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Oct 25, 2015 08:40:27   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
Deleted.

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Oct 25, 2015 08:46:56   #
BuckeyeBilly Loc: St. Petersburg, FL
 
joer wrote:
I like to review data on prospective camera/lens purchases as part of my evaluation process. I don't rely on this exclusively but it is a major consideration for me.

We have DXOMARK, Senscore, Lenscore and others providing data for sensors and lenses but what about the camera body.

What is lacking is data on camera performance. Things such as auto focus speed and accuracy, buffer size, shot to shot speed, and so on.

Yes some sites get into that detail but it would be valuable to have side by side comparisons.
I like to review data on prospective camera/lens p... (show quote)


Not sure if this is what you're looking for but it comes from DxO. Simply click on each tab (Scores, Specs, Measurements, Lenses Tested) to see the differences.

http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Compare/Side-by-side/Sony-A7R-II-versus-Nikon-D810___1035_963

...or maybe something from these lists:
http://www.whatdigitalcamera.com/roundup/cameracomparison-roundup/nikon-d810-vs-nikon-d800e-vs-sony-alpha-7r-190

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x604D7DUSVU

https://fstoppers.com/originals/fstoppers-reviews-canon-5dsr-sony-a7rii-and-nikon-d810-89896

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Oct 25, 2015 08:54:07   #
jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY
 
joer wrote:
Yes some sites get into that detail but it would be valuable to have side by side comparisons.

This may help.

http://camerasize.com/
http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM
http://snapsort.com/compare
http://www.dpreview.com/products/compare/cameras?utm_campaign=internal-link&utm_source=mainmenu&utm_medium=text&ref=mainmenu
http://www.imaging-resource.com/cameras/compare/

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Oct 25, 2015 08:57:15   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
billnikon wrote:
I am surprised by your question considering you have over 5000 postings. You should know by now that there is no BEST camera, there is only the BEST camera for you. Results from the best camera available will vary on the user, NOT THE CAMERA. You could use a professional golf players clubs and without practice and you would play no better.


Not looking for the best camera, just information.

Tools are important as are the skill to use them. One can build a house with hand tools, but power tools are so much more useful.

When I decide to purchase a camera it will not be based on the opinion of others, but the characteristics that are important to my shooting preferences. Ultimately I live and die by what I know.

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Oct 25, 2015 09:00:45   #
boberic Loc: Quiet Corner, Connecticut. Ex long Islander
 
joer wrote:
I like to review data on prospective camera/lens purchases as part of my evaluation process. I don't rely on this exclusively but it is a major consideration for me.

We have DXOMARK, Senscore, Lenscore and others providing data for sensors and lenses but what about the camera body.

What is lacking is data on camera performance. Things such as auto focus speed and accuracy, buffer size, shot to shot speed, and so on.

Yes some sites get into that detail but it would be valuable to have side by side comparisons.
I like to review data on prospective camera/lens p... (show quote)

IMHOyou should re-examine exactly what you are looking for. If you want to find out if camera maker A's item is better than camera B's of similar prices, unless you take pics of the same scene with the same settings and no pp there is no way to tell. Is Nikon better than Canon ? Truth is I don't think it matters. I made my choice based simply on feel. That's why there are so many posts based on ergonomics as the main choice. You can do the same thing with lenses also. If you constantly go over specs, you will never make a choice, Furthermore whatever choice you finally make you will always be asking your self if I made the right one. Eventually wind up in the funny farm. The old golf saying seems appropriate here. "analyss makes for paralisis" (my spelling is laughable}

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Oct 25, 2015 09:19:57   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
rjaywallace wrote:
DPReview does frequently show actual photos from the cameras they have reviewed. IMO however, DPReview is not an "arms-length" reviewer as they are owned by mega-retailer Amazon. Not clear why Snapsort Camera Comparison does not meet your needs as they offer camera-to-camera comparisons including both stats and general overall observations. I was on the CNET site yesterday. CNET used to be a good source of camera reviews, but they seem to be trying to be All Things To All People and losing their focus on serious photo gear in the process.
DPReview does frequently show actual photos from t... (show quote)


Agree. I liked DPR better when Phil managed it.

Today it's all about where the money is.

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Oct 25, 2015 09:23:24   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 


Thanks Jerry. I totally forgot about Imaging-Resource.

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Oct 25, 2015 09:27:32   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
BuckeyeBilly wrote:
Not sure if this is what you're looking for but it... (show quote)


Thanks Buckeyebilly.

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Oct 25, 2015 09:30:03   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
boberic wrote:
IMHOyou should re-examine exactly what you are looking for. If you want to find out if camera maker A's item is better than camera B's of similar prices, unless you take pics of the same scene with the same settings and no pp there is no way to tell. Is Nikon better than Canon ? Truth is I don't think it matters. I made my choice based simply on feel. That's why there are so many posts based on ergonomics as the main choice. You can do the same thing with lenses also. If you constantly go over specs, you will never make a choice, Furthermore whatever choice you finally make you will always be asking your self if I made the right one. Eventually wind up in the funny farm. The old golf saying seems appropriate here. "analyss makes for paralisis" (my spelling is laughable}
IMHOyou should re-examine exactly what you are loo... (show quote)


Thanks boberic. Failure to act is not one of my many short comings.

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Oct 25, 2015 10:24:50   #
Mark7829 Loc: Calfornia
 
joer wrote:


You're not going to find it. You will need to build this matrix yourself and even then the information will likely conflict, be unreliable and very confusing. Like the this table you posted, the AR7 II is 12 bit compressed but with a recent firmware update will do 14 bit uncompressed but not in continuous or burst mode. The 5 fps reflects the old 12 bit compressed but not 14 bit uncompressed which it can't do in continuous or burst mode. The table lists the Nikon processor as Expeed 4 but none listed for the Sony. Does that matter?

While you can build a listing for comparison and it will never be complete or 100% accurate. Some manufactures just don't provide the same information and mix it with proprietary jargon.

Bottom line, the two cameras you listed are exceptional. There are some obvious differences in mirror vs mirrorless, EVF vs OVF, etc but after that they are relatively the same and will take good images. Another question to ask is how the cameras perform with different lenses. Note, Sony does not make a 800 mm lens. Now try to draw up that matrix to interact with the current matrix and you will come to realize that listing ALL the functions and features is simply a foolish endeavor.

And after you done all of that, you will come to realize that it is not the equipment at all but the photographer that is responsible for making the picture. No camera or lens can displace critical knowledge of light and composition. Now if you can develop that matrix putting two photographers on a table, that would be interesting if not entertaining and you'll need to put in IQ (not image quality but intelligence quotient) into the rubric which would eliminate everyone in these forums including myself for having responded to this post.

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Oct 25, 2015 10:33:34   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
BuckeyeBilly wrote:
Not sure if this is what you're looking for but it... (show quote)


Thanks. Been using measurements on DXO foot quite awhile.

The second link is new to me and interesting.

Reply
 
 
Oct 25, 2015 10:40:02   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
Mark7829 wrote:
You're not going to find it. You will need to build this matrix yourself and even then the information will likely conflict, be unreliable and very confusing. Like the this table you posted, the AR7 II is 12 bit compressed but with a recent firmware update will do 14 bit uncompressed but not in continuous or burst mode. The 5 fps reflects the old 12 bit compressed but not 14 bit uncompressed which it can't do in continuous or burst mode. The table lists the Nikon processor as Expeed 4 but none listed for the Sony. Does that matter?

While you can build a listing for comparison and it will never be complete or 100% accurate. Some manufactures just don't provide the same information and mix it with proprietary jargon.

Bottom line, the two cameras you listed are exceptional. There are some obvious differences in mirror vs mirrorless, EVF vs OVF, etc but after that they are relatively the same and will take good images. Another question to ask is how the cameras perform with different lenses. Note, Sony does not make a 800 mm lens. Now try to draw up that matrix to interact with the current matrix and you will come to realize that listing ALL the functions and features is simply a foolish endeavor.

And after you done all of that, you will come to realize that it is not the equipment at all but the photographer that is responsible for making the picture. No camera or lens can displace critical knowledge of light and composition. Now if you can develop that matrix putting two photographers on a table, that would be interesting if not entertaining and you'll need to put in IQ (not image quality but intelligence quotient) into the rubric which would eliminate everyone in these forums including myself for having responded to this post.
You're not going to find it. You will need to bui... (show quote)


Thanks Mark. Can't dispute most of your response. Of course the photographer is responsible but having the right equipment is indispensable.

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Oct 25, 2015 10:59:26   #
CatMarley Loc: North Carolina
 
billnikon wrote:
I am surprised by your question considering you have over 5000 postings. You should know by now that there is no BEST camera, there is only the BEST camera for you. Results from the best camera available will vary on the user, NOT THE CAMERA. You could use a professional golf players clubs and without practice and you would play no better.


Exactly. And depending on what you do with your camera, each of the parameters (focus speed and accuracy, buffer size, shot to shot speed, and so on) may have a totally different importance to your particular style of photography. I could not care less about the buffer size, for instance, because I shoot individual photos of puppies and kids along with wildlife and landscapes. If I were doing sports, I might care. So who cares what the comparison tests show. The important comparison is what the camera does FOR YOU. Rent cameras, use them and see what they do for you. THAT will be the only comparison that counts. A camera is a TOOL, not a "best" possession in it's own right.

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Oct 25, 2015 11:00:26   #
Mark7829 Loc: Calfornia
 
joer wrote:
Thanks Mark. Can't dispute most of your response. Of course the photographer is responsible but having the right equipment is indispensable.


Yes right is always important - best is not..

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Oct 25, 2015 11:45:38   #
joer Loc: Colorado/Illinois
 
CatMarley wrote:
Exactly. And depending on what you do with your camera, each of the parameters (focus speed and accuracy, buffer size, shot to shot speed, and so on) may have a totally different importance to your particular style of photography. I could not care less about the buffer size, for instance, because I shoot individual photos of puppies and kids along with wildlife and landscapes. If I were doing sports, I might care. So who cares what the comparison tests show. The important comparison is what the camera does FOR YOU. Rent cameras, use them and see what they do for you. THAT will be the only comparison that counts. A camera is a TOOL, not a "best" possession in it's own right.
Exactly. And depending on what you do with your c... (show quote)


Thanks CatMarly.

I got off track due to some of the interesting replies.

I wasn't looking for the best camera, just the best review sites so I can pick and choose a camera when the time is right that has the features most important TO ME.

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