CanonAbuser wrote:
Greetings, I'm a newby to DSLR's and I'll likely trip all over myself with my questions, apologies in advance.
I used to shoot film, mostly vintage aircraft photos, many years ago (Minolta SRT101). I've been imaging general photos with a Fujifilm S9900W bridge camera for the last two years and was recently gifted a Canon T6 in a 2 lens kit. I'd like to experiment with some macro photography on the T6. I'm on a serious budget and I'm curious about using either close up filters or an extension tube to get started. I also have available the 50mm 1.7 MD lens from the old SLR and a Fotodiox adapter with glass (to get focus to infinity).
I'd like to tap the vast knowledge base here for opinions. Right now a new or used macro capable lens is out of the question. Thanks for you patience and responses.
Chris
Greetings, I'm a newby to DSLR's and I'll likely t... (
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I would encourage you to get macro extension tubes. They are a low cost way to "do macro" with lenses you already have. The Kenko set of tubes for around $130 is very good. There are cheaper, but more plasticky and lighter built Vello (and others) that can do the same, about $80 for a set.
DO NOT waste your money on really cheap extension tubes... under $25. Those lack the electronic contacts to control auto focus and, much more importantly, to be able to set the aperture on modern electronically controlled lenses. The Kenko, Vello, etc. tubes have electronic contacts. The Kenko are similar in quality to Canon's own tubes. However, the Kenko and Vello sets contain three tubes: 12mm, 20mm & 36mm. Canon's tubes are only sold individually and in two sizes: 12mm and 25mm. One Canon 25mm tube costs more than the the Kenko set of three.
Macro tubes are very easy to use. Simply install them between your lens and the camera. The longer the lens focal length and/or the higher magnification you want, the more extension you'll need. Experiment. Usually you will find it easiest to work with focal lengths in the 70mm to 135mm range. But you aren't limited to those, by any means.
Macro tubes have no optics to "mess" with image quality. They can have some effects on images, when you force a lens to focus closer than it was intended, such as softened corners and vignetting. However these aren't necessarily a bad thing. They can actually be used. They also can often be avoided in many cases by stopping the lens down.
Extension tubes work better than most "close-up lenses" that are fitted like filters, screwing into the front of the lens. The $25 to $50 sets of "close up filters" are awful, will spoil image quality, and are a waste of money. There are high quality close-up diopters, such as Canon's own 250D and 500D that are sold in various sizes. But in some sizes one of those will cost close to the same as the Kenko set of tubes! With the diopters (Canon's 250D is stronger magnification than their 500D), you will largely be limited to using them on lenses with the same or similar diameter filter thread. Also, even the high quality ones cost some image quality.
Your vintage, manual focus Minolta lens can be used with these tubes, too, thanks to the adapter on it. HOWEVER, I would remove the optics from the adapter, since they are very likely low quality and will spoil image quality. Canon made a high quality Canon FD to EF adapter some years ago, which did a pretty good job maintaining image quality, but in 1988 it sold for $250... today those high quality adapters are rare, very collectible, and often sell for over $1000. How much did you pay for that Fotodiox adapter? Under $50?
Without optics in the adapter, that Minolta lens won't focus to infinity.... but, so what? For macro photography (adding extension tubes to it) you don't need it to focus to infinity. In fact, you could likely use it for many other things - such as portraiture - where distances are typically far closer than the lens' infinity too.
There are other lens vintage lens mounts that are much more easily adapted for use on modern Canon DSLRs like your T6. Most manual focus lenses made to fit Nikon, Olympus, Pentax, Leica, Contax and some others can all be adapted without need for image spoiling optics. Minolta, Canon's own FL/FD, Konica and one or two others are not easily adapted. More info about fitting and using various vintage lenses on EOS DSLRs can be found at:
http://www.bobatkins.com/photography/eosfaq/manual_focus_EOS.htmlThere are also numerous vintage, manual focus lenses that were offered with interchangeable mounts, allowing them to be easily used on many different camera systems. One of the earliest and simplest were referred to as "T-mount". Later one of the more popular and successful was Tamron's "Adaptall" and "Adaptall2". T-mount (the "T" stands for Tamron, by the way) was a universal system used by many different manufacturers.... often with inexpensive, low quality lenses. But some T-mount lenses are high quality. There are a great many T-mount lenses around, from a wide variety of manufacturers. Tamron's more sophisticated Adaptall design allowed aperture control on older cameras where it was done mechanically, was patented and only used on their own lenses, some of which are very high quality (their "SP" are mostly "pro oriented" models).
Several years ago I came across a Tamron SP 90mm f/2.5 Adaptall2 Macro lens at a local second-hand store. I've used several of those over the years and knew it to be a very good lens, so was quick to hand over the $20 they were asking for it (in "like new" condition, with original caps, hood and even the matched 2X teleconverter that makes it a full 1:1 180mm macro lens). It happened to have a Nikon F-mount on it, but for $40, including shipping, I was able to buy a brand new "chipped" EOS/EF adapter for it on eBay. Four days later it arrived from China (where Adaptall mounts are still being made). If I'd been a bit more patient, I might have been able to find an OEM Adaptall, but those are pretty rare for EOS/EF, because Tamron was phasing out the Adaptall lens system about the same time that Canon was launching their EOS/EF system in the late 1980s and early 1990s.
Here are a couple photos of the lens... Left hand shows it with the Nikon F-mount Adaptall alongside, right hand image shows the lens mounted on one of my Canon cameras.
And here are several images made with that lens on the Canon camera:
Pretty good for a $60 lens, huh? The shot of the bee on the left and the poppy buds in the center images were both done with a 20mm or 25mm extension on the lens. Natively, it's a 1:2 macro lens... able to do half life size, as is shown in the shot of the poppy buds on the right. To get the lens closer to full 1:1, as seen in the left and center images, I added the extension tube between the lens and the camera.
This is just one example of what's possible. There are A LOT of other possibilities.
But working with a vintage, manual focus/manual aperture lens like this is a bit challenging. When stopped down, your viewfinder dims down. I was using f/11 for the above images (smaller f-stops are often needed with close-ups, because depth of field gets very shallow). But the dim viewfinder makes manual focusing difficult. In some situations, Live View can be used, with Exposure Simulation enabled, to brighten up the view and help with manual focus. However, that doesn't work very well with fast moving subjects like bees! I probably took 75 shots to get 2 or 3 good ones in focus, well posed and nicely composed, of the bee in the above shot. I was lucky it was working from flower to flower and gave me lots of opportunities.
Another thing that can help (and the reason the Adaptall mount I bought cost $40 instead of $25) is a "chipped" adapter. It has an electronic chip installed on the adapter, the main purpose of which is that it allows Canon Focus Confirmation to work (camera first needs to be set to One Shot and an AF point selected, while a native EF/EF-S lens is still installed). This gives a "beep" and a visual confirmation in the viewfinder when focus is achieved. It works well with manual focus lenses, until the lens aperture is stopped down a lot. With my lens set to f/11 for the shots above, it worked... although a bit slowly... and only because the subjects were in full sun. It probably wouldn't have worked in shade.
With adapted lenses like these, the camera can still work in Av (aperture priority) auto exposure mode... Or in M (fully manual) using the built in light meter to make settings. Metering is done "through the lens", so it takes into account manually stopped down aperture settings of the lens. It might also be possible to use M with Auto ISO... I've never tried it, but that's another auto exposure mode. Exposure Compensation also can be used with Av (and maybe with M w/Auto ISO). With a vintage, manual focus, manual aperture lens like this you CANNOT use any of the Scene modes, "A+", Tv (shutter priority AE) or P (program AE) modes with a lens like this. There's no way for the camera to control the lens aperture, which is necessary for all these exposure modes.
To summarize... first I'd recommend you get macro extension tubes. I learned to use them 25 or 30 years ago and have always had some in my camera bag ever since. I've used them on lenses from 20mm to 500mm, though most often on focal lengths from around 50mm to 135mm. Macro extension tubes are affordable, easy to use and can do a good job. Get them and start experimenting with them.
Also keep your eyes open for a good deal on a vintage macro lens, if interested. You'll need to learn what's most easily adapted for use on your DSLR... and what's not. Or you may need to watch for one with interchangeable mount that you can get to fit EOS/EF. I know T-mount and Adaptall mounts are widely avail.... some of the other, less common types may be too... I don't know. There's lots of info on the Internet about vintage macro lenses, which you might research, too. Some of those lenses from the 1960s, 70s and 80s are excellent and cheap compared to modern lenses.
There are also some relatively affordable modern, auto focus, electronic aperture macro lenses. The Tokina AT-X Pro 100mm f/2.8 sells new for around $350. The Canon EF-S 60mm f/2.8 USM is a little more. There also have been and still are several modern auto focus versions of the Tamron 90mm (descendants of the lens shown above, so to speak). My most-used macro lens is the Canon 100mm f/2.8 USM (not the more expensive L/IS version).... Canon's 100mm are the ONLY macro lenses around this focal length that can optionally be fitted with a tripod mounting ring, which is a very handy feature (Canon and other brands 150mm, 180mm and 200mm have tripod rings... So does Canon's MP-E 65mm macro, but that's an ultra high magnification lens and very specialized).
Personally I use the Canon 100mm, 180mm and MP-E 65mm macro lenses, in addition to the vintage manual focus Tamron shown above. I also have a modern Tamron SP 60mm f/2 macro, which is compact and takes place of several lenses (both macro & portrait) in my bag, when I don't know if I'll need macro. I also sometimes use a Canon 45mm Tilt-Shift lens for close up work. In the past I've used the 90mm Tilt-Shift, too, but don't currently have one. For shyer subjects I sometimes do close-ups with 300mm and 100-400mm telephotos, with macro extension tubes when the approx. 1/3 life size they are capable of isn't enough magnification.
There are LOTS of ways to "do macro" and close-ups!
Hope this helps!