ragon Loc: Wisconsin

Actually the win (with Donald Trump) is all of us in these great United States. MAGA

dennis2146 Loc: Eastern Idaho

Not much of a win considering it is Twardlow but I do appreciate the recognition. Ha.

Have a very Merry Christmas.

Dennis

yhtomit Loc: Port Land. Oregon

Happy Merry Dennis. Cheers.

letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.

The Dunning-Kruger effect can be simply stated as "you really do not know what you do not know".

robertjerl Loc: Corona, California

So ignorant they don't know they are ignorant.
or
" and unknown unknown"

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

It’s alright to attack each other if we look in a mirror while we do it?

Remember, I wasn’t “going at” Dennis—just the opposite.

Perhaps you didn’t read the post.

In other words, what the hell are you talking about?

robertjerl Loc: Corona, California

Oh, so insulting him and comparing his reasoning to a 6 year old isn't "going at" him?
Since when?
And you know very well the looking in the mirror is a reference to you doing many of the same things you accuse others/Dennis of doing.
But of course you are so intellectual and wise while the other are merely childish and well, not nearly as smart as you.

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

Heres what I said To Dennis: “Dennis, you’re not worth conversing with. Have a nice holiday.....”

Pretty weak tea in my book.

I did discuss his post with another, but that certainly isn’t “going at him.”

All in all, I thought it was pretty weak stuff.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

Well then, if you didn't see any value, I guess that takes care of that. Have you ever wondered why people don't just submit their ideas to you first? So much time could be saved.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

I can see the cause of your confusion. In the case of many who post here, that would indeed be an insult. Rather than me trying to tell you what to think, which I'm not going to do, and you wouldn't take kindly to, when you have some time read a series of posts from this person. You and I disagree a lot but you aren't a fool or a lunatic. In the attic it isn't safe to just assume that someone is functioning at higher than 6 year old level. I'm not asking you to take my word or Twardlow's word you aren't going to, and you probably shouldn't. Give the evidence a serious look for yourself. You may share his politics. I'm actually not sure as you surprise me often. You shouldn't let that influence you. You may decide not to comment out of civility. If you don't want to comment, don't, but do draw your own conclusion based on evidence, whether you comment or not.

letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.

Really thom, your posts are always laced with almost insults that walk back right away in the same sentence, it is becoming hard for a commoner like me to understand what you are trying to say.
Merry Christmas.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

Those aren't conclusions on your part, They are part of the definition.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

I have an agreement with a fellow "contributor" to this sight that limits what I can say. I don't think that was supposed to be about me. I suggested that Robert carefully evaluate and draw his own educated conclusion. I didn't suggest what his conclusion should be. You are free to do the same. I have no confidence as to what Robert will conclude. I do believe his finding, which I don't know if he will tell us, will be more impartial than yours is likely to be. I'm sure there is an insult in there if it's important to you for there to be one, but none is intended. While I believe I'm correct more often than Robert is (it's only reasonable that I would think that) I'm a little embarrassed to say it isn't uncommon for him to display more class than I do. I don't take that lightly and am constantly working on it.

robertjerl Loc: Corona, California

Actually I "unsubscribed" from the Attic because everything, even a discussion that is going well gets invaded and turned into an insult fest. So I am only here when a thread I got in on elsewhere gets transferred.

I am a conservative, but often a pragmatist and some things I believe in have been co-opted by the liberal/progressives. I also see that many don't really think things through before taking a stand one way or another.
One example - the DACA thing. During 34 years with Los Angeles Unified School District I had many of those kids brought here very young (some legal, some illegal) in my classes. Even the ones who called themselves Mexican most of the time were Americans, because that is how they were raised. Even the gang members, they were American gang members. Sending them to another country would be just like sending the kids I grew up with in Kentucky to another country. They would be foreigners there no matter what their appearance or their name was, ancestry or what languages besides English they spoke. One of my students, a Senior in High School went to Mexico to visit his Grandparents for Christmas which he hadn't done since he was four. When he came back he was very upset "Here they call me a wetback, my cousins were calling me a gringo! What am I?" I told him he was Juan Lopez (not his name), an American of Mexican ancestry whose future was his to make through education and hard work.
The last school I taught at there was not a day went by that we didn't have some former student(s) in Class A or Full Dress uniform proudly striding through the campus with a visitor's pass to visit his/her teachers or younger siblings and see the old school and be seen. Some of them were illegals who used phony ID to enlist (sometimes to get out of the gang life). They served, they fought, they bled, they died AS AMERICANS! Then they or others later appeared as new teachers or Peace Officers or some other service profession.

I once read an article that stated American is the only Nationality* that you could become after starting as something else because it was really an idea and way of thinking. There are other nations where people can be multi-generation born there and they are still not of that nationality/culture, forever outsiders.

My wife is Mexican-American, born in East LA. So my children are Americans who just happen to be half Mexican in ancestry.

*As opposed to being "citizens".

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

While it wasn't a direct response, I appreciate your post, which was, as always, thoughtful. I do question why, when a liberal agrees with you, you feel your idea has been co-opted. I think you leaving the attic is our loss, but I wouldn't dream of trying to talk you into returning. I don't understand you not referring to your kids as citizens. Maybe you will feel like explaining, maybe not. The part about former students bleeding and dying and returning went over my head.