dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl

I am an older photographer (been shooting since 1957) and I got my first digital when they first came out then upgraded to a Nikon D70s (cropped sensor) then to a D7100. The Cropped sensor cameras tend to be lighter, less expensive and yes they do NOT change the focal length but crop the image as you shoot just as it would crop on the enlarger or other post processing but, it DOES give the appearance of increasing the focal length of a lens by 1.6 which in effect is the same as a 1.6 tele-convertor without the loss of f/stop. Is it cheaper than a tele-convertor? No! but it IS compatible with ALL lenses where a tele-converter is not. As I mentioned, many pros carry both for this reason. It is a personal choice, I made mine based on finances and purchased the body that allowed me to have an additional $1000 to purchase lenses. When I get the chance, I WILL buy a full frame camera with the knowledge that all of my lenses will work (even though a few are DX lenses and will only work in crop mode on the FX) but I will also keep my DX camera as it will provide me that great instant extra 1.6 crop in my images. Remember that sometimes, you cant judge the images because they are beyond the lens to see and the 1.6 imaginary magnification can be the difference between getting the shot and not seeing it on a long lens.. a 400mm lens becomes an "apparent 660 mm lens" just by putting it on a camera body that cost you half as much.

Fotomacher Loc: Toronto

Splitting hairs, but Nikon's crop is 1.5 and Canon's is 1.6. Not that it matters since with an optical viewfinder, what you see is what you get (if your body shows 100%) If not, then your back panel shows you what you got. Cheers.

dcampbell52 Loc: Clearwater Fl

True, I was just using his numbers rather than trying to get into the corrections. As stated, the 80-400 mm lens on a 1.5 crop DX camera gives an apparent range of 120-600mm lens and you can see what you are shooting in the viewfinder vs pointing in that direction with an FX camera and hoping to enlarge and crop after the fact. I am not saying that Full Frame is bad, I am just saying that if you are driving a finishing nail you don't usually use a sledge hammer to drive it. DX cameras, like FX cameras have places in shooting. McNally, Mike Coradid, and tons of really good professionals use both as needed.

amehta Loc: Boston

A DX camera isn't needed, or even particularly useful, especially by a professional, if size/weight is not an issue.

Bobspez Loc: Southern NJ, USA

Hi Amehta,
I have to agree that except for magnifying the image in the viewfinder, and perhaps autofocusing an AFS (motor in the lens) lens faster because the image to be focused on appears larger to the sensor, the larger crop factor of a smaller sensor doesn't add anything to the final image. Just about all the tests I have run with cameras using the same lens on different sensors indicates that a cropped image from a larger sensor is every bit as good or better than the equivalent full image from the camera with a smaller sensor and larger crop factor. The cameras range from 10 to 14MP.
Some people are predicting the mirrorless cameras will surpass the FX cameras at some point and maybe they will. But I don't think it has happened yet.
Bob

Bram boy Loc: Vancouver Island B.C. Canada

it's even easier with a fixed lens point an shoot

JD750 Loc: SoCal

Hmm so extending what you say, a FF camera is not useful by a professional who shoots medium format and a medium format camera is not useful by a professional who shoots large format....

:?:

Bram boy Loc: Vancouver Island B.C. Canada

the average person could care less , life is more than a bunch of pixels . and reaching out for more clarity and resolution . a lot of people become obsessed
with there cameras . so much so that's it's not natural . it's nothing more than a black box . that records images , and it's been around for a couple hundered years . it's almost funny reading comments . but in a way, its sad also
is this the meaning of life

Bram boy Loc: Vancouver Island B.C. Canada

:thumbup: right on .

Bram boy Loc: Vancouver Island B.C. Canada

your right there is a lot of gushing and boasting to

amehta Loc: Boston

Is a medium format camera operationally similar to a FF DSLR? Or is a view camera operationally similar to a medium format camera? Of course not. Is the FF operationally similar to the APS-C? Absolutely. That makes the extension completely meaningless.

My point is that there is rarely a reason to have both. There are plenty of people for whom the APS-C (or m4/3) camera is a perfect fit. And there is a smaller group for whom the FF is a good choice. But I think there is little gained by having both.

Bram boy Loc: Vancouver Island B.C. Canada

also that is all they can afford , or not willing so spend $3000 for a camera
and another $2000 or more for a zoom or $4000 for a 400 mm
prime just to take pic of a few birds , a 70-300 mm or a 15-600 mm won't brake the bank . and they will get shots that they couldent with a Dx with a
18- 115 mm or 200 mm. at least it will get them out and about . or is that perceived also .

SonnyE Loc: Communist California, USA

No.

But I am happy.

LaoXiang

After five pages, I realize what I have to do is spend $150 to rent a 6D and a 24-70 lens and actually shoot side by side with my 7D in a low-light setting.

Much thanks to you, Steve Stoneblossom ... I visited the links you suggested and I saw the different numbers, but really, they are just numbers. I need to know what it translated to in images, if I am contemplating spending $1000-$1600 for a refurb or new 6D.

You say you see a "significant difference" ... but whether a significant difference to you is worth $1600 to me, I guess only I can decide. I tried the cheap and lazy route; now I accept that I have to do the work and spend the money and find out.

SonnyE Loc: Communist California, USA

Probably a good idea. We have friends who car shop that way.
They rent a ride and drive it around or take a weekender with it. Then they know for sure if they want to put the cash on the barrel head.
Good luck.