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Equivalent focal length - a more correct way to compare
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Mar 30, 2024 13:09:18   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
burkphoto wrote:
I was thinking the same thing. What's important isn't the absolute comparison, but that we each get familiar with the equipment we use and apply it to the task at hand in a satisfying manner.

I use Micro 4/3, which has a nominal 2X magnification factor (not a crop factor, because the lenses are NATIVE to the format, unlike putting a full frame lens on APS-C). But I've used other formats, and understand the lens choices I needed to make for each of them.

In the photo lab where I worked back in the film days, we had equivalence charts that matched focal length and field of view coverage across both film formats and brands of lenses. They were helpful. Also helpful were depth of field indicators on lenses, which have all but disappeared. Now I carry the DOFC (depth of field calculator) app on my phone for the rare instances when I need to be precise.

We worry far too much about finding the perfect camera, lens, brand, format... When simple photographic education and experiences are what we need. I learn more behind the camera or in front of photo software than I do from endless debates about what gizmo is best. The proof is in the photograph.

I cook, and I don't know that anyone has ever asked me what pot or pan I used... Either they like the dish, or they don't.
I was thinking the same thing. What's important is... (show quote)


Well, as long as you brought it up, what gizmo is best?

Just kidding!

---

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Mar 30, 2024 13:32:32   #
a6k Loc: Detroit & Sanibel
 
burkphoto wrote:
I was thinking the same thing. What's important isn't the absolute comparison, but that we each get familiar with the equipment we use and apply it to the task at hand in a satisfying manner.

I use Micro 4/3, which has a nominal 2X magnification factor (not a crop factor, because the lenses are NATIVE to the format, unlike putting a full frame lens on APS-C). But I've used other formats, and understand the lens choices I needed to make for each of them.

In the photo lab where I worked back in the film days, we had equivalence charts that matched focal length and field of view coverage across both film formats and brands of lenses. They were helpful. Also helpful were depth of field indicators on lenses, which have all but disappeared. Now I carry the DOFC (depth of field calculator) app on my phone for the rare instances when I need to be precise.

We worry far too much about finding the perfect camera, lens, brand, format... When simple photographic education and experiences are what we need. I learn more behind the camera or in front of photo software than I do from endless debates about what gizmo is best. The proof is in the photograph.

I cook, and I don't know that anyone has ever asked me what pot or pan I used... Either they like the dish, or they don't.
I was thinking the same thing. What's important is... (show quote)


Well, I agree with almost all of what you said. But if I am cooking (rarely) I try to measure correctly. My wife is a far superior cook and is intuitive in using quantities. I try to substitute knowledge where my intuitive skills are second rate. Analogy ICYMI.

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Mar 30, 2024 14:36:41   #
Imagemine Loc: St. Louis USA
 
In my humble opinion, being a street photographer zone focus is a skill that requires practice. This is more important than focal length. I think focal is more of personal preference. Sharpness is more of what you want to say!

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Mar 30, 2024 15:29:26   #
Real Nikon Lover Loc: Simi Valley, CA
 
Math was never my strong suit. However after reading this thread, I know that I could have driven to the target zone, set my camera up for optimal ISO, WB and SS, taken a series of photos and driven back home downloaded my digital images, selected best one, cropped to taste and processed to rich color array from RAW file and sent to the printer. The beauty is this thread would still be going on.

BTW the most important point made in this thread thus far, goes to User ID's meme of men's discussion of length.

That post caused a spray of coffee about 35mm focal length using FF camera.

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Mar 30, 2024 15:42:06   #
Imagemine Loc: St. Louis USA
 
đź‘Ť

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Mar 30, 2024 15:49:53   #
User ID
 
Imagemine wrote:
In my humble opinion, being a street photographer zone focus is a skill that requires practice. This is more important than focal length. I think focal is more of personal preference. Sharpness is more of what you want to say!

I sometimes use an actually purpose built FF "street lens". Its made for zone focus, having three click detents in its focus rotation plus its an odd FL for extra DoF, and acoarst it has no fast wide apertures.

I think they made the odd FL just to confound those who live by the rote edict of their gurus. If the guru says you need a 35 or maybe a 28 or 24, this is none of those ... really just to be ornery, or so it seems.

Its FL is the "standard normal" for an entirely other format than what this ones built for. Im sure they did that just to muddy the waters against those who "need" to know equivalent FLs before they can aim a lens at a scene.

This lens doesnt claim "premium optics" or "classic rendering", and its kinda uglee and expensive. I use it cuz I like its atteetood !

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Mar 30, 2024 17:01:40   #
Bruce T Loc: Michigan
 
But depth of field is important. If you want a very shallow depth of field, you need a fast lens…f/1.2,f/1.4. If you want everything in focus you can use a f2/8 or f/5.6 lens and set it at f/8 for your shot.

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Mar 30, 2024 17:11:16   #
Bruce T Loc: Michigan
 
I don’t understand your question. A standard for pixels per mm for the sensor….that why one camera is 20MP or 24.2MP or 45MP or 65Mp. If we had the same pixels per mm on all cameras, then only need one camera for everyone….unless the manufacturer installed other options like IBIS.

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Mar 30, 2024 17:38:28   #
a6k Loc: Detroit & Sanibel
 
imagemeister wrote:
All I know is the entertainment value of this post far outweighs any practical value it may have !

Yes, that it does, for me.

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Mar 30, 2024 18:07:19   #
frankraney Loc: Clovis, Ca.
 
Bruce T wrote:
I don’t understand your question. A standard for pixels per mm for the sensor….that why one camera is 20MP or 24.2MP or 45MP or 65Mp. If we had the same pixels per mm on all cameras, then only need one camera for everyone….unless the manufacturer installed other options like IBIS.


Your reply is also hard to understand. Use quote reply as I did here and it would make it easier.

I think this is what you are trying to say...........Pixels are not all the same size. Sensors are different sizes, and so are the pixels that collect light. For instance, a crop sensor is about half as large (48%) as a full-frame sensor on a mirrorless or DSLR camera.

So, even though both a crop sensor and a full-frame sensor have 24 million pixels, the pixels are not the same size. Each pixel on the crop sensor is smaller than a pixel on a full-frame sensor.

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Mar 30, 2024 20:13:46   #
User ID
 
Bruce T wrote:
But depth of field is important. If you want a very shallow depth of field, you need a fast lens…f/1.2,f/1.4. If you want everything in focus you can use a f2/8 or f/5.6 lens and set it at f/8 for your shot.

Just what is it that you are attempting to say ?
None of it holds up viewed against experience.

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Mar 30, 2024 20:56:20   #
OldCADuser Loc: Irvine, CA
 
Longshadow wrote:
"Standard" focal length on a 35mm was selected as 50mm. It makes something that is 20 feet away in real life look 20 feet away in the picture. Little or no subject magnification (positive or negative)...


I always understood that the 'standard' 35mm camera lens was closer to 45mm, meaning that most all 35mm SLR's of the era (the 1960's thru the 1990's) were using slightly telephoto lens as their 'standard' kit lens. I know that my Minolta SR-1 came with a 55mm lens, while my Minolta SRT-101 came with a 58mm kit lens. Later when I got my Minolta XG-M, it came with a 50mm lens, which by then had been decreed as the de-facto 'standard' lens. Note that my first 35mm camera, which I used back in high school, was a AGFA Silette, rangefinder camera with a 45mm lens.

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Mar 30, 2024 23:19:06   #
User ID
 
OldCADuser wrote:
I always understood that the 'standard' 35mm camera lens was closer to 45mm, meaning that most all 35mm SLR's of the era (the 1960's thru the 1990's) were using slightly telephoto lens as their 'standard' kit lens. I know that my Minolta SR-1 came with a 55mm lens, while my Minolta SRT-101 came with a 58mm kit lens. Later when I got my Minolta XG-M, it came with a 50mm lens, which by then had been decreed as the de-facto 'standard' lens. Note that my first 35mm camera, which I used back in high school, was a AGFA Silette, rangefinder camera with a 45mm lens.
I always understood that the 'standard' 35mm camer... (show quote)

Those are verrrrrry important distinctions.

Most folks think that just cuz millimeters are named "millimeters" that they must be very small in insignificant. But, just think of what happens when you put five of them together !

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Mar 31, 2024 00:08:10   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
a6k wrote:
Well, I agree with almost all of what you said. But if I am cooking (rarely) I try to measure correctly. My wife is a far superior cook and is intuitive in using quantities. I try to substitute knowledge where my intuitive skills are second rate. Analogy ICYMI.


Recipes are starting points. Experience programs that intuition. Good cooks compensate for ingredients — fresh vs frozen, fresh vs dried spices, sea level vs cooking at 10,000 feet, etc. They taste as they go, seasoning to taste.

Gear matters, but far less than knowledge and experience. If you're new to photography, get out there and make images!

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Mar 31, 2024 01:34:21   #
SuperflyTNT Loc: Manassas VA
 
EJMcD wrote:
SuperflyTNT vs User ID...now that's entertainment!


I have no issue with User ID. He made a valid point. Jeez. I guess that means he’s also ignoring UHH sacred traditions.

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