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Photographer's rights.
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Aug 2, 2018 08:52:34   #
tdekany Loc: Oregon
 
johnbhome2 wrote:
I even read a post from Homeland Security asking folks if they see someone photographing monuments and such to report said photographers as they might be terrorists. What a world we live in!!!!!!!


At some point in the future, the name United States Of America needs to be replaced with United Gestapo Of America. People of this beautiful country are indeed sheeps.

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Aug 2, 2018 08:55:46   #
johnbhome2 Loc: Wyoming, Michigan
 
You are welcome! As for misinformation perhaps, but for me I abhor screaming meemees and violence. It isn't worth it for a picture. I will look for that info from Homeland security. That was not misinformation. Good luck and God bless.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:02:29   #
Jeffcs Loc: Myrtle Beach South Carolina
 
Second hand story but true no the less, my brother was on public beach in Ocean City NJ photographing HIS kids playing in the surf. A woman went to the life guard stand and informed the guard that “a pervert” was photographing children on the beach. They called the Ocean City police whom escorted my brother off the beach. He showed the officers the pictures on his camera and to prove that they are his children he showed the police his wallet with portraits of his kids. Meanwhile his children were on the beach unsupervised by a parent. My brother after his time with the police went right back shooting! He was really upset and almost went home but decided to shoot instead to show everyone including his accuser all was well.
I’ve been cautious ever since...

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Aug 2, 2018 09:12:22   #
billnourse Loc: Bloomfield, NM
 
camerapapi wrote:
As of lately, especially in public places, I find more and more people complaining that their picture is being made without consulting them. A few days ago I was shooting at a local park and all of a sudden a woman began to shout at me saying that I had photographed her child without her permission. My explanations about shooting in a public place plus my explanations that I was not shooting persons or children (shooting children without parent's consent is a felony in Dade County) did not convince her agitated attitude. She threatened me with a call to the police. I showed her the picture in question, taken with a wide angle and her child was not visible but I deleted the shot in front of her. That did not make her any happier but she did not call the police.

I like to go to local parks and photograph the scenery, not the persons there but this incident has been kind of traumatic to me since I treated the young lady with respect but she did not act the same way with me. Had she call the police it would have been hard for me to explain my rights and I know it is illegal to photograph children without parent's consent. I think I acted as a decent human being but I do not want this to happen to me again.

So, which are my rights?
As of lately, especially in public places, I find ... (show quote)


I briefly scanned Dade County laws and could not find anything about photography. Do you happen to know the statute? My experience has been that local law does not rise to the level of a felony in most states. In NM any felony is going to be a violation of state or federal law, not local ordinance and is prosecuted either by a district attorney or a U. S. attorney.

It seems that such a law would eliminate almost any shooting in public places, as there are children everywhere and any shot you take in public could capture a child, intentional or not.

Bill

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Aug 2, 2018 09:15:14   #
epd1947
 
Hassie wrote:
I recently had a school principal stop me from taking pictures of my grandson at a school function outside as many parents have complained about their children being photographed without any approval. She told me that this policy was explained in the school booklet, but since I didn't receive this info, I stopped the photo'ing.
One of the reasons she gave was that some single parents may have moved to avoid being attacked by their significant other and they didn't want their location known.


This is a bit different than the photographing in the park scenario - while members of the public are often allowed access to school grounds and buildings (maybe attending a school play or a concert or sporting event) you most often need specific permission to be there. Pretty much all schools will require, for example, that visitors go to the main office for such permission - This is similar in some ways to shooting in a mall - the mall is open to the public but is not really public property - so whoever is in charge of the facility can set the rules and can rule out the taking of photos.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:21:50   #
Country Boy Loc: Beckley, WV
 
Interesting topic. That is why I retired and moved back to West Virginia. I get mobbed also at times but mostly by people saying "mister, take my picture too!". On the original thread, I think I would have been tempted to turn and take a photo of the complaining lady and tell her it was taken for evidence so you will remember her when we get to court! Actually I would delete any photo that offended someone. That said, although there is no privacy in a public place should someone be taking photos of a child where the child was the main focus (just the child) that would be questionable. If it is just a child in a random photo, there should never be a problem.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:22:06   #
SaratogaMan
 
Aside from our right to shoot photos in public places, it is understandable that a parent or guardian might be apprehensive and jump to conclusions about an adult stranger (especially if it's a male) taking photos of kids in any setting. It is perfectly natural to be protective of the children...regardless of our rights. Put yourself in their shoes, for a moment.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:23:27   #
Tomcat5133 Loc: Gladwyne PA
 
I think this incident in the park is a bigger issue then talked about so far. We all read and saw movies about "Big Brother"
And the observation of everything we do. We are in a hysterical society brought on by media and movies and people who want to
tell others what to do.
I live near the beach in FL. I go to the beach often with friends and myself on my bike etc. I take less images because of the looks when I take out a camera the looks more professional then an iPhone. We find everything we do is being monitored online and we did not give permission
for that to happen. It creates fear and a lack of friendship and community in our lives. We will now pass on this fear to our children to
carry into the generation. London has camera's on every street. Comcast just insisted that a swap out our modem they supply with
another one just like it. Comcast like many companies is recording and storing all out moves online and purchases and even family structure.
Facebook and Google have sold so much of our private lives I wonder if we will ever have the life we had.



I don't shoot girls or children in my travels. But have on a holiday sunday on the broad walk I like to take images and video
as a people watcher. Not sure how much I will do this anymore.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:24:37   #
Skiextreme2 Loc: Northwest MA
 
camerapapi wrote:
"I am offended and demand that you not include me in this thread." I am sorry, I do not understand. If you are referring to me I have not included anyone except for the woman that confronted me and I do not believe you are that woman.

Bob it is a tough call for me because I have not been involved with such an incident for a long time and when I did it was because the local authorities had their rules considering a photographer with a tripod as a professional that should be paying dues to the city for photographing in a park. I got in touch with local authorities and that was cleared for me.

It is true that in a public place there is no privacy but to what extent we can photograph without having an incident such as mine I do not really know. I can also understand that with this kind of people any explanations go nowhere and that was exactly what happened to me. The woman kept on threatening me in spite of my soft and decent treatment toward her.

"I would've just told her to go ahead and call the police. After awhile you get tired of all the B.S." I agree with you but there are times when you have to use some judgment. There were children there, I did not aim my camera to them since I knew that was illegal here in Miami-Dade County. Since the woman was in such an attitude I deleted the picture (her son was not in it) and not very happy she walked away.

With street photography I have not had an incident but a very good friend of mine did to the point that the person discussing with him wanted to attack him. I witness the whole ordeal and believe me, it made me think about street photography twice.

We are living in a world where respect and decency are falling apart. Courtesy is practically gone and I find more and more aggressive persons on the streets ready for a fight regardless if they are right or not.
Thank you gentlemen for your input.
"I am offended and demand that you not includ... (show quote)


This is a big part of why I prefer to photograph animals or motorsports racing.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:25:05   #
epd1947
 
Jaackil wrote:
You are wrong it is not a felony to photograph a child in a public place with out a parents consent in Dade County as long as Dade county is still in the United States. I am not saying that Dade doesn’t have some type of ordinance to this effect but under federal law it is not enforceable
This topic has come up over and over. In the United States there is no expectation of privacy in public spaces or privately owned spaces generally regarded as open to the public such as a mall or stadium. You may photograph any one or anything without needing permission provided you do not use the images for comercial purposes. Comercial is defined as using to advertise or promote. So according to the law you can take a picture of a child in a public place and even sell it provided the image is not used to advertise or promote anything. The public space is extended to private areas viewed easily from public areas. So if Jennifer Aniston is standing Naked in the window of her home and you are walking by her house and see her from the sidewalk and take a picture from the sidewalk you might just have a million dollar pic to sell and you do not need permission. The onus is on her at that point. However You may not cross onto her property and take a picture through the window of her or say climb a tree to get a view not normally available from a public area that would not be legal.

Some of what you say is true - however, I think that you are off the mark regarding private property which allows public access - like a store, mall, sports stadium, concert venue, etc. Let's take a Starbucks location - you go into that coffee shop and start taking photos - the manager comes over to you and tells you that you must stop because, for example, other patrons have complained - you woulld be required to stop tking pictures in that case. If you failed to do so, the manager could ask you to leave the premises - if you refuse to do so the police might well be called and if you still refused to leave an arrest for trespass would be a distinct possibility. The same situation could occur in a mall. As far as pubic venues like a theater - many times cameras are banned entirely from concerts.

If you are going to use an image for comercial purposes you must obtain written consent to use that image. You do not need the consent to take the picture only to use it for comercial purposes. So let’s say you take a picture of a child drinking from a can of coke and the brand is clearly visible. You may sell that picture as art as long as it was taken in a public place. however if you want to sell the image to Coke for an advertising campaign you will need a release from the subject or their legal guardian. Let’s say that public place is a sports stadium and you sell it to them for them to use in some form of ad a realesse is needed from the subject and from Coke

If you are photographing in public areas you need to know your rights and they are pretty broad in scope. If in a public place and not used for comercial purposes as defined by law you may shoot without needing permission period. This is theblaw in the United States. I am only stating what the law is. What is moral or ethical is left to your own opinion.
You are wrong it is not a felony to photograph a c... (show quote)

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Aug 2, 2018 09:28:03   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
A number of years back a group of us would meet at a beach early in the morning (before it really opened) to photograph birds. The cop on patrol had no problem. Then he stopped by one morning to tell us the town passed a regulation banning photography at the beach. He apologized and assured us that we were not the issue but we had to stop.

A member went to town hall with the so called "Photographer's Bill of Rights" in hand and went over it with the town attorney, pointing out there is no expectation of privacy at the beach. The real problem was people taking cell phone pictures in the locker rooms and posting them online.

Within a week we were back on the beach and 'No Photography' signs were posted in and around the locker rooms. The local cop said he was glad to see us back.

Sometimes people do the wrong things for the right reason. Intelligent ones will listen and learn.

---

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Aug 2, 2018 09:29:44   #
Charlie'smom
 
I go to parks regularly to shoot flowers, ponds, and people. Sometimes children have been in my shots. Of course I’m a 65 year old woman and not seen as a threat i.e. pervert. No one has ever given me a second thought. I guess this is an instance of reverse sexism.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:33:38   #
Nuclear13 Loc: North Lauderdale, Florida
 
Bill. A few years ago I was in Texas for my nieces 50th birthday party. I decided to go to the Dallas Zoo. In the petting area their was a little girl about 4 years old petting a goat. She looked so cute petting the animal. Instead of just taking the picture I asked her parents first. They said, Sure, no problem". I'm so glad I did ask. Avoids trouble because of all the sick people in the world today. For some reason the picture won't attach. I'll email it to you. Michael

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Aug 2, 2018 09:37:57   #
markie1425 Loc: Bryn Mawr, PA
 
rpavich wrote:
Wow...what kind of area do you live in?

Run or carry a pistol if you fear for your life.


I live in the downtown area of a major US City.

I don't fear for my life.

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Aug 2, 2018 09:47:43   #
rabbitslayer Loc: NW Iowa
 
Right or wrong, with all the trafficking going on I would respect the parents demands. If I see a stranger obviously taking pics. of my grandchildren it would not go well with them. The difference in determining accidental and on purpose is a fine line.

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