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Are We Photographers?
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Aug 30, 2018 10:22:49   #
epd1947
 
safeman wrote:
Weird thoughts come to old people with too much time on their hands.

Should we continue to call ourselves photographers? Photographers record analog images on film, process and print the images creating photographs and if you are a professional sell these little pieces of reality as a source of income. I suggest that we have become collectors and manipulators of electrons. For many, if not most of us, the great majority of our electron collections remain just that--electrons. I sent my last roll of film in for processing and what did I get back, a link to a web site so I could retrieve my electron collections. I have begun thinking of my images stored on my computer as Electron Collections and the prints stored in my photo albums and files as pictures. Electron collections only become images when they are viewed or printed.

Before I change my mind I am going to send this and see what happens
Weird thoughts come to old people with too much ti... (show quote)


Why do you define photography in narrow terms? Why does it count as photography only when using film? Are we no longer drivers because we now drive cars with automatic transmissions where many decades ago you had to use a manual transmission? In the past novelists wrote using pad and pen, then typewriters - if someone today uses a computer and a word processing program are they no longer allowed to define themselves as novelists?

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Aug 30, 2018 10:40:37   #
Charles 46277 Loc: Fulton County, KY
 
Someone introduced Truman Capote as a writer once, and he said, "We don't write anymore--we type."
safeman wrote:
Weird thoughts come to old people with too much time on their hands.

Should we continue to call ourselves photographers? Photographers record analog images on film, process and print the images creating photographs and if you are a professional sell these little pieces of reality as a source of income. I suggest that we have become collectors and manipulators of electrons. For many, if not most of us, the great majority of our electron collections remain just that--electrons. I sent my last roll of film in for processing and what did I get back, a link to a web site so I could retrieve my electron collections. I have begun thinking of my images stored on my computer as Electron Collections and the prints stored in my photo albums and files as pictures. Electron collections only become images when they are viewed or printed.

Before I change my mind I am going to send this and see what happens
Weird thoughts come to old people with too much ti... (show quote)

Reply
Aug 30, 2018 11:16:01   #
bcrawf
 
Suzanne Caris wrote:
Wow, I feel the same way, just never had words that would explain how I felt about photography in general since the digital era took over. I grew up in the 80s to 90s and taking pictures of grand adventures was something that my best friend and I would do. It was important to us to have the prints and we would scrounge every penny we could find to get our pictures in our hands after all the hard work. We always had our cameras and if we developed without the other we insured to get "doubles" so we both would have the prize.

I followed suit with the digital era like most. I started out still needing prints but slowly faded out of the habit, "they are right here for free if i want to see." Over time I looked less and less and on a few occasions lost some dear memories from technical malfunction. I use to make damn sure all the prints were safe but let digital desensitize me to the point where images no longer carried the emotional impact like they did originally.

Recently, I submitted four images to a local jury show, and to my delight, every single one made the show. Two were analog and two were digital but they were all great in their own rights. My all time favorite analog won best of show. The image is great in technical terms, but it carries a deeper meaning and story for me than being just a cool print. As I type this, it occurs to me that, while I nervously paced the room on opening night I acknowledged my two 35mm analog prints and didn't hang around the digital much, they felt fake or insignificant, and I didn't want my face and name connected to "those" prints. (I didn't even bother to go see one of the two digital images) I didn't feel pride for "those" pictures, however great they really are. The prints on the other hand I pointed out and stood looking at them a little kinder.

Its just something odd that i noticed. I guess, as it turns out, I am digitally prejudice stemming from childhood experiences.
Wow, I feel the same way, just never had words tha... (show quote)


Well, Suzanne, we all change as we grow up, and the world changes as well. When we savor memories of things in our past, we usually do not consider whether we wish to actually return to the circumstances of the earlier events, or even to the key features of them. For example, for a 21-year-old, the novelty of an experience had as a child or teen cannot be recreated, even if now, in some degree, elements of an event are repeated. Much that was rare for us at earlier times is now commonplace (or at least more easily available) and, though we may value the current occurrence (a snapshot, an icecream cone, a movie, a weekend trip, a concert, and so on), we cannot repeat the earlier experience itself. As has been said, we cannot step into the same river again.

About your prints, perhaps a better digital printer should be used for prints for comparison with darkroom-printed ones.

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Aug 30, 2018 22:11:20   #
Murray Loc: New Westminster
 
I think the key words here are “record images”

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Aug 30, 2018 22:26:49   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
Suzanne Caris wrote:
Wow, I feel the same way, just never had words that would explain how I felt about photography in general since the digital era took over. I grew up in the 80s to 90s and taking pictures of grand adventures was something that my best friend and I would do. It was important to us to have the prints and we would scrounge every penny we could find to get our pictures in our hands after all the hard work. We always had our cameras and if we developed without the other we insured to get "doubles" so we both would have the prize.

I followed suit with the digital era like most. I started out still needing prints but slowly faded out of the habit, "they are right here for free if i want to see." Over time I looked less and less and on a few occasions lost some dear memories from technical malfunction. I use to make damn sure all the prints were safe but let digital desensitize me to the point where images no longer carried the emotional impact like they did originally.

Recently, I submitted four images to a local jury show, and to my delight, every single one made the show. Two were analog and two were digital but they were all great in their own rights. My all time favorite analog won best of show. The image is great in technical terms, but it carries a deeper meaning and story for me than being just a cool print. As I type this, it occurs to me that, while I nervously paced the room on opening night I acknowledged my two 35mm analog prints and didn't hang around the digital much, they felt fake or insignificant, and I didn't want my face and name connected to "those" prints. (I didn't even bother to go see one of the two digital images) I didn't feel pride for "those" pictures, however great they really are. The prints on the other hand I pointed out and stood looking at them a little kinder.

Its just something odd that i noticed. I guess, as it turns out, I am digitally prejudice stemming from childhood experiences.
Wow, I feel the same way, just never had words tha... (show quote)


I completely understand. I shoot film and digital. I took along a film camera for my 2017 US eclipse road trip intending to shoot mostly film. I got some great shoots of Antelope Island, Utah, but then the camera had a mechanical failure DURING the eclipse. Good thing I had my digital M43 camera for a backup! It saved that day and the rest of the trip.

This year I was on a hiking trip and again, with a repaired film camera, I shot film and digital. I found that my film pics had a much higher keeper rate, and I had one 5-star pic, it was shot on film. Various reasons for that. One being that I take more time with film. (And is taking more time a bad thing for a hobbyist? After all life is fast paced and our hobbies give us some relief from that.) Another reason is that film records light very differently from a digital sensor.

I had the same shot on digital, and showing it to different people some liked the film version some liked the digital version. ME the “artist”, the creator, likes the film version better.

So it’s all very subjective but what **you** like is the important thing. You like film, then shoot more film. I plan to do that myself.

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Aug 30, 2018 23:47:57   #
SteveR Loc: Michigan
 
JD750 wrote:
I completely understand. I shoot film and digital. I took along a film camera for my 2017 US eclipse road trip intending to shoot mostly film. I got some great shoots of Antelope Island, Utah, but then the camera had a mechanical failure DURING the eclipse. Good thing I had my digital M43 camera for a backup! It saved that day and the rest of the trip.

This year I was on a hiking trip and again, with a repaired film camera, I shot film and digital. I found that my film pics had a much higher keeper rate, and I had one 5-star pic, it was shot on film. Various reasons for that. One being that I take more time with film. (And is taking more time a bad thing for a hobbyist? After all life is fast paced and our hobbies give us some relief from that.) Another reason is that film records light very differently from a digital sensor.

I had the same shot on digital, and showing it to different people some liked the film version some liked the digital version. ME the “artist”, the creator, likes the film version better.

So it’s all very subjective but what **you** like is the important thing. You like film, then shoot more film. I plan to do that myself.
I completely understand. I shoot film and digital.... (show quote)


One of the disadvantages of film is the cost, which is why digital is so popular. I have to agree with you. If I could do everything in film I would, but can't afford to take the number of photos in film that I can digitally. The sharpest photos I ever took were with my Yashica medium format.

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Aug 31, 2018 00:46:44   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
SteveR wrote:
One of the disadvantages of film is the cost, which is why digital is so popular. I have to agree with you. If I could do everything in film I would, but can't afford to take the number of photos in film that I can digitally. The sharpest photos I ever took were with my Yashica medium format.


Yes it is definitely more expensive. And that is what forces me to take more time when shooting film. That and the delayed gratifacition of seeing the result. I defintely feel more proud of a great film pic than a great dig pic.

But digital is the future and I embrace that too. For a pro digital is a slam dunk because it is faster and time = money. But since photography is my creative outlet, my passion, not my profession, I can afford the time to shoot film.

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Aug 31, 2018 06:55:21   #
mgoldfield
 
safeman wrote:
Weird thoughts come to old people with too much time on their hands.

Should we continue to call ourselves photographers? Photographers record analog images on film, process and print the images creating photographs and if you are a professional sell these little pieces of reality as a source of income. I suggest that we have become collectors and manipulators of electrons. For many, if not most of us, the great majority of our electron collections remain just that--electrons. I sent my last roll of film in for processing and what did I get back, a link to a web site so I could retrieve my electron collections. I have begun thinking of my images stored on my computer as Electron Collections and the prints stored in my photo albums and files as pictures. Electron collections only become images when they are viewed or printed.

Before I change my mind I am going to send this and see what happens
Weird thoughts come to old people with too much ti... (show quote)

Wow!

You think too much, my friend!

A photograph is a photograph whether it is made by exposing film or a
digital sensor, and people who take photographs are photographers.

Perhaps you have too much time on your hands.

Happy Shooting!

M. Goldfield

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Aug 31, 2018 13:13:35   #
Charles 46277 Loc: Fulton County, KY
 
I was never happy with a 35mm camera--my first medium format was the Yashicamat twin lens--it was an awakening and a revelation, especially in the darkroom as I raised the negative and the image was still good. I wonder how many high school yearbooks were made with that camera!
SteveR wrote:
One of the disadvantages of film is the cost, which is why digital is so popular. I have to agree with you. If I could do everything in film I would, but can't afford to take the number of photos in film that I can digitally. The sharpest photos I ever took were with my Yashica medium format.

Reply
Aug 31, 2018 13:49:17   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
Charles 46277 wrote:
I was never happy with a 35mm camera--my first medium format was the Yashicamat twin lens--it was an awakening and a revelation, especially in the darkroom as I raised the negative and the image was still good. I wonder how many high school yearbooks were made with that camera!


Many. But many more were made with 35mm SLRs.

I had a Yashicamat 124G for awhile. It was okay, but my Nikon FTn was more comfortable.

I worked for Delmar, Herff Jones, and Lifetouch from 1979-2012. At Delmar, I was a multi-image AV producer. I taught student photographers at summer yearbook workshops, and was a candid photographer for some prima donna house accounts with All-American award winners. I miss those days. But I don’t miss film.

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Aug 31, 2018 15:40:02   #
SierraP Loc: Eastern Sierras
 
I agree. I had a Yashica 124G and loved it. A pro photographer I once knew. Worked out of Los Angeles. He had over six Yaschicas. He would load all of them and start shooting. One after another. This is in the days when Hassies were king.He was in great demand.

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Aug 31, 2018 16:04:50   #
d2b2 Loc: Catonsville, Maryland, USA
 
I had a Mamiya C22 TLR. Great camera! I donated it to the Crime Lab at the Maryland State Police. I am certain it got great use there as well, because it was a tank!

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Aug 31, 2018 16:21:33   #
Charles 46277 Loc: Fulton County, KY
 
Recently I found a drawer of Mamiya twin lens cameras and lenses from long ago--I tried a roll of b/w film to test one and here are a couple of takes. I just guessed the exposure without metering, from my bedroom deck. The picture of the pots shows how the parallax indicator worked--they would have been outside the picture if I went by the viewing lens without correction indicated by the red pointer.
SierraP wrote:
I agree. I had a Yashica 124G and loved it. A pro photographer I once knew. Worked out of Los Angeles. He had over six Yaschicas. He would load all of them and start shooting. One after another. This is in the days when Hassies were king.He was in great demand.


(Download)


(Download)

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Aug 31, 2018 16:32:35   #
Strodav Loc: Houston, Tx
 
Webster's definition of photographer
: one who practices photography; especially : one who makes a business of taking photographs

Webster's Definition of photography
: the art or process of producing images by the action of radiant energy and especially light on a sensitive surface (such as film or an optical sensor)


The camera, and the technology behind it, is just a tool. Apply any adjectives you want, but I for one, think we are still photographers.

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Aug 31, 2018 17:06:40   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
Strodav wrote:
Webster's definition of photographer
: one who practices photography; especially : one who makes a business of taking photographs

Webster's Definition of photography
: the art or process of producing images by the action of radiant energy and especially light on a sensitive surface (such as film or an optical sensor)


The camera, and the technology behind it, is just a tool. Apply any adjectives you want, but I for one, think we are still photographers.


Language is a living, breathing entity. Webster needs to revise this definition, and thousands of others! There are better online dictionaries you can access via smartphones.

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