Ugly Hedgehog - Photography Forum
Home Active Topics Newest Pictures Search Login Register
Main Photography Discussion
Rant for all Eternity — Did you read it?
Page <<first <prev 13 of 17 next> last>>
Jan 25, 2024 09:04:29   #
DaveyDitzer Loc: Western PA
 
[quote=burkphoto. (Why are so many car dealers terrible salespeople?)[/quote]

It's all about the cost to the dealer and incentives to the sales force (move the metal!). The sales manager is trying to get rid of slow moving inventory at the highest markup he or she can get away with. End of the month mfr. incentives also motivate the sales manager. Usually the sales people are paid very little or not at all so the cost to the dealer is low and the strife between sales people can be brutal. I just control the conversation and focus on what I want to know.

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 09:20:41   #
jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY
 
Very good!

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 11:33:07   #
pdsdville Loc: Midlothian, Tx
 
I guess I'm a little on the Geek side. I've had four Sony DSLR's and two SLT's over the years and have read the manual that came with the camera if there was one and purchased several on the open market. I'm look at three right now that are over an inch thick and I've read them from cover to cover and still go back and read various sections when the need arises. I believe that if you don't know your camera, all you do is take snapshots.

Reply
 
 
Jan 25, 2024 12:09:21   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
burkphoto wrote:
The finance guys are the worst. They're sharks who want to sell you loans with outrageous rates, or add-on warranties that cost a fortune, or service plans that are overpriced. I buy Toyota products, and I have good credit, so I negotiate the rate down, skip the warranties, and take my car to an independent garage...

Some people pay 20% more for their cars than they have to.


I was ready to write a check. I wound up with a Hyundai Tucson Limited. It has a 5 year bumper to bumper w/ 10 year drive train warranty. The drive train is US built and overall it is 50% US, built in Alabama.

The technology is amazing. I don't know how new it is, but more than I ever had. A great safety feature, any movement in the back if you lock the car and walk away sets off an alarm. No babies left behind.

---

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 13:03:27   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
Thorny Devil wrote:
…it was not what I wrote, it was what I didn't write that determined a satisfactory result or otherwise…


I know that one well. I created primarily technical, procedural, software, photography, and field operations training materials, but worked for a training director who was sales oriented. It was a constant battle to convince him I was right to include detail he wanted to leave out.

My favorite "attaboy" of all time, one that calmed down my director and gave him a reality check, came from a territory manager in upstate New York. She said, "Man, Bill, the volume of your training kit is intimidating at first, but it really isn't. Once we dug into it, we learned there is no fluff. It's all important. The quality of our work and our efficiency improved immediately after we trained the staff this year."

Paranoia about leaving out important details is a virtue. Make things as simple as possible, but no simpler.

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 13:15:47   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
DaveyDitzer wrote:
It's all about the cost to the dealer and incentives to the sales force (move the metal!). The sales manager is trying to get rid of slow moving inventory at the highest markup he or she can get away with. End of the month mfr. incentives also motivate the sales manager. Usually the sales people are paid very little or not at all so the cost to the dealer is low and the strife between sales people can be brutal. I just control the conversation and focus on what I want to know.


Part of my role in training was to train salespeople. We taught a consultative sales system from Achieve Global, called Professional Selling Skills. The essence of PSS was research — understanding a client's circumstances, wants, needs, hopes, dreams, and desires, and then catering a targeted palette of product features and benefits specifically to those circumstances and motivations. It put the emphasis on solving problems, providing solutions, making the client's life easier, and getting on the same side of the table to push problems off the other side.

Car salespeople have always seemed to be about what THEY want. They tend to use fear to get it. That's incredibly offensive to me. If I want a Prius, don't try to interest me in a Tundra pickup. Show me the friggin' Prius and be done with it. I'll rent the truck on the five or six days in ten years when I need it.

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 13:44:51   #
Bohica Loc: SE Coast of NC
 
jlg1000 wrote:
I am an Engineer.
So much of my time is spent reading manuals, just checked and my collection is north of 11.000 (pdf + scanned) ones. I select equipment and components to be purchased this way.

My advice is read the manuals *before* you buy the gadget.

It serves two purposes:
1) to help you choose exactly what piece of equipment you really want to buy.
2) it help you start using the equipment quicker, because you already know how to use it.


Besides... reading manuals is a kind of art. You learn how to do it in an efficient manner. Sometimes I read a 1.000 pages manual in one or two days... because I already know 90% of what's in there anyway.
I am an Engineer. br So much of my time is spent r... (show quote)

I always look up the manual before I buy, doesn' always make it easier to understand

Reply
 
 
Jan 25, 2024 14:16:17   #
twb930s Loc: Aldie, Virginia
 
burkphoto wrote:
Taking responsibility for what we buy and use is, apparently, a controversial concept. Over the ten years or so I've been on UHH, and the 50 years of my "aware" life before that, I've noticed that a large number of people seem to gloss over the fact that technology is complex. They buy things that they think they want, but they don't do their research in advance, to be sure that THEY and their new devices, are compatible with what they want to do. They yank them out of the box, plug them in, turn them on, and get disappointed.

"Ready? FIRE!! (Uh, Aim, maybe? You just took out the neighbor's flower pot…)"

We're living in an age where our technical tools are not like hammers and screwdrivers, which are easily mastered by third graders. When you buy a hammer or screwdriver, it doesn't come with a manual, because it doesn't need one. It has a fairly singular purpose and a well-known and understood method of use. But technical gear — cameras, audio, video, computers, and cars — is different. These and many other tools and toys require serious consideration before buying, and serious study before use… IF we are going to get our money's worth from them.

Those of us who write user guides and technical manuals for products and software are usually the first to test the usability and viability of the product. If even the smallest detail doesn't work for us, we explain the issues we find to the product development team AND their directors. Making operation EASY for the customer IS HARD WORK for developers, engineers, and product design staff. It's just as difficult for trainers and training content developers.

One of the unfortunate assumptions companies make about their products is that customers WILL READ the documentation that explains proper use and care. Yet surveys have shown that up to 78% of customers never read it. Many users don't want anything to do with an 830+ page camera manual, or even any sort of a 20 page "Quick Start" guide.

I get all of that, but I also know from hiring many people in a photo lab — and from training school portrait photographers, office staff, and sales people — that understanding and mastering technology requires some quality time, focus, and a certain level of detail orientation. Patience with the documentation and with the entire learning process is usually rewarded with great results and long, trouble-free product life.

There is an old acronym that floated around the Internet BEFORE 1993, when the World Wide Web was born: 'R.T.F.M.' When users got stuck, and posted questions on a bulletin board forum for the tech support staff, the POLITE response was often, "Well, did you read the manual?" Soon enough, that got shortened to the acronym.

"Read The *Fine* Manual!" is the polite version of the acronym. After the tenth or eleventh call from the same user, with the same question, the tech support person would hang up the phone after a call, and yell into a paper bag, substituting whatever 'F' word suited his/her mood.

So here's my simple request to the universe of tech purchasers. Please read the documentation that comes with your purchase, or that you can download from the manufacturer's website at no additional cost. You will learn things you can do with your device that you never thought possible. You will avoid pitfalls that cause 80% of the issues people have with their devices. You will get more done, in less time, with better outcomes! You will trust the maker of the product more, because you understand what they do and don't expect you to do with their devices.

ESPECIALLY if you have used another brand of product in the same class, you need to read the manual just to UNLEARN how your old device of another brand worked. Don't expect brand L to work like brand N. Don't expect brand F to work like brand T. Terminology may be different, control placement may be different, and the way some of the functions work almost certainly will be different.

Don't try to make a Ford drive like a Toyota. It will just annoy you. Don't try to make a Windows PC work like a Mac. It will just frustrate you. They are different brands with different design philosophies and result from different ways of thinking about the same tasks. Take them for what they ARE, not for what they are not.

A little reading won't kill you. Operation may not be obvious, even when you think it should be. There's a reason for everything, and you need to know what it is, if you are going to get along with your new device. Read the freaking manual, and get your money's worth.
Taking responsibility for what we buy and use is, ... (show quote)


Very interesting and factual. Compare the manual that came with my 1967 Nikon F to the one that came with my D-750. Have I read the whole manual? HA! But I did read most of David Busch’s manual for the camera and I think it is even larger.

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 14:26:52   #
Mduffy910 Loc: Michigan
 
My family used to laugh at me cuz I always wanted to read the manual or instructions first. Unfortunately I think I grew out of that because most real manuals are, as you eluded to, "long" and somewhat tedious to wade through. I agree we do need to go back to what the manufacturer worked so diligently on, read it, and use it.

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 14:28:09   #
Mduffy910 Loc: Michigan
 
True about glassy eyed....lol

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 15:02:32   #
DICK32
 
E.L.. Shapiro wrote:
In days of old when knights were bold...photoghay was practiced by few. When a late image formed on some coated plate, it had to be "developed" in a dark place with toxic metals and gasses, pungent, often deadly chemicals- not fothe average civilian! Perhaps it was thought of as some sort of witchcraft carried on by my mad scientist or wizard in cave-like places.

Then came old George Eastman (well after Deguerre and Nepeace) who sold folks simple box cameras with film and said these immortal words "push the button and leave the rest to us" or something like that- or was that Grayhoud, the bus folks who said 'leave the driving to us"? Well, y'all know waht I mean.

The "brownie" was very basic but as more folks became photo enthusiasts and pros, more complicated and adjustable cameras were designed proliferated, and sold tothe masses. Some folks wanted to do their own "driving" so they constructed darkrooms and processed and printed their own images. This went on for a very long time in both the consumer and professional worlds- things evolved

Serious photoghaer had to master various skills as to exposure, focus, depth of fielild or lack thereof, and all that good stuff. Exposure meters were popular. Then, meters were built into cameras. And the various basics- exposure, focus, etc. became automated. Nontheless, if your camera had an adjustable shutter, aperture, and a mechanism for focusing, and you knew about the basic triangle that governs their usage and how they interface for various effects- you were good to go. A little manual, a little auto, and a few cool gadgets- take your pick and do your thing.

Are we moving "forward" to digital photography or in a way moving backward? The Great Yellow Spirit of Rocherst is no longer with us - Kodak ain't what used to be but, has Gorige's ghost come to haunt us. Nowadays it's "press the button and leave the PHOTOGRAPHY to ME says your camera and if you want anything to say about it, you better read MY 300-page manual and figure out how to override my decisions"!

Alright, excuse the hyperbole! But I have reasons. In my days as a wedding and press photographer, we took every precaution to prevent accidental mis-settings. As soon as the press cameras came with front-end leaf shutters we all removed the rear end focal plane shutters to avoid possible activation. We screwed down the M-X Synch switch to X and any other switch, adjustment, or lever that could cause serious problems. We didn't want to miss vital shots because of all these possible glitches. KISS was the acronym.

Then came the day when I realized that my studio would need to go digital. I tested a few NEW and popular models and was horrified. One camera REFUSED to shoot if IT thought the exposure was off. The data in the viewfinder looks more like the flight deck of a jet aircraft. There were little batons all over the thing that could set the entire system off in another direction. The menu- forgetabout! Yes- I know, I can shut most of that stuff
off but I PAID for all of it. And...if I'd accidently pulled the wrong switch the robotic monster would come back from the dead.An accident waiting to happen! The first thing I did was go out and buy a digital conversion foty studio camer for ase I- $$$ just to keep things simple.

Years have passed and today I am well-steeped in too much technology. I am still a bit reactionary when it comes to gear. The new Nikon digital model looks like an F-series body but is a modern mirrorless camera, that appeals to me- I like dials.

I do read manuals- thoroughly. I will try to secure a manual even before I make a major camera purchase. Some seem to be written a secret code and a few are poorly translated from the language spoken in the place they were made. You have got to do the homework or you can always neglect the manual and then post on UHH and ask waht you did wrong and start a 12-page argument!

8:15 PM 2024/23/01 Rant (2) Over!
In days of old when knights were bold...photoghay ... (show quote)

I want to thank burkphoto for his raising this issue--that mastering technology isn't easy. And thanks to E. L. Shapino and others for their insights. But I would also like to point out that inventing camera equipment isn't easy.
my grandfather worked for Thomas Edison, Henry Ford and worked with Nicola Tesla. George Eastman came to Thomas Edison and asked him to help develop a better camera. Kodak's Customers had to send in their camera back to Kodak develop the pictures. So Edison punched holes in the film so it could be indexed and developed the sprocket system to uniformly advance the film. Edison went on to develop the motion picture technology. He developed and patented the phonograph when he was deaf in one ear and partially in the other ear. He had to depend on his technicians to tell him if the products worked, He has the most US patents--1093 of any individual.

The point is that the folks inventing the new camera products are making stuff that even they may not know what the best way to use this stuff is. So it is up to us to figure out what the best way is to use our cameras.

Reply
 
 
Jan 25, 2024 15:15:11   #
HRoss Loc: Longmont, CO
 
I couldn't agree more.

One additional thought, and I will use my iPhone as an example. When a company has you install an update to their OS, there should be a link, at restart, that forces one to learn all the changes that were made. I find it infuriating when some focus group drove the manufacturer to change a simple design into something the group thinks is "cooler" or more visually impressive. Often this results in a loss of functional simplicity and this demands a relearning of the task to fit the new design.

We used to have an old expression: if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

I guess this also is too much work.

Nice rant!!

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 22:57:13   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
bikinkawboy wrote:
... If they don’t understand what’s going on they will never catch a mistake caused by the wrong keystroke or decimal point in the wrong place. Many of those mistakes either cost someone big bucks to fix or can imperil the lives of folks living downstream of a large dam.

But yes, attention spans seem to get shorter and shorter as time passes. Once one cocky young buck told me, “I don’t wanna know why, just tell me the number to enter.” Needless to say he ended up working somewhere else.
... If they don’t understand what’s going on they ... (show quote)
Truths of modern times. And I will add that software does not always provide the right answer. Sanity checking is always required.

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 22:59:36   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
pdsdville wrote:
I guess I'm a little on the Geek side. I've had four Sony DSLR's and two SLT's over the years and have read the manual that came with the camera if there was one and purchased several on the open market. I'm look at three right now that are over an inch thick and I've read them from cover to cover and still go back and read various sections when the need arises. I believe that if you don't know your camera, all you do is take snapshots.
What is an SLT?

Reply
Jan 25, 2024 23:01:30   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
HRoss wrote:
I couldn't agree more.

One additional thought, and I will use my iPhone as an example. When a company has you install an update to their OS, there should be a link, at restart, that forces one to learn all the changes that were made. I find it infuriating when some focus group drove the manufacturer to change a simple design into something the group thinks is "cooler" or more visually impressive. Often this results in a loss of functional simplicity and this demands a relearning of the task to fit the new design.

We used to have an old expression: if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

I guess this also is too much work.

Nice rant!!
I couldn't agree more. br br One additional thou... (show quote)
Totally agree. I think that there should be a law, software updates, except for security updates, must be optional. And in that law there are significant $ penalties for companies who try to sneak functional updates under the guise of security. "That's not funny".

Reply
Page <<first <prev 13 of 17 next> last>>
If you want to reply, then register here. Registration is free and your account is created instantly, so you can post right away.
Main Photography Discussion
UglyHedgehog.com - Forum
Copyright 2011-2024 Ugly Hedgehog, Inc.