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Right to Photograph a child in a Public Place
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Aug 20, 2017 09:29:04   #
JohnSwanda Loc: San Francisco
 
Notorious T.O.D. wrote:
Then, Is a Newspaper not a commercial use....

Best,
Todd Ferguson


No, a newspaper is considered editorial use.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:29:11   #
tmac Loc: Northern Kentucky
 
I work with families with children with special needs. Frequently I work with families fostering or going through the process to adopt. The children they are fostering have been abused in many different ways. The bio-parents don't know who has the kids, but sometimes live in the same county or a nearby county. These foster/adoptive parents don't want pics taken of their kids, especially that may show their location and be published. And they don't want to have to explain in front of the kid 'bio dad abused them and may come after us to get them back if he knows where they are'. With first hand knowledge of situations like this, I would delete when asked.
And people posting about the older photographers of kids in France or the girl with the grenade-did her parents ask that the photo not be kept??? That's the key to this for me, especially as a mom: mom requested that he delete the photo. We don't know what has happened or is going on in someone's life.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:32:53   #
Japakomom Loc: Originally from the Last Frontier
 
I have not read through all the posts, so this might be a repeat. Legal or not, the mother asked you to delete a picture of her child, the best thing to do in that case is to delete the picture. There is no reason for the police to get involved, whether you were in the right or wrong, you should have just dealt with the mothers' request and deleted the picture. We never know what the parents reasons may be, but they obviously have them.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:33:46   #
Mary Kate Loc: NYC
 
Tet68survivor wrote:
I do know that any photo competition I have entered required a signed release form from the parents! So I am going to say (sadly because of idiots who want to do harm) that you are in the wrong! Not that you are, it's just the way you have to deal with Snowflakes, Parents, Cops, Judges! As great a man you may be, just delete it and tell the kid to get the hell out of the way, your trying to take a picture, oh heck that won't work either, you swore at the little poor child who most likely gears the 'F" word 500 times a day! It's a sad World we live in, very sad! Just a note, I carry release forms with me just in case, but they can still say no!
I do know that any photo competition I have entere... (show quote)


In what category of "Snowflakes, Parents, Cops, and Judges" do you feel superior to? When did the personal desire to take picture trump all things? How is everyone else who disagrees with you is somehow held up to your pathetic assesments?

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Aug 20, 2017 09:33:54   #
Spirit Vision Photography Loc: Behind a Camera.
 
I am not sure what country you were in. But in the United States, you were within your legal rights to photograph just about anything you wish in a public setting. This has happened to me before. The police have no authority to arrest you or delete your photo. In both cases, I refused to hand over my film and the police knew that I was aware of the law. I was allowed to go on my way without handing over my film. If you are aware of the law, they will not try any intimidation actions. In these days and times, I understand why parents are paranoid. But it was their choice to go public with their children. I have on a few occasions, handed out my business card to the parents, saying that I would gladly send them a print or a duplicate file. This approach has always been met with a positive response.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:36:00   #
gvarner Loc: Central Oregon Coast
 
I was taking pics of my great grandson at a playground full of kids on his birthday. Some guy mumbled something about taking the pics so I told him it was for the birthday party. He dropped it. All the other kids were just incidental subjects to me. Got a great shot of our little boy leaping off the end of the slide. What a ham.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:36:28   #
Spirit Vision Photography Loc: Behind a Camera.
 
http://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdf

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Aug 20, 2017 09:38:51   #
Zazzy1 Loc: Northern Ca.
 
I rarely shoot children. When I have I ask the parent first if they say yes I get their email and send them a copy.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:39:28   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
Gene,

You are right the world has changed and continues to change. Everyone has a camera and a video camera in their hand or pocket. But if you have been around for a few decades you may remember that the entrance ramps to interstate highways used to have yield signs...but no longer do. People run stop signs and red lights because they know their chance of being caught is generally very very low. I think in many cases no fault insurance contributes to this too... When was the last time you saw anyone get a ticket for illegally parking in a handicap parking space... I am 56 and I have never seen that happen. Too many unenforceable laws that not enforced or used to intimidate and coerce people into certain behaviors. What a wonderful wonderful world.

Best,
Todd Ferguson

Gene51 wrote:
There are too many people in this country that believe to their core that their right to something trumps anyone else's right - then the start bullying you if you disagree . . . If some photographer invades my space with his camera and I am not comfortable, I am entitled to my sense of safety, even if I am in a public space. He has a choice - he can produce a real model release, not a slip of paper with a single sentence that somehow indicates my consent, and offer me some form of compensation. I am not looking to make money, but it does speak to the legitimacy and professionalism of the guy with the camera. I would probably tell the guy to keep his offer of compensation. The point is that far too many people believe that society is the same as it was when the old photographers were running around with cameras snapping candids of random people. Sadly it isn't. And they need to adjust. Insisting you have the "right" to take a picture is the same as insisting you have the "right of way" in a traffic accident. The judge will laugh, and tell you it was your responsibility to YIELD the right of way and likely charge you with failing to yield the right of way. It's not about who's right and who's wrong - it's all about common sense and courtesy.
There are too many people in this country that bel... (show quote)

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Aug 20, 2017 09:41:57   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
David Kay wrote:
What has not been divulged, is what would they arrest the photographer for? It would be interesting to hear that.

Also, everyone here is giving legal advic
e and I see that no one has JD after their name. The OP should have consulted with his atty instead of asking a bunch of lay people here.


But then we wouldn't get to see how divided we are on even a small issue...

Best,
Todd Ferguson

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Aug 20, 2017 09:42:38   #
d3200prime
 
It is really amazing how one person can create such a clamor about a one-sided story. We only have the photographers claim of how this event unfolded. That mother, I am sure, would tell her side differently. The truth is somewhere between his side and her side. The law is the law like it or not. We do not know the law but only express opinions and that is fine but will never solve anything. We need the facts to, imho, even begin intelligent, rational discussion concerning the events of that day. However, I did enjoy the feisty rhetoric. So hoggish. So I have no input to give other than I agree with all those who gave advice to get the real law on the books both state and federal and go by them when shooting out and about.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:46:21   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
Noj Refifp wrote:
Common, are you not sensitive with what has been happening in our country. Go look on a milk carton or the posters on a telephone poll, Amber alerts on your phone. Your rights are secondary to common sense, a photo contest yikes.


Whose common sense? Yours, mine or the masses? Are you really willing to give up your rights to the sense of the masses? That is a very slippery slope and an affront to all who have served, fought and died to protect your rights.

On a lighter note should we put the pictures of missing men on beer cans?

Best,
Todd Ferguson

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Aug 20, 2017 09:48:38   #
kndubois
 
Interesting discussion. Rights versus ethics. One must consider the end results before exercising their rights. For example, what could be the consequences for the photographer if the parent were to take their photo and post it on social media with the comment that the photographer was going around taking photos of children without the parents consent. The implication could be they were pedophiles. Was anybody in the wrong? Probably not, but it could ruin a persons reputation. It may be best to err on the side of caution.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:49:37   #
Leon S Loc: Minnesota
 
Why in the hell would you want to make such as ass of yourself by not complying with the mother's request. I have never shot a child without the guardian's permission. I do professional work on occasion, so my work is pretty good, but nothing I've ever done is worth offending a mother.

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Aug 20, 2017 09:52:55   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
DELTA777 wrote:
If you don't know it that picture is not totally deleted you can get a picture rescue from Lear or SanDisk


EXACTLY...

Or you could have multiple cards in the camera or have taken 14 shots in a second or two... The average cop or person on the street doesn't understand the technology. I suspect if the photographer wanted to they could not even use the card, but instead wirelessly transmit the photo to a remote laptop or other device.

Best,
Todd Ferguson

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