bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

I understand your venting, but I've been at this for 30 years, and have found that if you are polite but direct, it's not an issue. It doesn't matter if it's ethnic or causation, wedding photography is equal parts photography, and human psychology. I'm not about to try to talk anyone into doing a job they hate, but to disparage a whole industry, because one can't communicate effectively with guests is kind of poor form.

Why not embrace it? This weekend, I did a wedding where they had a really nice sign that said something along the lines of: "we want to see your smiling faces, not your devices, our photographer is wonderful and eager to share" I have a photo of a guy standing right beside the sign, with his iPhone out. In my opinion, it took something that would tick off a lot of people, and made a pretty cute photo that is going in their album.

pithydoug Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY

I reluctantly played second camera a few times early on. It was enough to convince me I never wanted to do it for a living. My patience level was limited to cooperative people.

Donkas1946 Loc: Southern NH

It is not the job of the professional photographer to keep the guests happy. It is his job to keep the bride and groom happy as they are paying for the service. Geeze I can't beleive someone actually posted this!

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

Hi gang!

What I am about to write may be disagreeable to some of the folks here. It is not necessarily directed, as an admonishment or a harsh criticism of the original poster nor is it directed at any truly professional and experienced wedding photographer because they would already know what I have to say. It is intended for anyone who is contemplating or aspiring to a career as a part or full time wedding PROFESSIONAL photographer or anyone who is interested in the real workings of a wedding photography enterprise.

Wedding photography is not a job for the faint of heart, the overly sensitive, impatient or egocentric individual, Nor is it s suitable endeavor for a casual amateur or someone who just likes to dabble in photography. It is a profession that requires a multitude of technical, artistic and creative skill sets as well as generous helping of PEOPLE SKILLS. Patience, compassion and dedication are not merely virtues- they are mandatory traits for this vocation!

When you are CONTRACTED as the official professional wedding photographer, you are undertaking a responsibility to, at the very least, deliver a comprehensive visual record of the event- end to end. If you represent yourself as a real PROFESSIONAL there is also an expectation, on the part of your clients, that you work will be of a quality, technically and artistically, that is far superior to what an amateur or non-professional guest at a wedding can produce. You are being entrusted with what is oftentimes a once-in-a-lifetime sacred family event- there are no re-takes! If you fail to deliver, not only re you going to seriously mar your reputation but you can end up defending yourself against a devastating lawsuit. That has happened- there are case studies and jurisprudence out there and you don't wanna know the punitive compensations that the courts have awarded! Tens of thousands of dollars!

So..having said all of this, let me cut to the chase. Walking off the job and returning the check is a giant NO-NO! That's plain language- no legal jargon! I ain't a lawyer but it's called non-performance and breach of contract- ALL BAD! Even verbal contracts can hold up in court. In the case of the OP, the client was gracious and let the matter go. Most folks, however, may not be all that forgiving and you can bet that there are gonna be some nasty ramifications and very unpleasant consequences. Unless your life and limb are endangered, you have business to hang tight, regardless of difficulties, and get the job done- bruised egos don't qualify as endangerment.

The most important adage to remember is that an ounce of PREVENTION is worth more than a POUND of cure. One of the most important aspects of PROFESSIONALISM in wedding photography is careful and precise advance planning with the bride and groom. In our contract, there are certain restriction as the activities of amateur photographers. Realistically speaking, I don't wanna be some kind of dictator or wedding bogyman that is going to deprive the guest of their enjoyment with their cameras and i-phones, but there has to be a reasonable balance. Some brides simply, as others here have alluded to, simply inform folks to leave their cameras at home. Some restrict cameras and telephone devices in the church or ceremony venue- to maintain decorum and sanctity of the occasion. Only the hired pro is allowed to shoot! We do not allow guests to work over our shoulder at formal sessions Oftentimes we have a very time-limited widow of opportunity to get in all the formals and groups so we can't have folks distracting the attention of the wedding party.

So...how do we enlist the cooperation of the clients? You may ask. We carefully and gently explain that we want all of their guest to fully enjoy the wedding and if their personal photography is part of that enjoyment- we fully understand. There are times, HOWEVER, during the event, if the amateur PAPARAZZI is all over the place, that would be detrimental to their professional photographic coverage and could also wreak havoc on the decorum of the ceremony. Guess-what- FOLKS GET IT! If you don't plan carefully and enlist cooperation, you are waling into a minefield- a booby trap of you own making!

Then there is the issue of MONEY. Charging a healthy fee for your services is the greatest deterrent to poor cooperation. I am not here to boast but the tinniest coverage I offer is over $3,000. Most of \my contracts, nowadays, hoover around the $5.500, mark . Some of the BIG jobs go higher! We advise people not to “sabotage” their own investment in their own photographer- it defies common sense. They usually get that too!

Gotta tell y'all- most of the wedding I photograph go down without a hitch. Most folks are nice and cooperative but there is always MURPHY'S LAW hanging in there like the Sword of Democles! Admittedly, we do remember the BAD ones! The difference between a rank amateur and a true pro is the ability to work around difficulties. I have covered weddings where the dance floor was more like a Rugby match- I had to work from a stepladder to shoot over the rioting guest and yes- the amateur Paparazzi! Ethnic weddings?- I have seen jut about ALL there is to see! There can be cultural and religious goings on that can be tumultuous- to say the least. We know exactly what to expect and manage the situations accordingly.

I have been at this for over 50 years and have chalked up literally thousands of weddings. In all that experience there were only 2 really memorable major drunken brawls/fist fights, 1 summoning of the police, 1 appearance of the riot-squad, 4 visits from the paramedics, 2 calls to the fire department and 3 unfortunate responses from the coroner's office. I won't burden y'all with gory details! I have NEVER walked off a job without completing it!

What I want any of the new or aspiring professionals to take away from this post is an understanding of the responsibilities, both legally and ethically, that professional wedding photography entails. Whether you are a full or part time pro, a rookie or a experienced veteran, when you are out there on the job, people are counting on you, they have entrusted you with a major task, you are the PRO and you must remain in charge of your part of the occasion. This is why I always emphasize the word “PROFESSIONAL”. True professionalism goes way beyond charging a fee and collecting money- obviously that an important part of the definition. More importantly, however, performance, dedication, artistry, creativity, competency and appropriate conduct is what should better define the job.

Walking away from the job and handing the responsibility over to the cell-phone folks adds new meaning to the word “counterproductive”!

With good intentions and kindest regards, Ed

pithydoug Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY

Well said!!!!

Lemon Drop Kid Loc: Greeley, CO

I shot more than 500 weddings over a 14-year period. At the formals shooting, I would announce to the gathered shooters to please allow me to get my shots of each pose first, and then I would get out of their way. That always -- and I mean always -- worked fine for everybody. I figured I gave a little, and gained a lot. But, admittedly, this was before the iphones invasion.

Bill P

IMO, by giving the check back you're depriving the bride the benefits of your work because of the behavior of the guests.

But really, what was he to do? Keep the check and give them photos of the wedding where the couple is obscured by stupid guests? The whole point of his post is that he had NOTHING to give them. So he did the right thing and refunded the money. We can only hope that when aunt Minnie and Cousin Doofus ask to see the photos, the couple will say, we didn't get any cause all you fools were in the way.

It would seem we are coming to the day when a Taser will be a necessary part of every photographer's equipment.

advocate1982

You missed the entire point - he gave the money back, because he wasn't able to get any decent shots because of the guests getting in the way. Today it seems, everybody that has a smart phone thinks that they are a photographer, and seem to think that getting in everybody's way, and everybody's face is the way to get "THE SHOT". When I shot weddings, if I had a guest that was being a pain, I would have a talk with the Bride, and have her do something about it because that is about the only person that they will listen to. I've been at weddings where the priest says no flash photography during the ceremony, and there seems to be 100 guests with their smart phones out and the flashes are going off everywhere.

I belive that the only way to deal with this today, is that everybody that is not the official photographer is required to check their phones/cameras at the door. If the bride wants you to have photos, then she will send you some from the hired photographer.

TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC

Excellent. 👏👏👏👏

BebuLamar

I do know about couples who don't care about the people they invited but most would invite those they care about and really don't want to offend them either.

NJphotodoc Loc: Now in the First State

When I was younger, I worked with professionals as an assistant and then do some weddings and similar events on my own mostly for friends and family. I stopped when I realized that folks are often too arrogant to realize that the family wants well composed photos but the guests simply want to muscle in to get "their picture". One guest even went so far as to move my equipment (in this case lights) because it was interfering with his pictures. Then there was the guest who took my stepstool and started walking around the venue and wouldn't give it back. That's when I realized it wasn't worth chest pain I was getting.

I still do get asked to take pictures at events such as holiday events and parties where fortunately for me, people are more concerned with having a good time rather then pulling out their Iphones and clicking away. No, you can't change human nature, but at least I can decide what works best for me.

PGHphoto Loc: Pittsburgh, PA

Very well said !

74images Loc: Los Angeles, California

You Feel Bad For the Wedding Photographers Cause if the Job they Have to do, & the S**T Problems that come with it cause Other People Get in the Way of the Photographers Job to Get the Bride & Grooms Special Day.

I'm a Amateur Advance Photographer & if I'm a a Wedding I keep a Low Profile with Me & MY Cameras, let the Photographer Do His GODDAMN Job Cause He's Getting "PAID" for His Job, Not Me, or Ma, or Auntie or Uncle Jim, Cousin Joe, Grandma Jane, Etc, Etc, & People don't Understand, & Don't Care to Understand the Wedding Photographers Stressful Job!

sploppert Loc: Rochester, NY

Well said, read my earlier post. I too was a Profressional Wedding Photographer for over 45 years and over 3500 weddings before I retired. I would inform the couple from the very begining of signing the of the contract that I would make sure of just what the bridal couple wanted in thier coverage and would make a list of the photographs that wanted. I would explain that at the church formals I was to be the only photographer which was also in my contract. Now I would allow people to take photos as long as they didn't get in my way, I also had permission from the bridal couple if things got out of hand They would allow me to stand on the alter with them and tell the guest to put their cameras away and the couple would always think that was a good idea. This not only would kept them in the good gracess of there guests but made me the heavy.
I didn't have to do that often but it worked. I would also tell the guest that they were welcome to take as many photos they wanted if time allowed after I was finished. This worked out well for all concerned. A trick that I would use was to tell the bridal party and family members was to exit the church and come back in through a back door or to go into a dressing room until the church was empty and would call them back in. Out of sight out of mind. I always would take the parents and family members photos first and tell them they could leave and entertain the guest so they didn't feel slighted while I finshed up. This accomplished 2 things first less people in the church causing distractions and no one shooting over my shoulder. This would allow me to get all the formals done in about 45 minutes allowing the bridal party to relax a little before the next round of photos at the reception. This was always apprecheated by the briadal party and the clergy.
Bottom line is as the professional photographer it is your responcablity to get all the photos they wanted and to make sure everything goes off on time, work with the DJ or band and the party house so there is never surprises. Remember the couple will most likely never be back but you will be at the church and party house and they will remember you the photographer. If they like you they will work with you.

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

For those that are interested in Ed's response, he's the "rock star" of the wedding forum, and as of late last week, the newest co-admin of the wedding forum as well.

But.....for those that wish to keep disparaging wedding photography, you can just stay in the main section. We do our best to keep things positive, and informative, without being insulting.