend and together they had six children- little did i know even at that i should have had some agreement with her (but since she was my"friend") ihad given her permission to print the ohotos i took but all the time i spent doing the
editing and all tjat she turned around and altered and edited alot of her pictures for herself. That upset me. N she paid me 40$ for over 300pictures i took
quote=lacsar Have you protected the photo's you h... (show quote)


I am so sorry for your experience. How awful of her!! Yes, I have put my photography name (waterproofed) smack dab across the middle of all the photos. So there will be no cropping or if they try the pic. will look awful. They are also right click protected, although I know that is not full proof. I am going to come up with a written agreement before I do another shoot. And I like the idea of using a thumb drive, projector, or ipad to display my photos and get their order with the money up front. I mean we all put in a lot of time on our photos, we should be compensated for it.

Thank you for your input!!
quote=agej1001 quote=lacsar Have you protected t... (show quote)


Please share how to protect photos, would so appreciate if not too much trouble!Thankyou :-D
quote=kbmccallie quote=agej1001 quote=lacsar Ha... (show quote)


In whatever editing program you use, there should be somewhere that states watermarking. I use Adobe Photoshop Elements 10, as well as Adobe Lightroom 3, and both have watermarking tools. You can use whatever you want as a word or phrase to watermark, a lot of people use "PROOF," OR "COPY." I use my business name. I'm probably not the best person to ask, because it took me a long time just to figure that out. I'm sure there are other ways, and someone more qualified may be able to help you better. I would pose this as a question, or there may be one already posted on the "photography topics." Hope that helps...and good luck! btw...when you have your photos printed, the watermark does not show up.
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Jan 5, 2012 23:37:47   #
suntomoon wrote:
Can you state your "terms" on a contract of sorts, so you can move on? :-D


Plan to do just that. Going to work on it this weekend as I have a meeting about another possible shoot coming up soon.

Thank you!!
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Jan 5, 2012 22:45:07   #
agej1001 wrote:
lacsar wrote:
Have you protected the photo's you have on line. It's very easy for someone with even a small amount of computer knowledge to make copies right from your site. Even if you set them up so you cannot right click on them, there are programs out there for free that can acquire them like snippet. This may not be the case, but they may have the prints already and you not know.


I agree with this as this was my first possible thought.
i as a friend took some family photos for a so valled friend and took my time as there were pictures of jus her and her boyfriend and together they had six children- little did i know even at that i should have had some agreement with her (but since she was my"friend") ihad given her permission to print the ohotos i took but all the time i spent doing the
editing and all tjat she turned around and altered and edited alot of her pictures for herself. That upset me. N she paid me 40$ for over 300pictures i took
quote=lacsar Have you protected the photo's you h... (show quote)


I am so sorry for your experience. How awful of her!! Yes, I have put my photography name (waterproofed) smack dab across the middle of all the photos. So there will be no cropping or if they try the pic. will look awful. They are also right click protected, although I know that is not full proof. I am going to come up with a written agreement before I do another shoot. And I like the idea of using a thumb drive, projector, or ipad to display my photos and get their order with the money up front. I mean we all put in a lot of time on our photos, we should be compensated for it.

Thank you for your input!!
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Jan 5, 2012 22:40:04   #
healthydogs wrote:
Send them a note saying you'll need to replace their pictures when you update your site this month. Then see what they say...if anything.

There are myriad possible reasons why they didn't follow up with you, none of them necessarily having anything to do with you or your photography nor would you necessarily be told. For example, perhaps their discretionary spending $$$ went to Xmas or someone lost a job, or some unexpected other thing, ...

It does sound like you may have priced your base fee too low. You need to have a "sitting fee" that you can be a little more comfortable with since. as is true here, that may be all you ever get.

Who knows, maybe they just forgot...

Good Luck.
Send them a note saying you'll need to replace the... (show quote)


Yes, I agree. I do know I priced my base fee to low, not again. I spent too many hours going over and over the photos to make sure they were just right.

Thank you!
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Jan 5, 2012 22:37:24   #
travlnman46 wrote:
Hello kbmccallie: While not entirely off subject I would like to ask. Have you ever thought of participating in a bridal fair? I spent many years in men's formal wear and had a booth in each and every one also had my tuxedos on every model. Because of that we booked almost every wedding on the horizon. We also worked closely with the other merchants there. Including the Photographers. When you participate in such an event it gives you the opportunity to display your skills, set your prices offer any fair specials, book those weddings and begin to build raport with your clients. Beware Brides and Mothers of brides are very demanding in their expectations. Be certain you have the skills to provide for their expectations. Scott Kelby has some great books and tips on wedding photography, if you truely want to be a pro at this learn from the best.
Hello kbmccallie: While not entirely off subject I... (show quote)


That is a great idea. No, I haven't been to any bridal fairs or participated in anything like that. And yes...I am aware of how brides and their moms can be.

Thank you for your advice!
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Jan 5, 2012 17:48:42   #
jwrawlinson wrote:
A few more points. I fully endorse Captain C's advice. In addition, I would suggest that you price your photos with a time line so that after a period of time, the prices go up and HOLD FIRM to that price change.

Believe in yourself to the point that you believe in the images you provide. There are three expressions you need to use:

First, when you are talking to your client tell them, "Oh, I really look forward to doing the photographs. They are going to look lovely, (smart, fabulous, exciting). As you are taking the photographs, say, "Wow, I can't wait for you to see the actual images, (photographs, prints). NEVER USE THE WORD "PROOF."

Second, when you call your subject to tell them the images are ready for viewing, put emotion in your voice and tell them how pleased you are with the images.

Third, when they come in to view the images, have your very favorite image as the first image you show them and tell them that you felt it was special and one of the favorites.

JR
A few more points. I fully endorse Captain C's adv... (show quote)


Sounds good, thank you! :thumbup:
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