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Is my math correct?
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Jan 7, 2017 07:10:47   #
mborn Loc: Massachusetts
 
NikonCharlie wrote:
At 500mm setting the 1.5 would be 750mm. Nikon does not have a 1.5, but a 1.4, which would equate to 700mm if lens is set to 500.
5.6 with 1.4 is f8, 1.7 f10 and 2X is f11


Right on

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Jan 7, 2017 07:36:39   #
jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY
 
jethro779 wrote:
In reading all the posts about tc's the constant is that they change the aperture as well as extend the focal length. This change in focal length is easy to figure, the aperture not so much. A 1.5 tc adds 150mm to the 200-500 f/5.6 Nikon. That is easy to figure. Is the aperture a change from f/5.6 to f/8, or is it actually f/8.4 and the camera just has that much variance in the ability to focus? Does this make the 1.7 tc change the lens to 850mm and f/9.52? and the 2.0 tc 1000mm and f/11.2? Math was not my strong suit in school, getting in trouble and visits to the Principal's office were much easier for me.
In reading all the posts about tc's the constant i... (show quote)


"The teleconverter reduces the maximum aperture of the lens by one stop (1.4x converter), 1.5 stops (1.7x converter) or 2 stops (2x converter). An f/4 lens becomes an f/5.6 lens with a 1.4x mounted. An f/5.6 lens becomes f/8."

Good article -
https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2009/01/teleconverters-101/

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Jan 7, 2017 10:10:41   #
ole sarg Loc: south florida
 
Why does it matter? You are looking through the lens!


melismus wrote:
TC does not add; it multiplies. Your lens becomes 300-750. There is approx. one stop loss, so its max aperture becomes 8.

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Jan 7, 2017 11:38:01   #
John_F Loc: Minneapolis, MN
 
The focal length of a lens is function of the array of spherical surfaces and their radius of curvatures and the spacing of the centers of radii. There are strict mathematical formulae derived in physics of optics books. Those radii of curvature and spacing of the centers will result a number of lens cardinal points: two principal planes and two focal planes. Distances from subject are measured from the front principal plane and distance to image is measured frim the rear principal plane, if you choose to use the lens formula - 1/s + 1/s' = 1/f. If you choose to meaure from the focal planes, then the lens formula is xx' = f^2. The connector between the two is: x + s = f. If the lens surfaces are not perfectly spherical and the centers of curvature are not perfectly co-linear, then you have a cheapie lens and the formulae inexact.

The aperture is just a set of adjustable leaves - set at a very particular location in the lens. It can have no effect whatsoever on focal length. The f-stop is just a measure of aperture diameter relative to focal length: f-stop = f/D.

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Jan 7, 2017 11:42:08   #
Rongnongno Loc: FL
 
John_F wrote:
.../...The aperture is just a set of adjustable leaves - set at a very particular location in the lens. It can have no effect whatsoever on focal length. The f-stop is just a measure of aperture diameter relative to focal length: f-stop = f/D.

You just forgot to mention the 'side effect' which is adjusting the depth of field...

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Jan 7, 2017 12:22:51   #
wingclui44 Loc: CT USA
 
BebuLamar wrote:
The f/number does changes. The aperture diameter doesn't change but the focal length changes so the ratio or the f/number changes. I don't know if the TC can relay that information to the camera.


It does in some of them. Like my Kenko Teleplus Pro 300 DGX 1.4xAF tel-converter.

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Jan 7, 2017 12:24:43   #
whitewolfowner
 
To answer your question. The common teleconverters out there are 1.4, 1.7 and 2.0. The reason is simple because the 1.4 takes away 1 f stop (f2.8 is now f4.0...f5.6 is now f8.0), a 1.7 teleconverter adds 1.5 stops to the lens and and a 2.0 adds two stops to the lens. So no matter what f stop you go on the lens, those factors apply. Many cameras will tell you the accurate f stop in the viewfinder. For the new mm range of the lens multiply the lens mm by the number of the teleconverter. So a 1.4 teleconverter will make a 50mm lens a 70mm lens and a 2.0 will make it a 100mm lens. If you have a zoom, multiply the zoom range at the low and high ends to find the new values; an 80-200mm f2.8 with a 1.4 teleconverter will become a 112 - 280mm f4.0 lens. A 2.0 teleconverter will turn that 80-200 f2.8 into a 160-400m f5.6 lens. Keep in mind that a good 1.4 teleconverter will have very little loss and used with a pro lens will produce professional results. As you increase the teleconveter power, the quality goes down. The results from teleconverters very greatly with lenses used too form lens to lens so do your research before plunging or you could end in your own pew all alone (from your GAS).

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Jan 7, 2017 12:28:04   #
jackpi Loc: Southwest Ohio
 
NikonCharlie wrote:
At 500mm setting the 1.5 would be 750mm. Nikon does not have a 1.5, but a 1.4, which would equate to 700mm if lens is set to 500.
5.6 with 1.4 is f8, 1.7 f10 and 2X is f11

I agree.

It is also important to be aware of the downsides of teleconverters. At f8, your camera may or may not autofocus and, if it does, it may do so only with the central autofocus point (the Nikon D5 and D500 will have a few more central AF points available). It will also be difficult to autofocus with a long focal length lens handheld, because the combination of narrow depth of field combined with slight movement of the lens will cause the lens to continuously hunt for focus. Also note that any teleconverter will cause a 15-25% loss of sharpness on a zoom lens..

If you use a 1.7 or 2.0 TC on anything but a non-zoom lens with a focal length of f4 or less, you will need to manual focus with a tripod.

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Jan 7, 2017 12:38:52   #
amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA
 
jethro779 wrote:
In reading all the posts about tc's the constant is that they change the aperture as well as extend the focal length. This change in focal length is easy to figure, the aperture not so much. A 1.5 tc adds 150mm to the 200-500 f/5.6 Nikon. That is easy to figure. Is the aperture a change from f/5.6 to f/8, or is it actually f/8.4 and the camera just has that much variance in the ability to focus? Does this make the 1.7 tc change the lens to 850mm and f/9.52? and the 2.0 tc 1000mm and f/11.2? Math was not my strong suit in school, getting in trouble and visits to the Principal's office were much easier for me.
In reading all the posts about tc's the constant i... (show quote)


Teleconverters limit the light passing through them. While you gain focal length, you "lose" effective aperture.

First we need to correct your math. No, that 1.5X doesn't just "add 150mm to the 200-500mm Nikkor". Actually, a 1.5X on a 200-500mm zoom lens makes for an effective 300-750mm combo. (200 x 1.5 = 300.... 500 x 1.5 = 750)

But it also changes the effective aperture of the lens, making it smaller...

A more common 1.4X or less common 1.5X teleconverter "costs" one stop of light (an f5.6 lens becomes an f8 lens).

A 2X teleconverter "costs" two stops worth of light (i.e., an f5.6 lens becomes an f11).

1.7X teleconverters are less common, but cost 1.5 stops of light (so an f5.6 lens would become about f9).

This is important particularly because it will effect your camera's ability to autofocus. Most cameras require f8 or better to be able to auto focus in most situations. Go beyond that very much and your AF system will start to struggle and hunt. At some point and under certain lighting conditions it might fail completely.

If using a full frame (FX) camera, one way to get "more reach" without any "light loss penalty" is to get a crop sensor (DX) camera!

If already using a DX camera, well 500mm is an EXTREMELY long focal length on it and maybe you just need to get closer to your subjects!

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Jan 7, 2017 12:58:10   #
John_F Loc: Minneapolis, MN
 
Rongnongno wrote:
You just forgot to mention the 'side effect' which is adjusting the depth of field...


I did not mention DOF as that is an artifact that arises only because the human eye has a limit of resolution which anounts to one arcminute of angle. When the rear lens principal plane is at a specific distance from the sensor plane, there will be one and only one distance from the front principal plane to the in-focus subject. The rest if the so-called DOF is 'tolerably' in focus.

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Jan 7, 2017 13:07:41   #
MtnMan Loc: ID
 
jethro779 wrote:
I was able to math the focal, it was the aperture I was questioning.


The aperture is the hole in the lens the light goes through. It does not change by putting the lens on a different camera with a different size sensor.

But the field of view changes if you put the lens on a camera with a smaller sensor. Thus the use of the term "crop factor" and using it to calculate an "equivalent mm" for the lens with a smaller sensor.

The smaller sensor also yields a larger relative depth of field. You can approximate that by multiplying the f-stop times the crop factor. So a DX cameta at f8 will have a depth of field equivalent to an FX camera at f12 with the same lens and zoom setting.

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Jan 7, 2017 13:14:03   #
Rongnongno Loc: FL
 
John_F wrote:
I did not mention DOF as that is an artifact that arises only because the human eye has a limit of resolution which anounts to one arcminute of angle. When the rear lens principal plane is at a specific distance from the sensor plane, there will be one and only one distance from the front principal plane to the in-focus subject. The rest if the so-called DOF is 'tolerably' in focus.

So irrelevant and of no importance????

Come on now, you are better than that.

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Jan 7, 2017 13:34:29   #
PHRubin Loc: Nashville TN USA
 
Rongnongno wrote:
The lens aperture simply does not change because you place an extender in front of it.

You lose luminosity, gain in lens length but the dof characteristics stay the same. The extender is nothing more than a magnifier.


Really? You don't know what he means? I thought we all agreed to assume the word "effective" or "equivalent in angle of view"!

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Jan 7, 2017 17:18:14   #
Jackdoor Loc: Huddersfield, Yorkshire.
 
John_F wrote:
I did not mention DOF as that is an artifact that arises only because the human eye has a limit of resolution which anounts to one arcminute of angle. When the rear lens principal plane is at a specific distance from the sensor plane, there will be one and only one distance from the front principal plane to the in-focus subject. The rest if the so-called DOF is 'tolerably' in focus.


Agreed that DOF is in effect the range that is tolerably in focus, but that is a feature of the sensory apparatus, and its 'circle of confusion'. Since we're talking cameras and lenses, that means the camera's sensor. Absolutely nothing to do with the human eye, unless discussing direct vision devices such as telescopes, binoculars and microscopes, although then things are confused by the eyes' own focusing abilities.

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