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The Olympus AI is simply amazing
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Mar 1, 2019 00:36:12   #
tdekany Loc: Oregon
 
SuperflyTNT wrote:
Wow, aren’t there some kids on your lawn you need to go yell at?



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Mar 1, 2019 01:28:35   #
User ID
 
Bipod wrote:
I know of no other camera that behaves in exactly that fashion. However, I do know
of many cameras that take good pictures without unnecessary complexity, and that are
sold based on their image quality, not gimmicks and buzzwords.

I'm glad that the E-MIX camera worked for you on that day, with that scene. However,
it proves nothing.

So you are repeating an advertising claim,. Thank you for admitting it. Well,
if you can't trust corporate advertising, what can you trust?

VW says its cars have "farfegnugen". I admit: I don't know what"farfegnugen" means--
but then, I don't use the word. (And VW admitted lying to the US EPA about it's
light diesel truck's emissions, and in a court settlement agreed to set up a $2.7 billion
mitigation trust fund. So much for corporate integrity.)

Before you use a buzzword like "AI", you might want to find out the defintion--
if there is one. If there isn't, or if it's extremely vague or not really relevant to
photography, then you might to avoid using the term.

As it happens, there is no rigorous definition for "intelligence". So "artificial
intelligence" is undefinable. The term used to be used informally for research
into machine learning, but now it's become an advertising buzzword and a staple
of TV sci-fi (you know, like "warp drive").

Does the E-MIX also have a warp drive?

Warp drives and AI belong to fiction, but automation is real -- and it's limitations are
well-known. So the the relevant questions are: does one undrestand it's limitations?
And what's plan B when it fails to work?

We've all seen AF and AE fail. For example, if Program Mode fails to get the exposure
you want, you could try AP or SP. If that still doesn't work, you can add exposure
compensation. If you're still not getting what you want, there's manual mode.

Many photographers understand exopsure well enough to guess why a particular mode
failed to give the expected result. . But very few photographers understand AF, and nobody
understands "AI"--because it's just a buzzword.

Moreover, nobody understands any secret, proprietary algorithms except the guy who
wrote the code. And very often programammers try to implement a well-known
algorithm (some from Donald Knuth's books, say) and don't get it quite right. Complex
code is a real pain-in-the-assets.

Bottom line: photography isn't about automation--it's about control. Cameras are a tool.
And lke any tool, the user needs to understand how it works (including it's limitaitons)
and needs to control it.
I know of no other camera that behaves in exactly ... (show quote)



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Mar 3, 2019 17:34:58   #
Bipod
 
UserID, there you go again with the stupid images.
You're not bored, your scared. You have been proven
wrong and are too insecure to admit it.

wdross, are you the same person as UserID?

Reply
 
 
Mar 3, 2019 18:06:48   #
Bipod
 
wdross wrote:
Without using the pixel shift function, and viewing from a proper viewing distance, a print from RAW will produce a 30" X 40" print that, again from a proper viewing distance, will look the same as any larger format 30" X 40" print. Using the pixel shift function produces an 80mp RAW file. I think the largest files from Canon and Nikon are 50mp. How big a print can one produce from a 50mp file? I would assume that one could go much bigger with an 80mp RAW file?

It's true that when you know the viewing distance, you can compute the
resolution you need for that print.

But usually we cannot control the distance from which people view prints.
The exceptions are rare: billboards, prints hung very high on a wall or behind a
velvet rope, etc.

If you watch people in a gallery (particularly potential buyers), they will walk up to
about 3-feet from any landscape print, no matter how large. They want to inspect
the quality. So it had better not look unsharp or pixellated.

Not all types of prints require the sharpness of West Coast school landscapes.
But whatever image quality you need, you need. Playing word games won't
change the facts or how the market judges prints.

I was discussing MFT format. You wrote: "viewing from a proper viewing distance,
a print from RAW will produce a 30" X 40" print that, again from a proper viewing
distance, will look the same as any larger format 30" X 40" print".

Isn't this a bit like saying 1 loaf of bread "divided into the proper portion" (one crumb
each), will feed 100 people?

"Viewing from the proper distance" a postage stamp looks the size of the side of barn.

"Viewing from the proper distance" the side of a barn looks the size of a postage stamp.

Image quality does matter to print collectors and to good photographers. Sorry
if this spoils your affection for subminiature formats, wdross.

Why do you think Ansel Adams, Bruce Barnbaum, Don McCullin, David Muench, and
Jack Dykinga, Martin Quinn, and Beth Moon all use large format for landscape prints?
Are they just stupid, backward or bad photographers in your opinion?

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Mar 3, 2019 18:13:24   #
User ID
 
Bipod wrote:
.........

Image quality does matter to print collectors
and to good photographers. Sorry if this spoils your
affection for subminiature formats, wdross.

.........



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Mar 3, 2019 18:18:34   #
Bipod
 
UserID wrote:

<Stupid image>

Cat got your tongue, UserID?

Why don't you tell us how many user IDs you have on UHH?
Come on, list your sock puppets!

Reply
Mar 3, 2019 18:25:38   #
Bipod
 
tdekany wrote:
Lots of noise.

How about you posting a picture that you took? After all, this is a photography forum, and the end result is the only thing that matters, which is a photograph. How about it mister?

Or are you here only to shill for film cameras?

How about providing facts and arguments instead of abuse, tdekany?

And how about listing all your sockpuppets? How many UserIDs
do you have on UHH?

I haven't said anything that required an image. Unlike you, I only post
images when they are relevant and necessary.

Please stop your abuse of this forum.

Reply
 
 
Mar 3, 2019 22:09:44   #
tdekany Loc: Oregon
 
Bipod wrote:
How about providing facts and arguments instead of abuse, tdekany?

And how about listing all your sockpuppets? How many UserIDs
do you have on UHH?

I haven't said anything that required an image. Unlike you, I only post
images when they are relevant and necessary.

Please stop your abuse of this forum.


If anyone is abusive it is you. Just read your last couple of posts to wross and userID. Most of your posts are condescending to most people.

And you haven’t posted a single photo that you took. All you do is make excuses for not posting. Based on your posts, you obviously have digital cameras, so what is the real reason for not posting one?? Is it because you are no better than a snapshot shooter??

Reply
Mar 4, 2019 00:19:15   #
User ID
 
Bipod wrote:
...........

Please stop your abuse of this forum.




Reply
Mar 4, 2019 00:23:29   #
trainspotter Loc: Oregon
 



Reply
Mar 4, 2019 00:25:53   #
wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado
 
Bipod wrote:
It's true that when you know the viewing distance, you can compute the
resolution you need for that print.

But usually we cannot control the distance from which people view prints.
The exceptions are rare: billboards, prints hung very high on a wall or behind a
velvet rope, etc.

If you watch people in a gallery (particularly potential buyers), they will walk up to
about 3-feet from any landscape print, no matter how large. They want to inspect
the quality. So it had better not look unsharp or pixellated.

Not all types of prints require the sharpness of West Coast school landscapes.
But whatever image quality you need, you need. Playing word games won't
change the facts or how the market judges prints.

I was discussing MFT format. You wrote: "viewing from a proper viewing distance,
a print from RAW will produce a 30" X 40" print that, again from a proper viewing
distance, will look the same as any larger format 30" X 40" print".

Isn't this a bit like saying 1 loaf of bread "divided into the proper portion" (one crumb
each), will feed 100 people?

"Viewing from the proper distance" a postage stamp looks the size of the side of barn.

"Viewing from the proper distance" the side of a barn looks the size of a postage stamp.

Image quality does matter to print collectors and to good photographers. Sorry
if this spoils your affection for subminiature formats, wdross.

Why do you think Ansel Adams, Bruce Barnbaum, Don McCullin, David Muench, and
Jack Dykinga, Martin Quinn, and Beth Moon all use large format for landscape prints?
Are they just stupid, backward or bad photographers in your opinion?
It's true that i when you know the viewing dista... (show quote)


I have a Jack Dykinga (#1 of 500) on my wall that was done by a 4 X 5. It was featured/shown three times in the second Outdoor Photographer issue of Masters of Landscape. What I like about it is he used Scheimpflug to get the photograph sharp from the sand in the foreground to the Totem Pole pillar in the background. But he mainly shoots with Canon TS lense now. Maybe you ought to tell him he has lost a little sharpness by doing so?

And you have read where one of the UHH members had a show where he displayed is 30 X 40 prints from his Canon and Olympus digital cameras. And the art critic could not tell which was which and refused to believe that the one he liked best was from the Olympus camera.

Some of your analogies aren't even close to being relevant for an answer. Such far fetched analogies I suspect have very little affect on any of the knowledgeable UHH member. As far as spoiling my "affection" for "subminiature" formats, I have a Hasselblad to compare images with. And while I will agree with you that at some point a larger format will print sharper than a smaller format, your point of departure would not be shared by PSA judges and many other UHH members. And I have no doubt that even Jack Dykinga does not really want me looking at his print from 12" away. That only gives one a 1/8 to 1/10 view of the whole print. I really think Jack Dykinga would want me to view the whole print, not just a little part of it. Otherwise he would have printed only a portion, not the whole print.

Reply
 
 
Mar 4, 2019 00:35:23   #
User ID
 
Bipod wrote:
Cat got your tongue, UserID?

Why don't you tell us how many user IDs you
have on UHH? Come on, list your sock puppets!



About my puppets ? Where I just pull their
strings and get the expected results ? Not
too many. I've got Bipod, and really a very
few more. Don't need a whole lot of them.


(Download)

Reply
Mar 4, 2019 19:28:58   #
Bipod
 
tdekany wrote:
If anyone is abusive it is you. Just read your last couple of posts to wross and userID. Most of your posts are condescending to most people.

And you haven’t posted a single photo that you took. All you do is make excuses for not posting. Based on your posts, you obviously have digital cameras, so what is the real reason for not posting one?? Is it because you are no better than a snapshot shooter??

I don't waste people's time and post untruths (or use sock puppets). That's your speciality, tdekany.

Reply
Mar 4, 2019 21:49:36   #
tdekany Loc: Oregon
 
Bipod wrote:
I don't waste people's time and post untruths (or use sock puppets). That's your speciality, tdekany.


More noise from you. Of course you post untruths. You do it all the time. Do you forget what you write? Try ginkgo biloba.

Lastly, you sure waste my time with your long mumbling.

Post a photo, show us that you actually take photographs. Without it, all you are is a cut and paste armchair expert.

See how easy it is? This is how you prove that you actually take photos.

But I know that the best you can do is hide behind your keyboard. That is your specialty


(Download)

Reply
Mar 6, 2019 23:14:44   #
Bipod
 
tdekany wrote:
More noise from you. Of course you post untruths. You do it all the time. Do you forget what you write? Try ginkgo biloba.

Lastly, you sure waste my time with your long mumbling.

Post a photo, show us that you actually take photographs. Without it, all you are is a cut and paste armchair expert.

See how easy it is? This is how you prove that you actually take photos.

But I know that the best you can do is hide behind your keyboard. That is your specialty

What a boring, fact-free post.

Reply
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