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Jul 8, 2014 16:19:56   #
The use of chemical weapons in Iraq goes back to 1980 when Donald Rumsfeld helped Saddam Hussein obtain the chemicals. The term "weapons of mass destruction" in conjunction with chemical weapons was coined under the Bush Administration. Before that WMD referred only to Nuclear Weapons. The record is documented that the Bush Administration "cooked" the intelligence for their needs. Bush's subordinates mislead Colin Powell with bad facts at the UN. The war in Iraq was unnecessary, opposed by BushSenior and has done nothing to advance this Country. Too many troops have been killed and/or wounded and after spending trillions just what has been achieved? There is sufficient blame to go around.
boberic wrote:
First Iraq had WMDs They killed 5,000 Kurds with poison gas. In a Post 9/11 world if you were president what you do? Virtually every member of congress said Iraq had WMDs, What would you do? Your CIA and every allied secret service said Iraq had WMDs, what would you do? The UN passed 17 resolutions demanding that Iraq get rid of their WMDs, what would do? Hussain through out the UN inpectors, what would you do? Rather than wait for Hussain to use the WMDs Bush took a proactive approach, and formed a broed international coalition and removed one of the wordls most viscious dictators. Say what you will about Bush's actions, If Hussian released another gas attack I think you would have been the first one to call for his impeachment. By the way small amounts of poison gas were if fact found In Iraq.. Don't believe me. Chack it out on "Wiki leaks WMDs in Iraq"
First Iraq had WMDs They killed 5,000 Kurds with p... (show quote)
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Jun 28, 2014 12:14:14   #
Red Bear, thanks for your excellent explanation. "Normal" or "perfectly normal" are labels which are often used in a negative way and downright offensive and shouldn't be used when describing a disabled person, veteran, etc.
Red Bear wrote:
crissx09, It's me again, being a pain. The use of "Therapeutic Animals" in treatment of many conditions not readily seen by the general public dates back at least to the Roman Army. There are many service animals other than dogs, too and none of them can legally be denied access to anywhere the disabled person, veteran or not, wants to go. The federal law leaves the "burden of proof" in reverse from the normal America system; a place denying entry must prove that the person doesn't NEED a service animal.

Currently, I have friends, mostly disabled vets because I am one, that have dogs, cats, miniature horses, various birds and one guy that has a "Service Fish." In his case, he hardly ever takes the fish out for a walk, so we'll drop that.

If you saw me, and for some reason I wasn't wearing my eye patch and didn't have my oxygen tank with me (no longer possible, BTW), You would probably think that I was "normal."

But, I have no left lung (since 1968), I've been wound 3 times in service to the nation, I've had two heart attacks, I've had two strokes, I've had two broken backs (one from a bad "jump" in the service) six cancers in the last 43 years (Agent Orange) and a few other minor discomforts. I am still 6'2" and 225 pounds and in reasonable shape for someone that will never see 75 again.

One look and most people would assume that my "hobby" is throwing people off of roofs of tall buildings - instead of 40 DVAMC medical appointments each year. I should and could have a service animal for my heart condition, my eye sight and a really HUGE case of (medically controlled) PTSD from, they say, my enjoying killing people for a living through the 1960's. I like to eat fish, not feed them and I'm allergic to most all animal hair, so I can't get a K-9 "buddy." I did have one, about 1975, but the state made me pass him to a larger and better (for him) home. I still miss him - he was a full-grown Alaskan male wolf.

I hope all that helps with the discussion.
:thumbup: :thumbup:
crissx09, It's me again, being a pain. The use of... (show quote)
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Jun 28, 2014 09:03:53   #
I know the subject is. I asked you to explain your statement: "A person that looks perfectly normal." That's a reasonable request. And yes, there are certain heart conditions that might require a service dog.
crissx09 wrote:
Explain to us..? I will try you better: Do you need a dog for a heart condition...? Or for most of the disabilities..? Don't miss the point, the subject here is the dog, not the person...and good bye.
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Jun 27, 2014 16:49:53   #
Explain to us "if that person looks perfectly normal". What does that mean? Many disabilities are not obvious to the naked eye. Heart conditions, COPD to name two. Must I limp to convince you that I am disabled? Or perhaps, show my bullet wounds and purple heart? More importantly I'm anxious to read your explanation of "a perfectly normal person. . ."
crissx09 wrote:
Red Bear answer my question. That is all I was curious about. There is an ID for DAV and that should be enough for anyone with a normal common sense.
No one is asking to prove their disability, as you put it but, if that person looks perfectly normal, what about to come in with a dog..? If asked and out of courtesy shouldn't that person show that he/she is entitled to that privilege..?
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Jun 27, 2014 15:10:00   #
Red, I agree with everything you have said thus far, and as a career veteran I want to thank you for your commitment and dedication to this Country. Although we have ID cards that identify us as disabled vets, retired military, etc we need them for obtaining services at a VA or military facility, not to prove to anyone we are disabled.
Red Bear wrote:
crissx09, we have ID cards that identify us as disabled veterans. Nothing more is needed - unless people want a bunch of irate former Special Forces, Seals, Force Recon and Air Commandos to start, shall we say, expressing our displease with idiots that we shed blood for? :thumbup: :thumbup:
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Jun 27, 2014 15:04:44   #
Crtssx09. Do you carry an ID that says you are a healthy, white male? Why should any person have to show proof of their disability. Should the requirement to show an ID be extended to US citizens? The owner/operator of a business has the responsibility to know and understand the laws that apply, the handicapped person is responsible with complying, not proving their handicap or disability.
crissx09 wrote:
After all this large discussion I have a question: Does a veteran carry an ID that state specifically he is disable and need the assistance of a dog..? I think with proper ID couldn't be any base for arguments like this. The hotel owner will follow the law...or else and the chance of a fake disable veteran eliminated. This simple.............What has to do Patel or Daytona Beach in this situation other than show the low biased mind of the one who mention it...?
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Jun 27, 2014 09:23:45   #
An injury or disability is oftentimes NOT visible. Take the time to read the ADA before commenting.
JamesCurran wrote:
There's a big difference -- in this case, the police were called in, and they immediately corrected the situation. The system worked, everyone's happy.

And in the motel owner's defense, the veteran had no obvious injury, and clearly didn't need a "seeing-eye" dog, so it reasonable for them to be skeptical when he claims to be a veteran and needs to be with a dog (that was in the car at the time). It sounds just like a guy with a pet trying to get around the "no pets allowed" rule.
There's a big difference -- in this case, the poli... (show quote)
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Jun 14, 2014 21:17:28   #
Blunt or sarcastic, no matter, your rudeness and "bluntness" doesn't further the discussion one iota. I served a career in the military and a second career as a civilian to the DOD in sensitive and difficult positions, for both Republican and Democratic Administrations. I don't need you to preach about the Constitution or this country. You can save your self professed expertise for someone who gives a tinkers damm. Your comments was offensive and unnecessary. But then again, its convenient to hide behind this thread bullies often do.
quote=UXOEOD]I was not being sarcastic, I was being BLUNT.

I really don't care if you are offended, I am offended that you, and so many others in this Great Nation haven't read the Constitution, don't appreciate the truely greatness and inspired nature of our Constitution, and don't comprehend two extremely important and basic conditions that seperate us, The United States of America from the rest of the world.

1. The Constitution of The United States of America

2. The strange oath that our military take upon enlisting and commissioning into the service of this Great Country. Where other nations require their military to swear on alliance to their country, or their leaders, or their government, we swear an oath to "protect and defend the Constitution from all enemies both foreign and domestic".

Think about it, our military swears to defend a peice of paper, must be a pretty important peice of paper, don't you think? One hell of a lot of men, and women have died protecting and defending that peice of paper. I do not beleive it is too much to expect that grown and intelligent men and women spend a few minutes reading it, before they start to argue it.

One other strange thing about that simple peice of paper, while it codifies the right of freedom of speech, it does not guarantee you won't repeatedly and regularly be offended by people practicing their freedom of speech.[/quote]
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Jun 14, 2014 13:56:21   #
Your comment on "a bridge". I was merely responding to someone comment on Iraqi oil. You remarked on that. And yes, I have read the entire thread and commented previously.
Allen Hirsch wrote:
I've read all the comments. Have you?
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Jun 14, 2014 13:46:32   #
You might want to read the previous comments before commenting.
Allen Hirsch wrote:
You would have one to sell, because if you believe Obama, you've already bought one.
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Jun 14, 2014 13:33:39   #
I have a bridge to sell you!!
dirtpusher wrote:
i'm still waiting on that iraq oil to pay us back 3 trillion for that was as promised by bushie.
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Jun 14, 2014 13:10:41   #
My statement is TRUE because George Bush started a war that was unnecessary, illegal and immoral. That began an unfortunate journey which after 12 years and two Presidents has left this country weaker and poorer and divided.
Allen Hirsch wrote:
The surge worked, despite tremendous political pressure against it.

This Administration even tried to take credit for how Iraq was turning out - as a stable democracy - when Obama pulled our troops out to fulfill his campaign promise just in time for his re-election.

So the ONLY reason your last statement is true is because Obama's actions and non-actions in Syria and Iraq managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory - unless their claim about Iraq being a success story of this Administration were all false.

So which is it??
The surge worked, despite tremendous political pre... (show quote)
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Jun 14, 2014 12:44:58   #
Mission Accomplished. It was George W. Bush who argued that the United States needed to intervene in Iraq and end the rule of the dictator Saddam Hussein lest the country become a nesting ground for terrorists who could tap the weapons of mass destruction supposedly on hand. His administration joined with his British counterpart Tony Blair to sell the war on grounds of since-debunked links between Saddam and al Qaeda along with claims about his ultimately nonexistent stocks of WMD. Yet 11 years after Bush began the war, vast swaths of Iraq are now in the hands of ISIS, a Sunni jihadist sect disdained by no less than al Qaeda as excessively violent and dogmatic.
Allen Hirsch wrote:
He's said lots of things that weren't true:

"If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. Period."

"If you like your health plan, you can keep your health plan."

He promised that, unlike Bush, he would not have any lobbyists working in his administration.

He said he would close Gitmo, first thing, as President.

"The only involvement I had with Acorn was doing some stuff with the justice department."

"The public will have 5 days to look at every bill that lands on my desk"

"I won't sign any healthcare bill that adds one dime to the deficit"

There are dozens more, but you get the idea.....
He's said lots of things that weren't true: br br... (show quote)
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Jun 14, 2014 09:06:11   #
Your sarcastic comments are offensive and uncalled for. Save your street trash for your friends and family. I don't appreciate it.
UXOEOD wrote:
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.



It is a real shame. It really isn't that large of a document, try to read the Constitution, you may learn something. Lots of us really find Article X very interesting, just one sentence really.

Do go off into it has been done before land. Just because you made stupid statements, and got away with it don't make it right or you smart. Read the document before you make a fool of yourself.
The powers not delegated to the United States by t... (show quote)
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Jun 13, 2014 17:49:46   #
The president can set the minimum wage, but he cannot spend money for paying minimum wage unless Congress obligates the funds. Example is during the Vietnam Era Congress cut off funding for all expenditures involving the conflict, thus effectively ending the war. No money for military operations, no war.
rgrenaderphoto wrote:
You guys always confuse funding legislation with and application. The President has the flexibility to set Federal Minimum wage new contracts and programs as part of contracting guidelines.

This is no difference in current prevailing wage contracts, where I am required to pay an hourly wage of a certain value when doing government jobs.
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