Pedro6

Agree

10MPlayer Loc: California

I agree with this. A photograph is an image made from photons of light reacting with a sensor, either film or digital. An AI image, as mentioned above, can be created from a line or two of text typed into a computer. AI is obviously drawing from millions or billions of photographic images it's been trained on but not one actual photon ever struck on single sensor or film frame to create the image.

UHH needs to come up with a good definition of what a photograph is and it is not if it intends to remain a website for photographers. If not it's going to become a watered down visual graphics site and the whole point of having the site will be lost.

frankraney Loc: Clovis, Ca.

How do you post a painting? Only by photographing or scanning the painting, then uploading the image.

srt101fan

Of course....

JohnSwanda Loc: San Francisco

That is one of those things the rules of the site need to cover - photographs of images done in other mediums. I have seen those posted in Chit Chat.

Horseart Loc: Alabama

I have been asked to show some of my paintings from time to time and although it's a PHOTOGRAPH of a painting, I never know where it may wind up....not that it matters, but it leaves me unsure about where to post it.

frankraney Loc: Clovis, Ca.

Nope.

frankraney Loc: Clovis, Ca.

DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA

With the right software you can ‘paint’ digitally to an image file and post that.

terryMc Loc: Arizona's White Mountains

Six and counting...

R.G. Loc: Scotland

The only time that will get complicated is if we try to be too idealistic about it. Going down that road would involve us excluding anything that didn't fit into a universally agreed upon idealised notion of what a real photograph is. We should be looking to do as little excluding as possible. Put another way, we should be leaning towards being as accommodating as possible, without going so far that the concept of photography becomes meaningless.

It's probably easier and simpler if we start by defining what a photograph is not, which in this case would specifically be images generated from scratch by AI software or computer graphics software. That would mean using the medium of origin as one of the defining factors (but not the only one). In the spirit of keeping things simple, where photographs are concerned we could define the medium of origin as "photographic equipment", which, from a photographer's point of view means cameras, including cameras built into non-camera devices such as phones.

The definition of "photograph" could then realistically include composites (which may or may not include AI generated elements). Photography has a long history of including composites of various types.

Just because a photo has been given some post processing, that needn't mean that we have to stop referring to it as a photo. All photos (digital and analog) have to be given some kind of processing, whether it's in camera or in a computer or a dark room, so the idea that any post processing is a no-no is not realistic.

We would still have to allow for the possibility of photographs being extensively modified. It should be up to the individual to decide whether they felt the need
for disclosure in such matters. The alternative would be to exclude extensively modified photos and then we are left with the problem of where to draw the line.
Those who felt the need for disclosure could refer to such images as "modified photos" which would cover all possibilities.

If someone had the intention of producing a creatively edited image from a photo, the chances are they wouldn't want to refer to it as a photo anyway, so getting precious about such definitions would seem to be futile and trivial.

What's the definition of a photograph? To answer that there are two possibilities - we can be idealistic or we can be realistic. Perhaps to be clear we should specify that we're looking for a working definition. In that context, being realistic would seem to be the better choice. That involves being flexible and accommodating and making sensible assessments. Some people aren't very good at any of those things and they prefer the rigid exclusiveness of idealism. The down side is that being rigid and exclusive is the option that's least likely to produce a working, real world definition.

The possibility of deception will be with us no matter what definitions we choose. For those who feel the need for disclosure there's no problem because there's nothing stopping them. For those who have the intention to deceive, they don't care what the agreed definitions are.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

I noticed...

Artcameraman Loc: Springfield NH

There are some that believe you don't need a camera at all anymore. They believe that graphic arts and AI are all that is required. Stay home in your "jammies" and play on your computer and win all the contest with images that some poor fool took and posted on line without a watermark or © to prevent it from being stolen. But that's me. Cheers.

yssirk123 Loc: New Jersey

For me if the image file was taken with a camera it's a photograph.

srt101fan

Good thoughts and words, R.G. For me, the simplest approach to keeping this a "photography forum", is for Admin to require that all images posted in any of the photography sections of the Forum must have a photograph as a starting point.

What's a photograph? Any image taken with a camera. We all know what a camera is.....? 🤔